Water treatment - is it important?

[bmass96]

Quick question about water treatment - is it important?

I currently do no water treatment in my brews, but I know people do. Does it affect it that much in terms of taste or whatever?

I wouldn't even know where to get what you need for water treatment anyway!

Cheers,
Ben.

 

[An Ankoù]

Yes it is.
I brewed in Poole for ages without any problems. The water there is quite hard and if I wanted to brew a lager, I'd use rainwater, or a mixture. Moved to France and had to throw away my first three brews due to the water company using chloramine in the supply. First rule, then is make sure there's no chlorine in the water. Half a Campden tablet in 5 gallons will get rid of it.
Next you need to know if your water's soft, temporarily hard or permanently hard. Each kind of water suits a particular style of beer, but until you know what it's like, you won't know what measures to take.
Apart from the chlorine you can brew beer with any kind of water, but the taste will always be defined by the water profile. You only need to adjust it if you want to copy other beers.

 

[bmass96]

Yes it is.
I brewed in Poole for ages without any problems. The water there is quite hard and if I wanted to brew a lager, I'd use rainwater, or a mixture. Moved to France and had to throw away my first three brews due to the water company using chloramine in the supply. First rule, then is make sure there's no chlorine in the water. Half a Campden tablet in 5 gallons will get rid of it.
Next you need to know if your water's soft, temporarily hard or permanently hard. Each kind of water suits a particular style of beer, but until you know what it's like, you won't know what measures to take.
Apart from the chlorine you can brew beer with any kind of water, but the taste will always be defined by the water profile. You only need to adjust it if you want to copy other beers.

Thanks for that! I'll see if I can get the water profile from our provider and go from there then.

When you say about needing to know if the water is soft, temporarily hard or permanently hard - what determines whether it's soft or whatever? Which would fit the bill for IPA's, pale ales etc.?

 

[jceg316]

I've been doing most my brewing in London. When I started I could make great English ales, Belgian ales, lagers, stouts, but my IPAs would come out really bitter. I treated the water and my IPAs started tasting great. I moved to Ireland where the water is very soft and all my brews came out great and my efficiency increased.

Here's a water calculator which really helped me: https://www.jimsbeerkit.co.uk/water.html
Here's a great article for beginners on water chemistry: https://www.brewersfriend.com/2017/11/19/brewing-water-basics-part-1/
Here's something a little more in-depth: https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/water-knowledge
And here's a post from Strange_steve about water treatment which is also really good: https://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/threads/beginners-guide-to-water-treatment.64822/

I find water chemistry a bit tricky but am trying to get my head around it.

 

[bmass96]

I've been doing most my brewing in London. When I started I could make great English ales, Belgian ales, lagers, stouts, but my IPAs would come out really bitter. I treated the water and my IPAs started tasting great. I moved to Ireland where the water is very soft and all my brews came out great and my efficiency increased.

Here's a water calculator which really helped me: https://www.jimsbeerkit.co.uk/water.html
Here's a great article for beginners on water chemistry: https://www.brewersfriend.com/2017/11/19/brewing-water-basics-part-1/
Here's something a little more in-depth: https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/water-knowledge
And here's a post from Strange_steve about water treatment which is also really good: https://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/threads/beginners-guide-to-water-treatment.64822/

I find water chemistry a bit tricky but am trying to get my head around it.

Thanks for that! I've checked on my providers site (Welsh Water) and the water in my area is moderately soft according to the site. There obviously will be chlorine in it but I'm not sure how much, although from another response half a campden tablet should do the trick.

Is moderately soft water good for IPA's/pale ales? The water calculator looks like I don't have all of the required information (at the moment)...

 

[jceg316]

Thanks for that! I've checked on my providers site (Welsh Water) and the water in my area is moderately soft according to the site. There obviously will be chlorine in it but I'm not sure how much, although from another response half a campden tablet should do the trick.

Is moderately soft water good for IPA's/pale ales? The water calculator looks like I don't have all of the required information (at the moment)...

No Problem. TBH I'm not sure, I think there's more to it than just hardness but I'm sure a forumite more knowledgeable on this topic will be happy to chime in. For the past few years I've just typed my water profile into the calculator and added the salts and CRS it said to add. Funnily enough I recently also decided I want to understand water chemistry better and then I saw your post...

 

[An Ankoù]

Thanks for that! I'll see if I can get the water profile from our provider and go from there then.

When you say about needing to know if the water is soft, temporarily hard or permanently hard - what determines whether it's soft or whatever? Which would fit the bill for IPA's, pale ales etc.?

In brief, permanently hard is good for IPA's and bitters as the calcium sulphate brings out a "crisp bitterness" from the hopping. Traditionally, brewers tended to brew the beers which suited their water, hence dark beers and stouts where there's a lot of bicarbonate in the water as the roasted malts would offset the alkalinity, Good bitters from Burton on Trent where the water's permanently hard and the very best lagers from the softest water of Plzen. Today, we want to be able to brew anything and everything so we need to adjust the water chemistry.

 

[bmass96]

No Problem. TBH I'm not sure, I think there's more to it than just hardness but I'm sure a forumite more knowledgeable on this topic will be happy to chime in. For the past few years I've just typed my water profile into the calculator and added the salts and CRS it said to add. Funnily enough I recently also decided I want to understand water chemistry better and then I saw your post...

I'm in the same boat, I'd like to learn myself but its knowing where to start isnt it!

I'll have a more in depth look at the calculator. Thanks again!

 

[An Ankoù]

In brief, permanently hard is good for IPA's and bitters as the calcium sulphate brings out a "crisp bitterness" from the hopping. Traditionally, brewers tended to brew the beers which suited their water, hence dark beers and stouts where there's a lot of bicarbonate in the water as the roasted malts would offset the alkalinity, Good bitters from Burton on Trent where the water's permanently hard and the very best lagers from the softest water of Plzen. Today, we want to be able to brew anything and everything so we need to adjust the water chemistry.

...And, I should add, that while there are some general rules of thumb like adding a bit of calcium chloride for "mouthfeel" and some gypsum or calcium sulphate for "crispness" (my term), water chemistry adjustment is a fine science. By and large you won't make bad beer because your water's wrong, but you may have difficulty copying certain styles if you water doesn't match that style.

 

[bmass96]

...And, I should add, that while there are some general rules of thumb like adding a bit of calcium chloride for "mouthfeel" and some gypsum or calcium sulphate for "crispness" (my term), water chemistry adjustment is a fine science. By and large you won't make bad beer because your water's wrong, but you may have difficulty copying certain styles if you water doesn't match that style.

That's really helpful, thanks a lot. I'll have a delve into a water calculator and see what it recommends for my water. So far I've only brewed a couple batches, and they both kinda came out tasting the same so perhaps the water chemistry may have played a part. 1 was a normal IPA and the other an NEIPA...using different hops etc so would have expected them to taste different!

 

[An Ankoù]

John Palmer and Colin Kaminski, Water, a comprehensive guide for brewers, Brewing Elements Series. Is the book to get.

I suppose the most important thing about water is getting your mash pH right. This, in my opinion, one of the major reasons that different styles and mashing techniques have evolved in different parts of the world before mash pH was understood. This needn't involve lab testing or even indicator papers, just an understanding of how different waters and different colour malts work in the mash tun.

 

[steve denholm]

I've just started adding an acid blend to my water (I got a water test from brewuk.co.uk that suggested it) as my water is really hard, I brew mostly IPAs and american pales I think it's really helped stopping my beers taste "Home Brewey)

 

[Cwrw666]

In brief, permanently hard is good for IPA's and bitters as the calcium sulphate brings out a "crisp bitterness" from the hopping. Traditionally, brewers tended to brew the beers which suited their water, hence dark beers and stouts where there's a lot of bicarbonate in the water as the roasted malts would offset the alkalinity, Good bitters from Burton on Trent where the water's permanently hard and the very best lagers from the softest water of Plzen. Today, we want to be able to brew anything and everything so we need to adjust the water chemistry.

There you are - and I always thought it was the other way round: soft water for lagers and pale ales, hard water for stouts. I've got really acid water here and my pales are fine but have to buy bottled water for a decent stout. Fact.

 

[An Ankoù]

There you are - and I always thought it was the other way round: soft water for lagers and pale ales, hard water for stouts. I've got really acid water here and my pales are fine but have to buy bottled water for a decent stout. Fact.

Indeed, I think I said the very softest water for lagers (that's to say Pilsners and Pilsner styles, Dortmunder beers use very hard water). There are stouts and stouts, but where there's a lot of bicarbonate in the water, the dark roasted grains provide the acidity to overcome the buffering effect of the bicarbonates and lower the mash pH. Hence stouts- it may not be the kind of stout you want, though.

 

[The Baron]

In other words unless you really want to get into water chemistry which can be a minefield as even the experts don't always agree I would (until you are ready to do some serious reading)find out what water type you have and use the tap water for those styles and buy bottles water for the other styles making sure that the bottle water is of the type you require. Maybe a simpler way of water chemistry is to start with RO water and then add the correct chemicals to this as it is simpler starting from a base water and many brewers on her will already have the recipe for that for the want of words. I can get 25ltr of RO from my aquarium shop for £2.50 if that helps

 

[MickDundee]

I think it depends where you are, what you brew and what your water is like.

I live in a soft water area and only brew pale ales so I don’t need to bother. My local microbrewery reckons their tap water has a similar water profile to some areas of Bavaria/Czechia.

I made a stout once and it felt lacking so it probably would have benefitted from water treatment. I don’t really drink/like much dark beer anyway though

 

[jceg316]

John Palmer and Colin Kaminski, Water, a comprehensive guide for brewers, Brewing Elements Series. Is the book to get.

I suppose the most important thing about water is getting your mash pH right. This, in my opinion, one of the major reasons that different styles and mashing techniques have evolved in different parts of the world before mash pH was understood. This needn't involve lab testing or even indicator papers, just an understanding of how different waters and different colour malts work in the mash tun.

I'm gonna get a copy of this. The book on yeast was great and after reading it I feel my brewing improved. The malt book was a bit boring and I couldn't get through it. I'd like to give this one a go though.

 

[An Ankoù]

I'm gonna get a copy of this. The book on yeast was great and after reading it I feel my brewing improved. The malt book was a bit boring and I couldn't get through it. I'd like to give this one a go though.

I loved the yeast book, too. This one's certainly the hardest!

 

[dad_of_jon]

Quick question about water treatment - is it important?

I currently do no water treatment in my brews, but I know people do. Does it affect it that much in terms of taste or whatever?

I wouldn't even know where to get what you need for water treatment anyway!

Cheers,
Ben.

water is the major ingredient in beer, so it kinda is important. I will at somepoint do it but I buy chase spring bottled water as a good general purpose water for my beers. I know I could improve further by adjusting the water profile and forumites like Strange Steve are a wealth of info on this topic. adding a campden tablet to tap water is water treatment for beginners ;-)

 

[jceg316]

I loved the yeast book, too. This one's certainly the hardest!

Thanks for the warning