Beginners Guide to Water Treatment (plus links to more advanced water treatment in post #1)

[dafbach]

0.24 - 0.28 g/L CaCl and 0.14 - 0.18 g/L Gypsum for those levels but that's assuming you start from zero of each. With only 20 ppm calcium you likely don't have much anyway. Both of those at the minimum is going to give you 140 mg/L calcium when added to your existing 20. These are numbers from Bru'n water.

Many thanks for your reply. If I stuck midway with your figures then I should be there or thereabouts.
Regarding the Bru'n Water, are you able to post a snapshot of the spreadsheet so I can see which values you populated please? Thank you.

 

[strange-steve]

My next brew is a NEIPA which requires water profile of 3 to 1 chloride to sulphate.
Having only used your thread for guidance I'm str

Shulphate:chloride ratio is a little more advanced than this guide, have a look at this thread which should help you: More Advanced Water Treatment

 

[Zephyr259]

Many thanks for your reply. If I stuck midway with your figures then I should be there or thereabouts.
Regarding the Bru'n Water, are you able to post a snapshot of the spreadsheet so I can see which values you populated please? Thank you.

Here you go, but as Steve says, he's got another thread with heaps of info on this topic.

I didn't edit anything other than the gypsum and calcium chloride figures here so it's still the grain bill and water amounts from my last brew.

 

[dafbach]

Here you go, but as Steve says, he's got another thread with heaps of info on this topic.

I didn't edit anything other than the gypsum and calcium chloride figures here so it's still the grain bill and water amounts from my last brew.

Thank again, I've been in touch with a local Micro Brewery who had their water tested last year so now have a ball park figure for both sulphate and chloride. I've got a better idea of what I'm doing. I read Steve's post too. Cheers guys.

 

[Argentum]

My opinion might be different from many of your opinions. I'm in the camp which says there is absolutely no value to so called sulfate/chloride ratios at all. Each ion does its own unique job, and neither cancels or somehow alters or balances or in any way impacts the other. Add each until it tastes the way you want it to taste, but don't get hung up on the fantasy of magic ratios or profiles existing between the two. And beyond this, I believe that so called "water profiles" have done more damage to the advancement of homebrewing that virtually anything else. Canned water profiles leave the brewer in a rut the likes of which he or she may never climb out. Next to none of us know the specific water profiles or brewing procedures used by the various breweries that are cranking out our favorite store bought brews. If you are capable of altering source water, you can rest assured that the breweries have this capability also. So it doesn't matter at all what their local community water profile looks like.

 

[strange-steve]

@Argentum i agree with most of what you say.

I'm in the camp which says there is absolutely no value to so called sulfate/chloride ratios at all. Each ion does its own unique job, and neither cancels or somehow alters or balances or in any way impacts the other. Add each until it tastes the way you want it to taste, but don't get hung up on the fantasy of magic ratios or profiles existing between the two.

I think there is something to the ratio, but I agree that we probably put too much emphasis on its importance.

I believe that so called "water profiles" have done more damage to the advancement of homebrewing that virtually anything else. Canned water profiles leave the brewer in a rut the likes of which he or she may never climb out. Next to none of us know the specific water profiles or brewing procedures used by the various breweries that are cranking out our favorite store bought brews. If you are capable of altering source water, you can rest assured that the breweries have this capability also. So it doesn't matter at all what their local community water profile looks like.

This part I agree with 100% :hat:

 

[dafbach]

My opinion might be different from many of your opinions. I'm in the camp which says there is absolutely no value to so called sulfate/chloride ratios at all. Each ion does its own unique job, and neither cancels or somehow alters or balances or in any way impacts the other. Add each until it tastes the way you want it to taste, but don't get hung up on the fantasy of magic ratios or profiles existing between the two. And beyond this, I believe that so called "water profiles" have done more damage to the advancement of homebrewing that virtually anything else. Canned water profiles leave the brewer in a rut the likes of which he or she may never climb out. Next to none of us know the specific water profiles or brewing procedures used by the various breweries that are cranking out our favorite store bought brews. If you are capable of altering source water, you can rest assured that the breweries have this capability also. So it doesn't matter at all what their local community water profile looks like.

Thank you for your post, it's quite easy to get drawn into the numerous facets of brewing. Most of my beers turn out quite drinkable with minimal water additions. I will attempt to produce this one to the ratio described in David Heath's recipe whilst keeping an open mind. Thank you and stay safe all.

 

[Crystal_Ball]

Unfortunately that was all the info on the bottle. I am going to contact them tomorrow and see if i can find out. Thanks Steve, i am finding it easy with RO but a little trickier working this one out.

I know its not alkalinity but i forgot to add the PH is 7.8

I know this post goes back a bit but wondered if you found out the alkalinity? I usually use Ashbeck water, but 30 minute queues to get into Tesco at the moment i'm making the most with Aldi a 2 minute walk away and shopping there at the moment. I wondered if i could change bottled water source.

 

[jceg316]

I'm using a different supply of water and my water report doesn't give calcium levels. Is it possible to derive calcium levels from other minerals at all?

Would be good to know, most water calculators say my water is off balance, it's just my calcium levels which are missing.

 

[Argentum]

Total Hardness (as CaCO3) = 2.5(Ca++) + 4.12(Mg++)

Solve for Ca++ ion concentration

 

[jceg316]

Total Hardness (as CaCO3) = 2.5(Ca++) + 4.12(Mg++)

Solve for Ca++ ion concentration

Just to make sure I've got this right:

CaCO3 = 286
Mg = 2.5

286 = 2.5(Ca) +10.3
Change the subject: 275.7 = 2.5(Ca)

= 275.7/2.5 = 110.28

Ca = 110.28

I hope that's right, despite being a data analyst I haven't done these sorts of equations since GCSEs 16 years ago!

 

[strange-steve]

@jceg316 Rearranging for magnesium gives this:

Mg = (total hardness - (Ca * 2.5)) / 4.12

Do you have a value for total hardness as CaCO3?

 

[jceg316]

@jceg316 Rearranging for magnesium gives this:

Mg = (total hardness - (Ca * 2.5)) / 4.12

Do you have a value for total hardness as CaCO3?

Total hardness as CaCO3 = 286

 

[strange-steve]

Total hardness as CaCO3 = 286

Sorry I misread your post I thought you were trying to find magnesium. Anyway yes you're right, 110ppm calcium

 

[jceg316]

Sorry I misread your post I thought you were trying to find magnesium. Anyway yes you're right, 110ppm calcium

Thanks!:hat:

 

[BeerCat]

Apologies if its been asked before but what is the deal with epsom salts? I am guessing i am already adding magnesium in the form of nutrient.

 

[strange-steve]

Apologies if its been asked before but what is the deal with epsom salts? I am guessing i am already adding magnesium in the form of nutrient.

Some people use it for supplementing magnesium and/or sulphate but personally I don't bother. I used to add a little but haven't done so for years and never noticed any difference when I stopped. What nutrient are you using? Servomyces is normally used for zinc supplementation, I'm not sure if it contains magnesium also.

 

[BeerCat]

I was using wyeast but i have servomyces now. To be honest i am really happy just using sulphate/chloride but i found some and wondered what it would do. Been using your chart for the past few years and its solid. I have never tried salt either.

 

[strange-steve]

I was using wyeast but i have servomyces now. To be honest i am really happy just using sulphate/chloride but i found some and wondered what it would do. Been using your chart for the past few years and its solid. I have never tried salt either.

You could try using Epsom salt and table salt to see if you like the results. If you're using 100% RO water then there may be some benefit. I normally add a very unscientific pinch of table salt to the water for dark beers.

 

[Fritzpoll85]

@strange-steve thanks for all this thread - it was very helpful on the weissbier. What alkalinity is suitable for a dunkel weissbier? Using your rough guide, I'd say it's not a 'black beer', so maybe treat it as a brown one?

Going to get the calcium up for this one!