Rookie error!

[Jamie1983]

I tried a heineken clone recipe i found online and and as it was my 2nd batch i was very new to the game! The hops required hallerter herbsucker but they were out of stock so i used hallerter blanc thinking it would be similar. I fermented for 18 days and kegged for a week and the whole time its tastes pretty awful. Im leaving it im the keg to see if time changes the flavour but a real funky taste and slight sourness. Its either the hops or the yeast as it was liquid and i did not make a starter. It was in a smack pack that says leave at ambient for 3 hours. Also it was the only batch i did not take a gravity reading as i assumed it was well fermented

 

[Leon103]

It already sounds better than Heineken

 

[Jim Brewster]

A quick google suggests it's more of an ale type hop than lager. I suppose there's nothing you can do at this point really, maybe let it mature a bit longer to see if it mellows, or enjoy it as shandy?

 

[Leon103]

A quick google suggests it's more of an ale type hop than lager. I suppose there's nothing you can do at this point really, maybe let it mature a bit longer to see if it mellows, or enjoy it as shandy?

I use it in my pilsner. What you are describing is an infection.

 

[RichardM]

Fermenting for 18 days and then kegging and conditioning for a week is not how you make lager.
You need to use a lager yeast and ferment at an appropriate temperature, may be 12 centigrade for 3 or 4 weeks. You then need to lager it for a few weeks before kegging.
However, as @Leon103 says, funky and sour sounds like an infection. May be you just need to put it down to experience, thoroughly clean all your kit, review your technique and have another go.

 

[Jamie1983]

I use it in my pilsner. What you are describing is an infection.

I made an attempt at a guinness replica aswel and that tastes very sour but i heard stouts can be bad to begin, before conditioning but would it taste disgusting after fermentation, probably not! I moved house and left them in the old house for a few weeks. One was inside the house about 15 to 20 degrees and the other in the garage about 8 to 15 degrees. The first beer i brewed i used a fermentation chamber but since ive been using my inkbird for my chest freezer for the kegs. Im hoping lager will ferment im my house at about 10 to 15 but i might wait until i get another inkbird before i attempt guinness again!

 

[Jamie1983]

Fermenting for 18 days and then kegging and conditioning for a week is not how you make lager.
You need to use a lager yeast and ferment at an appropriate temperature, may be 12 centigrade for 3 or 4 weeks. You then need to lager it for a few weeks before kegging.
However, as @Leon103 says, funky and sour sounds like an infection. May be you just need to put it down to experience, thoroughly clean all your kit, review your technique and have another go.

I found a cold spot in my house and seems to be about 10 to 14 most times i check as its a cold winter. I brewed 2 lagers since yesterday so im hoping to do this right! I pitched the yeast around 20 and kept it about 18 overnight then this morning i put it in my cold spot and i could here plenty of activity, the first was a european lager, the second a bohemian lager both using dried yeast. Do you think its risky this way?

 

[RichardM]

I found a cold spot in my house and seems to be about 10 to 14 most times i check as its a cold winter. I brewed 2 lagers since yesterday so im hoping to do this right! I pitched the yeast around 20 and kept it about 18 overnight then this morning i put it in my cold spot and i could here plenty of activity, the first was a european lager, the second a bohemian lager both using dried yeast. Do you think its risky this way?

If the stout was sour as well as the lager that is even more sign that you have in infection in your kit.

I don't think what you describe increases the risk of the lager tasting sour.

 

[Binkei Huckaback]

I found a cold spot in my house and seems to be about 10 to 14 most times i check as its a cold winter. I brewed 2 lagers since yesterday so im hoping to do this right! I pitched the yeast around 20 and kept it about 18 overnight then this morning i put it in my cold spot and i could here plenty of activity, the first was a european lager, the second a bohemian lager both using dried yeast. Do you think its risky this way?

John Palmer im his book How to Brew says lager needs to ferment at around 5-8°c. Does the yeast packet give a guide? If so, follow that. I think you'll have problems if you try to ferment at 10 - 14°c

 

[nickjdavis]

Most lager yeasts ferment best at 8-12 degrees....I've never used one where the recommended range is below this.

In normal circumstances 10 to 14 degrees shouldn't be too bad and any off flavours/aromas due to fermenting at the warm end of the range should dissipate with time and "lagering".

However...pitching lager yeast at 20 degrees and keeping it at 18 overnight and then putting the FV in an environment that sits naturally at 10-14 degrees isn't going to drag your fermentation temp down very quickly....the temperature differential between beer and environment isn't enough to drop the temperature to the recommended range (or just above it)...especially when you consider that fermentation is exothermic and will generate its own warmth....you may find that the actual fermentation temp is closer to 16/17 degrees....which isn't a good thing.

when brewing lagers there is no substitute for a proper temperature controlled environment to maintain proper temperatures.

When brewing ales you can get away with the ambient variation between say 16 and 24 degrees that you might find in an uncontrolled environment...but lagers need a bit more precision and control.

 

[Jamie1983]

Most lager yeasts ferment best at 8-12 degrees....I've never used one where the recommended range is below this.

In normal circumstances 10 to 14 degrees shouldn't be too bad and any off flavours/aromas due to fermenting at the warm end of the range should dissipate with time and "lagering".

However...pitching lager yeast at 20 degrees and keeping it at 18 overnight and then putting the FV in an environment that sits naturally at 10-14 degrees isn't going to drag your fermentation temp down very quickly....the temperature differential between beer and environment isn't enough to drop the temperature to the recommended range (or just above it)...especially when you consider that fermentation is exothermic and will generate its own warmth....you may find that the actual fermentation temp is closer to 16/17 degrees....which isn't a good thing.

when brewing lagers there is no substitute for a proper temperature controlled environment to maintain proper temperatures.

When brewing ales you can get away with the ambient variation between say 16 and 24 degrees that you might find in an uncontrolled environment...but lagers need a bit more precision and control.

You are right because i checked the temp and its 16 slowly dropping. Do you think ill cause more damaged lowering the temps right down or gradually, or start again!!

 

[chrisb8]

It sounds like you have gone straight in with one of the harder (or less forgiving styles) that needs relatively precise temperature control. If the first attempts have not been successful then it might be sensible to hone your skills on a more forgiving style like ale or wheat beer perhaps?

 

[Jamie1983]

If the stout was sour as well as the lager that is even more sign that you have in infection in your kit.

I don't think what you describe increases the risk of the lager tasting sour.

Im thinking i could have got caught out with the tap on the end of the fermenting buckets, that would be one of my infection

It sounds like you have gone straight in with one of the harder (or less forgiving styles) that needs relatively precise temperature control. If the first attempts have not been successful then it might be sensible to hone your skills on a more forgiving style like ale or wheat beer perhaps?

I was thinking the same that i would like to try a more forgiving style that can ferment at ambient between 14 to 18 c. This way i could brew more beer quicker as i dont have the space. I have 3 cornys full, 2 with lager and 1 with stout. Only one of the lagers is arguably still salvagable, the other 2 have funky tastes, so ive placed my 2 fermenting lagers in a my chest freezer to ferment at around 12c as i begun higher then pitch im hoping this might work. I need to try an ipa next or pale ale that might be drinkable quicker!
The 3 corny kegs are carbonated and kegged 2 weeks after 18 days of feementation, so it might be better to leave them in a cold place of my house and use my chest freezer as a fermenter.

 

[nickjdavis]

You are right because i checked the temp and its 16 slowly dropping. Do you think ill cause more damaged lowering the temps right down or gradually, or start again!!

If you can get the temps down then by all means try it....unless you need the FV space for another brew there is no point just dumping the current batch because of an error that may/may not cause a problem in the unfinished beer. The beer wont be bad by any means....it will probably have a few estery flavours that are not supposed to be in a cleanly fermented beer like a lager but should still be drinkable.

If you want to try something that can ferment at 14-16 then perhaps a California Common or maybe even a German Altbier could be styles to consider.

 

[RichardM]

If you can get the temps down then by all means try it....unless you need the FV space for another brew there is no point just dumping the current batch because of an error that may/may not cause a problem in the unfinished beer. The beer wont be bad by any means....it will probably have a few estery flavours that are not supposed to be in a cleanly fermented beer like a lager but should still be drinkable.

If you want to try something that can ferment at 14-16 then perhaps a California Common or maybe even a German Altbier could be styles to consider.

Or a Kolsch, fermented with a Kolsch yeast at about 16 centigrade it would be "lager" ish