Declining bitter.

[Crappyfish]

We are sadly losing our session regional ale's. Like many have pointed out, it's great to try the mass array of craft beer but many are simply a single pint event (mango, Tonka, imperials to name but a few).

One of the greatest parts of a British pub visit, is the session ale to sit and talk to people without falling off your chair after an hour

The number of traditional Ale clones at CML/MM/Dark Rock/WHS etc could be our only way to get these drinks if the commercial breweries cease production.

Bit like a zoo for beers

 

[Davegase]

I thought hops were brought back with the soldiers who fought in the 100 years war from Flanders.

The first record of hopped beer in Blighty was circa 1362 imported from Amsterdam into Great Yarmouth. The earliest mention of beer being brewed in England (from imported hops) was 1412, made by a German alewife in Colchester. Cultivation of hops started around 1520 when humulus lupulus was planted in Kent.
Did that German alewife use a 30-minute 60 minute or 90 minutes boil ??

 

[Cwrw666]

The first record of hopped beer in Blighty was circa 1362 imported from Amsterdam into Great Yarmouth. The earliest mention of beer being brewed in England (from imported hops) was 1412, made by a German alewife in Colchester. Cultivation of hops started around 1520 when humulus lupulus was planted in Kent.
Did that German alewife use a 30-minute 60 minute or 90 minutes boil ??

Well if it was a 30 minute boil she'd have never heard the end of it.

 

[chthon]

Well if it was a 30 minute boil she'd have never heard the end of it.

Could have easily been no-boil, as documented here

 

[foxy]

The first record of hopped beer in Blighty was circa 1362 imported from Amsterdam into Great Yarmouth. The earliest mention of beer being brewed in England (from imported hops) was 1412, made by a German alewife in Colchester. Cultivation of hops started around 1520 when humulus lupulus was planted in Kent.
Did that German alewife use a 30-minute 60 minute or 90 minutes boil ??

From what I have read about the introduction of hops into the UK is the Romans brought them over as they did eat them as a herb. Not the hops but the young shoots, a bit like asparagus but more woody. Also the Graveny boat had hop pollen underneath it and that was in the 10th century.

 

[Beerwegoagain]

Do sun dials have alarm clocks for timing a medieval wort boil?

 

[Erik The Anglophile]

https://www.historyofinformation.com/detail.php?entryid=2306

 

[Sadfield]

Is it likely wort would have been boiled in medieval times? Few outside of the church would have been wealthy enough for the large vessel needed.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Beer was boiled and that’s how it became sterile and the drink of the poor. Well water or river water was likely to be contaminated so beer and cider were the safe drinks.

 

[Sadfield]

Beer was boiled and that’s how it became sterile and the drink of the poor. Well water or river water was likely to be contaminated so beer and cider were the safe drinks.

Except that farming wasn't industrialised and able to supply enough grain for that hypothesis.

Cider isn't boiled.

People drank beer because they liked it.

https://zythophile.co.uk/2022/07/12...actually-drink-much-much-less-than-you-think/

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Except that farming wasn't industrialised and able to supply enough grain for that hypothesis.

People drank beer because they liked it.

https://zythophile.co.uk/2022/07/12...actually-drink-much-much-less-than-you-think/

The population after the Black Death was as low as 3 million.

 

[chthon]

The great medieval water myth

 

[Erik The Anglophile]

Contrary to popular belief, people drank water back in the day.
Have you read that Zythophile post where he referenced some science researcher who had done a paper on the subject?
They came to the conclusion that if people drank small beer for everyday consumtion and stronger occasionally, about 80% of the yearly grain harvest would have had to be destined for malting...
In fact, people likely drank less beer than we do now back then.

 

[Davegase]

Except that farming wasn't industrialised and able to supply enough grain for that hypothesis.

Cider isn't boiled.

People drank beer because they liked it.

https://zythophile.co.uk/2022/07/12...actually-drink-much-much-less-than-you-think/

Did somebody say cider was boiled ?

 

[Sadfield]

Did somebody say cider was boiled ?

No.

I was highlighting that cider isn't boiled to make it safe to drink, in response to the statement that beer requires boiling to reach the same end point.

 

[Davegase]

No.

I was highlighting that cider isn't boiled to make it safe to drink, in response to the statement that beer requires boiling to reach the same end point.

Beer and cider are quite different,
Are you implying that if you make beer from a contaminated water supply that it wouldn't require boiling to make it safe ?

 

[Sadfield]

Beer and cider are quite different,
Are you implying that if you make beer from a contaminated water supply that it wouldn't require boiling to make it safe ?

Yes. You get pasteurisation at mash temperature. After that the same fermentation benefits as cider come into play, making an acidic and alcoholic environment that pathogens can't tolerate. Particularly acidity, which is the principle used in fermenting food.

 

[Davegase]

Yes. You get pasteurisation at mash temperature. After that the same fermentation benefits as cider come into play, making an acidic and alcoholic environment that pathogens can't tolerate. Particularly acidity, which is the principle used in fermenting food.

Let's hope that German alewife that was mentioned earlier had an accurate thermometer for the mash then

 

[Cwrw666]

Is it likely wort would have been boiled in medieval times? Few outside of the church would have been wealthy enough for the large vessel needed.

Well if you can heat water for a mash you can do a boil as well. And if you've only got a wooden vessel there's the hot stones method - heating stones to red hot and dropping them in the wort. (From 'historical brewing techniques' Garshol.)

 

[Sadfield]

Well if you can heat water for a mash you can do a boil as well. And if you've only got a wooden vessel there's the hot stones method - heating stones to red hot and dropping them in the wort. (From 'historical brewing techniques' Garshol.)

Maintaining a boil with hot stones would be a challenging, requiring a big fire and lots of stones. Commonsense would lead to one large, most likely wooden, vat being topped up with boiling water from a smaller iron pot. Especially as brewers that preceded them, from before the iron age, wouldn't have boiled. Reading Garshol, you'd know that many Norwegian brewers today, don't boil at all.