Kveik yeast - high fermentation temperatures

[MikeBusby]

I have been reading up about the Kveik yeast and the optimum fermentation temperatures of 35-40C. I am going to struggle to achieve those temperatures in my normal fermentation bin, but I do use a Brewster Beacon 40. Is there any reason why I couldn’t chill the wort to that temperature and pitch the yeast in this unit?

 

[BradleyW]

I'm still a newcomer to this brewing lark but the last 2 batches I've done have been with kveik and I chilled the wort to 30°, pitched and then left it at room temperature (I have no temp control) and they've both turned out quite well. So in my experience yes you can do what you're thinking of doing.

 

[Zephyr259]

Some (most?) also work well cooler, just a bit slower, so you should be fine if it drifts down a bit. How are you heating your FV normally? I used both my heat mats in a fridge when I wanted over 30c.

 

[jceg316]

What strain of kveik are thinking of using? Some won't ferment at room temperature, but more likely they will ferment a lot slower.

It's very common to chill the wort to pitching temp, transfer to FV then ferment. Wrap the fermenter in sleeping bags, jumpers etc.

 

[MikeBusby]

I have now bitten the bullet and bought a Ferminator. First fermination is on the go and seems to be working well. As a result, I should have no problems fermenting at higher (or even, lower) temperatures. I could be ready to give kveik a go now.

 

[Sadfield]

I suspect that as long as the pitch temperature is high enough, which is an easy thing to achieve coming out of the kettle, then they should cope without any temperature control. As they probably have done for hundreds of years being used in Scandinavian farmhouses, sheds etc.

There are a couple of kveiks that have lower pitch/fermentation temps. I'm currently using Ebbergarden which is recommended at 25°c.

 

[jceg316]

I suspect that as long as the pitch temperature is high enough, which is an easy thing to achieve coming out of the kettle, then they should cope without any temperature control. As they probably have done for hundreds of years being used in Scandinavian farmhouses, sheds etc.

There are a couple of kveiks that have lower pitch/fermentation temps. I'm currently using Ebbergarden which is recommended at 25°c.

Are you using the farmhouse strain?

 

[Sadfield]

Are you using the farmhouse strain?

I'm not entirely sure, it was from yeasterbunny and looks like dried flakes from top cropping, rather than commercial wet yeast.

 

[jceg316]

I'm not entirely sure, it was from yeasterbunny and looks like dried flakes from top cropping, rather than commercial wet yeast.

Yes it is! I've used that yeast quite a lot, I've found it much better at warmer temperatures. I think it's something like 5 strains of sacc and 2 strains of lacto, at 35°C it creates a hugely tropical sour beer. I've fermented at 25°C as well for a gose with ~10IBU. The flavour and sourness of the yeast was a lot more subtle, some acidity which works for a gose.

I'm gonna start looking for a similar kveik but without the lacto. Would love to get those sorts of tropical flavours.

 

[Sadfield]

Yes it is! I've used that yeast quite a lot, I've found it much better at warmer temperatures. I think it's something like 5 strains of sacc and 2 strains of lacto, at 35°C it creates a hugely tropical sour beer. I've fermented at 25°C as well for a gose with ~10IBU. The flavour and sourness of the yeast was a lot more subtle, some acidity which works for a gose.

I'm gonna start looking for a similar kveik but without the lacto. Would love to get those sorts of tropical flavours.

That's interesting to know for future brews. I've not used it much yet, and usually with 20-25 ibus first wort hopping, so pretty much put the lacto out of action. I'm going concentrate on boiled, strong, malty Norwegian Farmhouse beers at the moment and seeing how it handles smoked malt. I've a slightly smoked lager type beer fermenting with it currently.

 

[jceg316]

That's interesting to know for future brews. I've not used it much yet, and usually with 20-25 ibus first wort hopping, so pretty much put the lacto out of action. I'm going concentrate on boiled, strong, malty Norwegian Farmhouse beers at the moment and seeing how it handles smoked malt. I've a slightly smoked lager type beer fermenting with it currently.

That sounds good, I'd be interested to hear how it comes out. Have you read Historical Brewing Techniques by Lars Marius Garshol?

 

[Sadfield]

That sounds good, I'd be interested to hear how it comes out. Have you read Historical Brewing Techniques by Lars Marius Garshol?

Yes, great isn't it?

 

[jceg316]

Yes, great isn't it?

Yeah, definitely one of my favourite brewing books! It really taught me the depth of brewing and how these historical methods make hugely different beers.

 

[Arcs]

Drunkula has had some results with those temps. But I tend to find that my harvested kveik doesn't seem to kick in until the 31 c mark and really kicks off at 28 C. Dunno, just might be my environment.

 

[jceg316]

Drunkula has had some results with those temps. But I tend to find that my harvested kveik doesn't seem to kick in until the 31 c mark and really kicks off at 28 C. Dunno, just might be my environment.

Do you top crop or bottom harvest? (A personal question perhaps .) Whilst each yeast has its harvesting preference according to the Farmhouse Yeast Registry, I've also heard it's best to top crop all strains. Because a lot of farmhouse versions contain >1 sacc strain top cropping helps keep the ratio of yeasts in balance, whereas bottom harvesting throws the balance. I'm wondering if this could affect the strain which can ferment at cooler temperatures?

 

[BradleyW]

Do you top crop or bottom harvest? (A personal question perhaps .) Whilst each yeast has its harvesting preference according to the Farmhouse Yeast Registry, I've also heard it's best to top crop all strains. Because a lot of farmhouse versions contain >1 sacc strain top cropping helps keep the ratio of yeasts in balance, whereas bottom harvesting throws the balance. I'm wondering if this could affect the strain which can ferment at cooler temperatures?

Eeeek I've bottom harvested mine!!! Might have to change tactics on the next brew.

 

[MikeBusby]

I have read that the higher fermenting temperatures of kveik can create an orange flavour. I am using kveik voss this weekend on a hefeweizen, so I am quite happy to get that flavour as part of the deal.

I have a Ferminator so can easily achieve the higher fermenting temperatures. However, I am considering just cooling the wort to about 40C and pitching, and then letting the heat generated by the fast fermentation to keep it at that high temperature. Seems pointless using the Ferminator if I don’t have to. Do you think that it will hold it at that high temperature?

 

[Drunkula]

I am using kveik voss this weekend on a hefeweizen, so I am quite happy to get that flavour as part of the deal.

If you want it to stay as a heff use cml gretel, or less estery cml kristalweizen. I've tested them both at 35c and they both work great. Voss as the same temperature will rob all the grain characteristics out from the beer. I eventually really liked the 'drink' that voss made but it's not what I could recognise as beer. And brewing at 35c for me was an absolute waste of flavour and aroma hops. I'd move anything into the dry hop now.

I need to try voss again on a small batch somewhere around 27c to see if there's a mid-ground.

 

[Benfleet Brewery]

Hi. I have a Voss Kveik beer in the FV that I’ve just started to cold crash. Mark K’s Brewdays

 

[MikeBusby]

If you want it to stay as a heff use cml gretel, or less estery cml kristalweizen. I've tested them both at 35c and they both work great. Voss as the same temperature will rob all the grain characteristics out from the beer. I eventually really liked the 'drink' that voss made but it's not what I could recognise as beer. And brewing at 35c for me was an absolute waste of flavour and aroma hops. I'd move anything into the dry hop now.

I need to try voss again on a small batch somewhere around 27c to see if there's a mid-ground.

Do you think the problem with kveik voss and hefeweizen is the strain of kveik used, or the high temperature of the fermentation? Do you think that Voss would be OK if I fermented at a lower temperature?