Klarstein Mundschenk stuck mash problems

[Bristol]

Hi all, I have a klarstein mundschenk 30l all in one system that I'm having trouble with the mash compacting so badly the wort is almost cold by the time I've sparged.

I'm wondering if anyone has any technique tips to stop this. I've tried not putting the top plate on but all that happened then was it compacted anyway and when I wasn't looking grain started going through the overflow. I've tried stiring the mash occasionally but that also seems to allow too much through the mesh into the wort. I've tried slowing the pump but eventually it's pretty obvious there's almost no flow through the grain and it just ends up overflowing again or worse running the bottom dry.

I'm aware of using rice hulls which I will order for my next batch but I'm not sure how much of them to use.

So any general tips on mashing in etc are welcome

 

[fluketamer]

this thread has some good tips:

https://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/threads/klarstein-mundschenk.101138/page-14#post-1259991

a few things:

1 too fine a grind can be an issue.
2 rice husks help but are not needed.
3 lose the top plate. and get a longer return tube
4 i under let by putting grain in basket first then lowering it into the kettle.
5) shake the tun to get the finer flour to the bottom then put it baack in top before underletting.
6) stir a few times for the first 20 or 30 mins.
7) i added a sight tube to the ball valve in order to see the level of wort underneath the tun so i can slow the pump as needed to keep a decent amount of wort on the burner


dont worry about getting bits into the overflow the pump will bring them back up over the grain bed .

these systems make great wort
good luck

 

[RoomWithABrew]

Crush of grain bill is major factor.
Too fine is a swine!

Makeup of grain bill as well, flaked oats, barley, wheat all will slow your sparge.

How does the mash recirculate? You mention difficult sparge but the mash?

Lifting the maltpipe rapidly can exacerbate grain bed compaction.
Do a mashout.

Probably no access to glucanase but I use this takes up no volume in the kettle.

You could consider a B glucan rest in your mash profile.

Sub malted oats for flaked oats.

 

[Appleton Brews]

I have one and you need to do the following
1. 3/1 mash water to grain weight plus 7 litres below the bottom plate, so for 5kg of grain 15+7 litres =22 litres.
2. No top plate and leave plastic end cap on return pipe.
3. Reduce the recirculating flow with the valve as the pump is sucking the water and compressing the grain bet.
4. Stir the mash every 10-15 minutes throughout the mash.

If you run the pump at full whack and let the wort return down the return pipe it compresses the grain bed.
Grain crush is irrelevant, rice hulls are not needed unless you have a lot of rye malt or adjuncts. Flow rate is the key and stirring are the key.

 

[foxy]

Hi all, I have a klarstein mundschenk 30l all in one system that I'm having trouble with the mash compacting so badly the wort is almost cold by the time I've sparged.

I'm wondering if anyone has any technique tips to stop this. I've tried not putting the top plate on but all that happened then was it compacted anyway and when I wasn't looking grain started going through the overflow. I've tried stiring the mash occasionally but that also seems to allow too much through the mesh into the wort. I've tried slowing the pump but eventually it's pretty obvious there's almost no flow through the grain and it just ends up overflowing again or worse running the bottom dry.

I'm aware of using rice hulls which I will order for my next batch but I'm not sure how much of them to use.

So any general tips on mashing in etc are welcome

A more fluid mash is the answer, and you will also get better efficiency. Not sure what the volume is on yours when you say 30 litre, I bought mine as a 40 litre. For 6 kg of grain I use 34 litres of liquor and delete the sparge.

 

[Appleton Brews]

Brew today
No top plate, end cap on return pipe and reduced flow from pump.

 

[Appleton Brews]

Now on the boil. 30 litres for mash and sparge 27 litre in the boil. Usually loose 4 litres so ok.

 

[RoomWithABrew]

@foxy

Which efficiency?

 

[Bristol]

this thread has some good tips:

https://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/threads/klarstein-mundschenk.101138/page-14#post-1259991

a few things:

1 too fine a grind can be an issue.
2 rice husks help but are not needed.
3 lose the top plate. and get a longer return tube
4 i under let by putting grain in basket first then lowering it into the kettle.
5) shake the tun to get the finer flour to the bottom then put it baack in top before underletting.
6) stir a few times for the first 20 or 30 mins.
7) i added a sight tube to the ball valve in order to see the level of wort underneath the tun so i can slow the pump as needed to keep a decent amount of wort on the burner


dont worry about getting bits into the overflow the pump will bring them back up over the grain bed .

these systems make great wort
good luck

Thanks for the link, some good ideas indeed. I think I'll try the under letting for my next batch, I might even try heating the water in the sparge heater and filling the klarstein through the tap so it fills from the bottom with the basket in place.

For 5 are you effectively using the grain basket as a sieve? Into a bucket or something then putting the fine back on top?

 

[Bristol]

I have one and you need to do the following
1. 3/1 mash water to grain weight plus 7 litres below the bottom plate, so for 5kg of grain 15+7 litres =22 litres.
2. No top plate and leave plastic end cap on return pipe.
3. Reduce the recirculating flow with the valve as the pump is sucking the water and compressing the grain bet.
4. Stir the mash every 10-15 minutes throughout the mash.

If you run the pump at full whack and let the wort return down the return pipe it compresses the grain bed.
Grain crush is irrelevant, rice hulls are not needed unless you have a lot of rye malt or adjuncts. Flow rate is the key and stirring are the key.

Thanks, the batch I did on Saturday I used 2.5l/kg which is possibly a bit thick. I'll use more water next time.

 

[Bristol]

Now on the boil. 30 litres for mash and sparge 27 litre in the boil. Usually loose 4 litres so ok.

So have you just filled to 30l, heated to strike temp then mashed in? Then lift and drain the grain and boil? No sparge at all? That would make my day much easier as I only have one socket in the garage and have to run an extention from the house for the sparge heater etc.

 

[Caramel Ox]

Using the same kettle my recommended method is to delete overflow by attaching white cap to bottom bolt, put full volume in at start, pour malt in when at temperature, stir, leave for 15 min, stir, recirculate at about 50% valve position for 45 minutes.

It’s simple and reliable.

 

[Bristol]

Using the same kettle my recommended method is to delete overflow by attaching white cap to bottom bolt, put full volume in at start, pour malt in when at temperature, stir, leave for 15 min, stir, recirculate at about 50% valve position for 45 minutes.

It’s simple and reliable.

Thanks, by full volume you mean 30 litres? To account for a few liters grain absorption and some boil off, no sparge etc. Seems consistent advice here, I'll defo try this next time I think.

 

[Caramel Ox]

Thanks, by full volume you mean 30 litres? To account for a few liters grain absorption and some boil off, no sparge etc. Seems consistent advice here, I'll defo try this next time I think.

It’s calculated by Brewfather based on my profile, but for 21l to fermenter I would start with 27l so yes about 30 for 23l.