More Advanced Water Treatment

[BeerCat]

Hi Steve. Any idea on the difference in water between a czech pils and german pils? All i can find is German water is more minerally and tends to get harder the further north you go. I am presuming it has more sulphates then the Czech water as the bitterness can be more lingering.

 

[strange-steve]

Hi Steve. Any idea on the difference in water between a czech pils and german pils? All i can find is German water is more minerally and tends to get harder the further north you go. I am presuming it has more sulphates then the Czech water as the bitterness can be more lingering.

I don't know much about German Pils tbh, but I believe you're right in that it uses harder water with a higher sulphate content.

 

[BeerCat]

I don't know much about German Pils tbh, but I believe you're right in that it uses harder water with a higher sulphate content.

Thanks Steve, i will do some more digging and let you know. I signed up to the lager for life comp and realised i have never brewed a Czech pale lager before or really know much about the style guidelines. I will get a couple of bottles of to you when i send in my entries. Cheers

 

[chrisbjones202]

I'd probably use something similar but raise the calcium to around 100ppm.

Thanks again Steve

 

[BeerCat]

You're right I did say that. The reason is that to follow the beginners guide you don't need to know the level of chloride (or sulphate) in your water, so I reduced the max CC addition a little just in case the chloride was already high.

For this guide however, you do need to know the level of chloride and if it's very low then an addition of 0.3g/L could be ok. In the OP I recommend that the max chloride should probably be around 150ppm. Hope that makes sense.

I was about to ask you the same question. Makes sense now as i have been pondering this for a few days.

 

[BeerCat]

Finally gotten around to brewing a lager with only calcium chloride. IBU was 33 and its very soft on the palate, very drinkable with a rounded bitterness. You would not think it was that high. Only 50ppm of CC in RO water. I am perceiving quite a difference between that and 25ppm of CC and gypsum. One of the best i have brewed, 90% MO, a little acid malt and the rest is biscuit.

 

[strange-steve]

Finally gotten around to brewing a lager with only calcium chloride. IBU was 33 and its very soft on the palate, very drinkable with a rounded bitterness. You would not think it was that high. Only 50ppm of CC in RO water. I am perceiving quite a difference between that and 25ppm of CC and gypsum. One of the best i have brewed, 90% MO, a little acid malt and the rest is biscuit.

I tried this with a NEIPA, RO water with only CC added. It definitely helped soften the bitterness but I still haven't brewed one of these that I'm really happy with.

 

[Braindead]

How does this profile look for a west coast ipa. Thats for the mash and i'll do same for sparge water.

 

[GregH]

Evening all, I've worked my way through all of the water treatment forum pages and whilst I 'think' I have an reasonable understanding could I get a sanity check of my calcs please? I'm looking to brew a NEIPA style beer, full volume BIAB method, and this would be the second time I have adjusted my water. Thank you in advance.

 

[Hoddy]

Evening all, I've worked my way through all of the water treatment forum pages and whilst I 'think' I have an reasonable understanding could I get a sanity check of my calcs please? I'm looking to brew a NEIPA style beer, full volume BIAB method, and this would be the second time I have adjusted my water. Thank you in advance.

View attachment 17982

View attachment 17983

What SS is that your using???

 

[GregH]

What SS is that your using???

Sorry Hoddy but SS ?

 

[Hoddy]

Sorry Hoddy but SS ?

Spread Sheet.

 

[GregH]

Spread Sheet.

Its the EZ Water Calculator - I hope its not an issue.

 

[Hoddy]

Its the EZ Water Calculator - I hope its not an issue.

Hello no. Ive not used it before and it looks pretty darn comprehensive. But equally easy to miss something or misinterpret. I might have to hunt it out and have a play.

Just trust what your taste buds are telling you and then tweak and improve.

 

[GregH]

Thanks Hoddy. The problem is that I am a perfectionist and I found myself concerned with tweaking the numbers to achieve perfection.

 

[Braindead]

Try switching out your Epsom salts for gypsum

 

[Hoddy]

Try switching out your Epsom salts for gypsum

I bloody hate epsom salts. Either that or i am highly sensitive to it as a ion as i can always seem to taste it in a beer.

 

[GregH]

Try switching out your Epsom salts for gypsum

With some adjustment I get the outcome below - when should I get concerned about the calcium level?

(As my water report does not have magnesium in it I have taken an average from my surrounding area)

 

[BREWERS DROOP]

So I have been dabbling in RO water,and using beersmith distilled section of the profile, right or wrong?
Secondly Bru n Water shows RO water with some parameters being as follows
Calcium 1
Magnesium 0
Sodium 8
Sulphate 1
Chloride 4
Bicarbonate 16
Cations meg/l ????
Anions meg l?????
hardness 3
Alkalinity 13.2
RA 12 ???
SO4/CL 0.3

So I'm doing a pale ale adding 86ltrs total water no sparge full volume recirculated mash, with step temp mash out.

I am adding the following
44.17g of gypsum to the mash

and the remaining to the boiler
Table salt 4.81g
Epsom 17.44g
Calcium Chloride 1.49g

The last brew I did, my ph of the mash was 4.5 way out,its always been spot on prior to using ro water and some dark malt in the mash for the full hour. (Maybe dark malt left until the last 15 minutes of the mash then add???)
The brew before that was spot on 5.3 no dark malts at all.

I know my water is good for stouts dark ales, but not too good for lighter paler ales, so this is an experiment, due to the fact I don't have to keep testing my water, as it changes from one week to the next, and I don't have to use campden tabs.

Anyone have some guidance on this.

 

[Ghillie]

So I have been dabbling in RO water,and using beersmith distilled section of the profile, right or wrong?
Secondly Bru n Water shows RO water with some parameters being as follows
Calcium 1
Magnesium 0
Sodium 8
Sulphate 1
Chloride 4
Bicarbonate 16
Cations meg/l ????
Anions meg l?????
hardness 3
Alkalinity 13.2
RA 12 ???
SO4/CL 0.3

So I'm doing a pale ale adding 86ltrs total water no sparge full volume recirculated mash, with step temp mash out.

I am adding the following
44.17g of gypsum to the mash

and the remaining to the boiler
Table salt 4.81g
Epsom 17.44g
Calcium Chloride 1.49g

The last brew I did, my ph of the mash was 4.5 way out,its always been spot on prior to using ro water and some dark malt in the mash for the full hour. (Maybe dark malt left until the last 15 minutes of the mash then add???)
The brew before that was spot on 5.3 no dark malts at all.

I know my water is good for stouts dark ales, but not too good for lighter paler ales, so this is an experiment, due to the fact I don't have to keep testing my water, as it changes from one week to the next, and I don't have to use campden tabs.

Anyone have some guidance on this.

In short no, RO water and distilled water are not the same.

Distilled water is condensed steam. It contains absolutely no minerals as they can’t float - ie evaporate with the steam.

RO water passes through a filter membrane. It strips most, but not all minerals.

IMO Bru’n Water is ***** and inaccurate. I’d steer clear and use BS. I got so frustrated with Bru’n Water on every level. I’d bet your pH was way off from using Bru’n Water?

Darker malts are acidic by nature, and can be at vary degrees depending on the maltings. It’s important when adding grains to recipes in BS that you edit grain details to match that of your grain. ie EBC, etc.

Just to check, are you sure that 44.17g gypsum is correct? That’s a huge amount, ridiculously so, and would make your mash extremely acidic. Even with an alkalinity of 13.2 as you’ve claimed.