Small batch brewing with 30L all in 1 systems?

[matt76]

Question for some of you guys with all in 1 systems like Robobrew (@Clint ?), OneConcept (@Gulpitdarn ?) , Klarstein or Grainfather.....

At the moment I do half-size 10-12L (ish) BIAB batches rather than the full 20-25L. Currently I mash then dunk sparge, with 16L water in total, which gives me about 15L pre-boil. I'm also looking at switching to no-sparge for simplicity.

Could these smaller batches realistically be brewed with these systems or is there a minimum volume you need to do? I'm considering treating myself, and while I probably wouldn't spend Grainfather money the Robobrew/Klarstein price bracket looks like good bang for buck.

I was looking at some of @David Heath ' s YouTube videos summarising and comparing these systems and there was some suggestion that you need to adjust some filter parts to kinda sandwich your grain (might have misunderstood though!)

Some of my beers, sure I'd happily brew larger batches and solve the problem that way, but others where I'm experimenting more I don't necessarily want a huge 40pint batch of not-that-great-beer!

Any advice appreciated - Cheers,

Matt

 

[Rodcx500z]

Question for some of you guys with all in 1 systems like Robobrew (@Clint ?), OneConcept (@Gulpitdarn ?) , Klarstein or Grainfather.....

At the moment I do half-size 10-12L (ish) BIAB batches rather than the full 20-25L. Currently I mash then dunk sparge, with 16L water in total, which gives me about 15L pre-boil. I'm also looking at switching to no-sparge for simplicity.

Could these smaller batches realistically be brewed with these systems or is there a minimum volume you need to do? I'm considering treating myself, and while I probably wouldn't spend Grainfather money the Robobrew/Klarstein price bracket looks like good bang for buck.

I was looking at some of @David Heath ' s YouTube videos summarising and comparing these systems and there was some suggestion that you need to adjust some filter parts to kinda sandwich your grain (might have misunderstood though!)

Some of my beers, sure I'd happily brew larger batches and solve the problem that way, but others where I'm experimenting more I don't necessarily want a huge 40pint batch of not-that-great-beer!

Any advice appreciated - Cheers,

Matt

Hi Matt I would say so, it depends on the size of your grain bill (a bit like when you have a bath you fill it get in and the level rises) what you dunk with would have to go in the kettle, I could be totally wrong here as well but I am sure I will be corrected

 

[samale]

Question for some of you guys with all in 1 systems like Robobrew (@Clint ?), OneConcept (@Gulpitdarn ?) , Klarstein or Grainfather.....

At the moment I do half-size 10-12L (ish) BIAB batches rather than the full 20-25L. Currently I mash then dunk sparge, with 16L water in total, which gives me about 15L pre-boil. I'm also looking at switching to no-sparge for simplicity.

Could these smaller batches realistically be brewed with these systems or is there a minimum volume you need to do? I'm considering treating myself, and while I probably wouldn't spend Grainfather money the Robobrew/Klarstein price bracket looks like good bang for buck.

I was looking at some of @David Heath ' s YouTube videos summarising and comparing these systems and there was some suggestion that you need to adjust some filter parts to kinda sandwich your grain (might have misunderstood though!)

Some of my beers, sure I'd happily brew larger batches and solve the problem that way, but others where I'm experimenting more I don't necessarily want a huge 40pint batch of not-that-great-beer!

Any advice appreciated - Cheers,

Matt

I have been looking at these systems for ages. Hopefully I get one from santa. I know the brew devil can have an adjustable mash pipe. I think it's telescopic so you can adjust to suit any grain bill

 

[matt76]

I have been looking at these systems for ages. Hopefully I get one from santa. I know the brew devil can have an adjustable mash pipe. I think it's telescopic so you can adjust to suit any grain bill

Yes, that's the bit i want sure about - here is the clip from one of @David Heath 's reviews:
(skip forward to 5m30s)

If i understand correctly, there is more adjustment on the Grainfather, but some manual intervention is required on the Robobrew (which might imply the same for similar systems like the Klarstein et. al. ???)

Modifying is not a show stopper necessarily, i just want to be clear on any limitations or other genuine show stoppers before I spend money.

 

[samale]

https://www.angelhomebrew.co.uk/en/brew-devil/384-brewdevil-telescopic-overflow-pipe.html

 

[samale]

Or do has David said and buy an extra malt pipe and cut it in half

 

[aamcle]

The GF has a smaller set of pipe work and will happily 8-10 litres.

Atb. Aamcle

 

[matt76]

Or do has David said and buy an extra malt pipe and cut it in half

Yeah but what I'm getting at is, at what point is that necessary, e.g. 5L batch? 10? 15?

(In any case I'm sure something suitable could be fashioned)

 

[Clint]

Sorry if I've been unclear...I'd like one but currently do 3v..

 

[foxy]

You can easily do a 21 litre batch in the Brew Devil 40 litre loss to boil is 5 litres per hour dependent on where you live, I calculate 900 grams per litre to grain absorption so for an average brew I add my grain to 34 litres of liquor. I have made a simple change to the handle that is to use some all thread through the handle holes to prevent any grain going into the kettle and it also lifts the grain basket a little higher. I set my Brewers Friend to 60 % efficiency which allows me to calculate the grain for the full volume mash.

Use the bazooka filter on the top of the malt pipe and insert some silicone right up to the taper of the bazooka this is with a 6 kg grain bill so I only used about 33 litres of liquor.

 

[matt76]

Sorry if I've been unclear...I'd like one but currently do 3v..

Oops, sorry mate, my bad. As you were

 

[Bowie92]

I've been looking into this as well. From what I understand the 30l Klarstein/Brewdevil machines have a 6.5l deadspace under the malt pipe, which in theory allows for recipes to be brewers full volume (no sparge). I've tested this on a number of recipes in Brewfather and it all seems a go-er.

 

[northof49]

I'd suggest having a look at the Anvil Foundry, which comes in two sizes. I don't know how easy or expensive it would be to import it from the US, but I've been happy with its performance.

 

[TL4244]

Speaking as a distinct ameteur, I have a Klarstein 30l system (which is actually a 40l capacity so you can boil 30l with plenty of space left at the top of the kettle to prevent boil overs). It is one of these

https://www.klarstein.co.uk/Home-ap...eel.html?force_sid=g1tp1u9k922rtejc1obgvgntb4

Which I am assuming is very similar if not a clone of the Robobrew etc (not sure if they all rate the capacities in the same way but I got the impression others quote the absolute capacity of the tank, not the effective maximum liquid volume). The grain basket can accommodate a wide range volume of grains as the overflow pipe is supplied split into 2 unequal parts so it can be set at a variety of levels using one or both parts. Personally I am not sure how you would get on brewing small batches in one of the ones I have, it is quite a wide tank and you need a fair volume of water in it, with a 4.5kg grain bill it was over 20l of water before the grain was submerged (not sure if it is supposed to be submerged?). The Klarstein does seem well made though and I got a new one for £265 off Ebay (They list under a few different company names) plus there was a 10% off day. They have some up at the moment at £290 - ebay item number 223519430167 (The seller is actually Hi-Fi Tower, that is who all the emails and tracking come from)

Klarstein do a 15l pumped system, they have in the past been down to £250 on ebay as B-Stock (scratches or dents) but again it is stated as 15l liquid boil volume - although you would need to sparge to get that volume. If their quoted internal volume is correct I make it an 18.5l volume tank (to the brim)

https://www.klarstein.co.uk/?cl=det...&varselid[0]=131941a4c098980012c89d826315cd68

 

[Litmus]

Could these smaller batches realistically be brewed with these systems or is there a minimum volume you need to do?

I did a 6L batch in a 50L you can see the video here

 

[northof49]

Nice video, Litmus. Makes sense to do no-sparge when doing a small batch. I think that the argument I've heard against doing small batches is that you can't sparge effectively. For me, if I'm going to invest the time in brewing a batch then I want to get enough beer out to make it worthwhile (I think that you alluded to this at the end of the video). Of course the down side is throwing out the full batch if something goes wrong.

 

[TL4244]

Strange, Your 50l unit in the video and the 30l (or 40l for most sellers) unit I have look like twins, but mine requires 1l of water per 1 cm of water depth, the bottom of the grain basket tube is 9cm up from the base and with the volume in the pump etc you need a little over 10l of water before the water is above the level of the bottom mesh. I would have expected things to be identical and I doubt your unit is narrower so I assume the bottom of the basket on yours is closer to the bottom of the unit?

 

[jezbrews]

I did a 6L batch in a 50L you can see the video here

Not sure if I missed it but did you have to modify it in any way or does the grain basket just go deep enough?

 

[RoomWithABrew]

You could just put the grains in a bag and not use the basket, just leave the bottom plate in to keep the bag from direct contact with the element.

 

[jezbrews]

You could just put the grains in a bag and not use the basket, just leave the bottom plate in to keep the bag from direct contact with the element.

Good point, thank you. I think I've decided on this one (as seemingly the only one on the market that goes this small)