Verdant Putty

[Kye]

Managed to get 6 cans earlier by refreshing the website at exactly 10.30am, can't wait to finish dry Jan! Now they have sold out of all but 2 lines on the web shop

Has anyone got a Putty recipe they could post? I've created one on Brewfather but only from what I've gathered from their blog about it on the Verdant site, and the can.

 

[Joetp]

I don't think they published the Putty recipe (I know that Lightbulb and Sharks is available though). I saw an interview with James from Verdant on The Craft Beer Channel where they say they do no dry hopping during active fermentation - they chill it down to 12 or so and hop then. I think my attempt would involve a lot of whirlpool hops at 80 degrees and a decent hop charge in the keg. Beyond that, I'm not sure!

 

[BlackRegent]

@Kye
Here's my work in progress recipe.

https://share.brewfather.app/783eG0tfxjc9iy
I first put it together a year ago and, truth be told, I've not got round to brewing it yet! The other thing missing is water treatment. Again, not something I got round to thinking about.

If anyone has suggestions for improvements, let me know.

 

[Kye]

@Kye
Here's my work in progress recipe.

https://share.brewfather.app/783eG0tfxjc9iy
I first put it together a year ago and, truth be told, I've not got round to brewing it yet! The other thing missing is water treatment. Again, not something I got round to thinking about.

If anyone has suggestions for improvements, let me know.

Thanks for sharing, have attached my draft too (hope it works). One thing I have worked on with Verdant brews is water profile. Getting chloride to c 230ppm and being c 10-15x what the sulphate is really helps create the thick and smooth mouthfeel. You'll see this on the recipe. If you don't have RO water then Asda Elmhurst Spring has a nice starting point for chloride and is nice and cheap.

On dry hop I've been using the Verdant method with a Fermzilla - chill to 14degC after fermentation has finished, remove yeast, and dry hop through the bottom collection jar using CO2 to rouse the hops and break them up. It's worked really well every time. Oxygen free dry hop and transfer is a must at this dry hop level obviously. You lose a lot of liquid to the hops though which I think is unavoidable. Some of the new hop extract products might be a future solution to this.

https://share.brewfather.app/N0Jcf7AQf8dBPY

 

[Leon103]

Thanks for sharing, have attached my draft too (hope it works). One thing I have worked on with Verdant brews is water profile. Getting chloride to c 230ppm and being c 10-15x what the sulphate is really helps create the thick and smooth mouthfeel. You'll see this on the recipe. If you don't have RO water then Asda Elmhurst Spring has a nice starting point for chloride and is nice and cheap.

On dry hop I've been using the Verdant method with a Fermzilla - chill to 14degC after fermentation has finished, remove yeast, and dry hop through the bottom collection jar using CO2 to rouse the hops and break them up. It's worked really well every time. Oxygen free dry hop and transfer is a must at this dry hop level obviously. You lose a lot of liquid to the hops though which I think is unavoidable. Some of the new hop extract products might be a future solution to this.

https://share.brewfather.app/N0Jcf7AQf8dBPY

Isnt the bottom jar full of co2 when you put the hops in?

 

[Kye]

Isnt the bottom jar full of co2 when you put the hops in?

This is my method (if I'm understanding your question right):

After the cold crash to 14deg the yeast will all drop to the bottom, turn the handle to close the valve (I don't ferment under pressure btw). remove the jar and dump the yeast (or save it if you're going to re-use), clean and sanitise the jar, put the hops in and reattach it with one of red carbonation caps on one side and a normal bottle top on the other. Then when it's attached purge with CO2 as you would when burping a keg (i do this quite a few times to make sure I've pushed all the oxygen out), get it to 10psi to create positive pressure in the jar, and then turn the handle to open the valve and all the hops will fly up into the main body of liquid (this is the exciting part).

Some of the hops can clump to the bottom so I use a short piece of silicon tubing inside of the jar so that the CO2 enters from the bottom and pushes everything up. Keep flushing CO2 and opening the top pressure release valve as you're doing it and you'll get loads of bubbling action that will help break up the hops.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[Leon103]

This is my method (if I'm understanding your question right):

After the cold crash to 14deg the yeast will all drop to the bottom, turn the handle to close the valve (I don't ferment under pressure btw). remove the jar and dump the yeast (or save it if you're going to re-use), clean and sanitise the jar, put the hops in and reattach it with one of red carbonation caps on one side and a normal bottle top on the other. Then when it's attached purge with CO2 as you would when burping a keg (i do this quite a few times to make sure I've pushed all the oxygen out), get it to 10psi to create positive pressure in the jar, and then turn the handle to open the valve and all the hops will fly up into the main body of liquid (this is the exciting part).

Some of the hops can clump to the bottom so I use a short piece of silicon tubing inside of the jar so that the CO2 enters from the bottom and pushes everything up. Keep flushing CO2 and opening the top pressure release valve as you're doing it and you'll get loads of bubbling action that will help break up the hops.

Hope that makes sense.

That answers my query. With my fermenter you can't add co2 into the collection bottle. Plus there isn't enough room for all my hops.

 

[Kye]

So my version of Putty is currently fermenting but is taking an age to get there. It is still only 1.021 after 9 days (having started at 1.075) and needs to get to 1.015 to achieve 8% (I'm rounding up a bit - for the eagle eyed). The gravity has only dropped 9 points in the last 6 days! I am thinking should I just wait it out and hope it gets there, or pitch another pack of yeast? Or maybe even a bit of olive oil as I've heard that can get the yeast going again in this sort of situation.

Any advice appreciated - attached is a pic of the fermentation, as you can see it's slowed massively. On the plus side it smells great and I haven't even done the dry hop yet.

 

[Joetp]

Have you tried rousing the yeast?

 

[Kye]

by rousing you mean literally shaking the fermenter? and/or flushing some c02 through it?

 

[Joetp]

I'd flush some CO2 through if you can! What kind of fermenter are you using? If a Fermzilla vibe, try and flush CO2 through the dip tube.

 

[Leon103]

What yeast did you use.

 

[Kye]

should have said - 1 pack of Lallemand Verdant. It's only into 16 litres so figured 1 pack should be fine, and have done 6.5% 23 litre batches with it previously without an issue.

its unlike this yeast tbh. other thing I was thinking is have I just got a ridiculous amount of unfermentable sugars so am going to have a high FG. I did a 2 step mash though, 64deg for 45 mins and 68 for 30, plus mash out at 75deg. Would have thought that would be fine

 

[Kye]

I'd flush some CO2 through if you can! What kind of fermenter are you using? If a Fermzilla vibe, try and flush CO2 through the dip tube.

yep fermzilla but haven't got the carb cap on the collection jar so not sure dip tube would do much. I did give it a good shake earlier though!

 

[Joetp]

yep fermzilla but haven't got the carb cap on the collection jar so not sure dip tube would do much. I did give it a good shake earlier though!

Hopefully, it will kick things off again and you get to FG.

 

[aaronm13]

So my version of Putty is currently fermenting but is taking an age to get there. It is still only 1.021 after 9 days (having started at 1.075) and needs to get to 1.015 to achieve 8% (I'm rounding up a bit - for the eagle eyed). The gravity has only dropped 9 points in the last 6 days! I am thinking should I just wait it out and hope it gets there, or pitch another pack of yeast? Or maybe even a bit of olive oil as I've heard that can get the yeast going again in this sort of situation.

Any advice appreciated - attached is a pic of the fermentation, as you can see it's slowed massively. On the plus side it smells great and I haven't even done the dry hop yet.

View attachment 63026

You definitely underpitched. The cell count on the Verdant yeast isn't great and the calculator on the Lallemand site recommends 2 packs for your numbers. London Ale 3/Verdant is a nightmare of a yeast to use on DIPAs I find, would always sltall in the 20s for me too so just gave up using it. An overpitch and lots of o2 is key to get it to finish out.

 

[Kye]

You definitely underpitched. The cell count on the Verdant yeast isn't great and the calculator on the Lallemand site recommends 2 packs for your numbers. London Ale 3/Verdant is a nightmare of a yeast to use on DIPAs I find, would always sltall in the 20s for me too so just gave up using it. An overpitch and lots of o2 is key to get it to finish out.

nice one. that's super helpful to know. I think I've been guilty of this with my other verdant brews though this is the only one that's taken so long. for the sake of the extra £3.50 I think I'll double pitch in future especially as the brew is so expensive in the 1st place, no point having it sub standard when investing so much. btw it managed to get to 1.018 before I cold crashed it for the dry hop, which I think is just about acceptable. hoping it'll be a good one!

 

[aaronm13]

nice one. that's super helpful to know. I think I've been guilty of this with my other verdant brews though this is the only one that's taken so long. for the sake of the extra £3.50 I think I'll double pitch in future especially as the brew is so expensive in the 1st place, no point having it sub standard when investing so much. btw it managed to get to 1.018 before I cold crashed it for the dry hop, which I think is just about acceptable. hoping it'll be a good one!

You did well getting down to 18 considering the underpitch. When I did my Putty clone last year I got the lowest I've ever gotten with LA3 which was 18 too. I've gone back to using Conan for DIPAs which is so much easier to work work. Hope the beer ends up great for you.

 

[Kye]

You did well getting down to 18 considering the underpitch. When I did my Putty clone last year I got the lowest I've ever gotten with LA3 which was 18 too. I've gone back to using Conan for DIPAs which is so much easier to work work. Hope the beer ends up great for you.

What strain are you using, and dry or liquid yeast? I read that Lallemand New England is the conan strain so might try that.

 

[aaronm13]

What strain are you using, and dry or liquid yeast? I read that Lallemand New England is the conan strain so might try that.

As far as I know that New England dry yeast is Conan. Just be careful as it's an even lower cell count than the Verdant one. I'm using Omega's DIPA liquid yeast which is also Conan. If you want to stay dry I know people who have had great success with pitching 1pack of Verdant and 1 pack of New England. The Conan one gives a bit of help with attenuation