Trying to identify a (off?) flavour..?

[TheRedDarren]

Hi gang,

As some may have read in my Old Speckled Hen thread, Clibit pointed out that I didn't check the EBC of the crystal I used. I subsequently used 150 instead of something a bit lower.
There was a very strong flavour which was a bit unusual, not particularly unpleasant as my brother liked it, but I wasn't too keen. The taste is quite 'grainy' or maybe 'corn' or even that 'green beer' flavour that you get before it's ready - unfortunately this is the best description I can give as I've never tasted it anywhere before. I did mention in the original thread that it was a flavour from the crystal as it seems to be mellowing over time, although I didn't detect it at bottling time.

Now, I've used 150 in all my other brews so far and haven't noticed it, but all the other brews have been a bit darker and have had less of a flavour gradient between the other malts and the crystal.
Could this hide that flavour?

The other possibility is, is it an ester from the yeast? I looked back over my notes and noticed I pitched at 27* and at one point the temperature rose to 21.5* the yeast is wlp005 and some research has showed that it's quite sensitive to stress.
To back this theory up is that the flavour is in the nose rather than on the tongue.
And, I recently had a very pale ale from Tesco (I can't remember which one) and it had the exact same taste, when I checked the ingredient list there was no crystal at all, only pale malt. Unfortunately there was no mention of yeast on the label.

I don't think it's diacetyl, although I have to admit I've never tasted it first hand, but judging by the butter or butterscotch description it's not that, besides, the beer was in primary for 17 days so I think that would have taken care of that.

Lastly, if anyone is intrigued or would care to try, I could send a bottle or two out if you think you could identify it.

Thanks for any help in advance!

 

[MyQul]

Have you looked at an off flavour chart?

Cooked corn flavour is supposed to be DMS and a grainy flavour from poor crushing of the grain/sparging practices.

http://www.howtobrew.com/section4/chapter21-2.html

Diacety is a sweet flavour. To me almost honey like. When I had it in a kit once, it tasted like I had brewed a batch of mead. It also give a slick oily sensation in low levels. Again, for me, it was like a slick oily feeling on the inside of my top row of fron teeth

 

[Covrich]

Can't DMS also be caused by not boiling long enough or vigorous enough?? I haven't encountered it but it seemed to come up with looking at things such as shorter boils.

 

[Dads_Ale]

:-D
You've caught my interest now so feel free to send me one as part of the bottle swap

 

[MyQul]

Can't DMS also be caused by not boiling long enough or vigorous enough?? I haven't encountered it but it seemed to come up with looking at things such as shorter boils.

You right, a boil that is not long.vigourous enough is supposed to cause it. However if you do a bit of digging/googling into DMS, it seems nowadays it's not a problem as malt is now well modified - appart from pilsner malt (and posibbly American 2 row but I'm not so sure on that). Pilsner malt seem to still have problems with DMS is you don't boil it long/vigoursly enough

 

[TheRedDarren]

Have you looked at an off flavour chart?

Cooked corn flavour is supposed to be DMS and a grainy flavour from poor crushing of the grain/sparging practices.

http://www.howtobrew.com/section4/chapter21-2.html

Diacety is a sweet flavour. To me almost honey like. When I had it in a kit once, it tasted like I had brewed a batch of mead. It also give a slick oily sensation in low levels. Again, for me, it was like a slick oily feeling on the inside of my top row of fron teeth

That's great, thanks Myqul, I'm going with the husky/grainy issue that highlights, I shall bung it in a cold fridge and try again in a few days to see if it settles out.

 

[TheRedDarren]

Can't DMS also be caused by not boiling long enough or vigorous enough?? I haven't encountered it but it seemed to come up with looking at things such as shorter boils.

Thanks for the thoughts mate, I boil for 90 minutes though so I'm guessing that will eliminate this issue?

 

[rodabod]

I don't think it's diacetyl, although I have to admit I've never tasted it first hand, but judging by the butter or butterscotch description it's not that, besides, the beer was in primary for 17 days so I think that would have taken care of that.

Was it at all like a boiled mixed vegetables smell? Was the boil nice and strong?

 

[TheRedDarren]

Was it at all like a boiled mixed vegetables smell? Was the boil nice and strong?

No, not really like veg at all. I did read about the cabbage smell and I'm guessing that's what you mean?
I put a few in the fridge for only a few hours and I think the flavour dropped, I shall test it a bit more thoroughly by putting a few bottles in for a few days, maybe a week to so for sure.