Recommend Me Some Dry Yeast

[Covrich]

I'm thinking along the lines of Bateman's, Fuller's, etc where the yeast really contributes to the flavour

Yeah I think it is a style which IMO dry yeast struggles to achieve. That and some German\ belgian styles

A lot of people like wilko/ gervin yeast but for me it is the beige of yeasts .. I just prefer US05 for most styles in leiu

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Is this your order of preference or do you add each one sequentially or do you start with Windsor and follow with any ONE of the others?

Windsor followed by one of Nottingham/Wilko/M42, which are generally regarded to be at least equivalent if not actual repacks of Nottingham. In fact you could use any of them (Wilko being the obvious one as it's the cheapest) to help flocculate any other yeasts that don't drop so well. The only problem with that is if you reuse yeast, you'll end up with a blend that will drift on repitching. But if you don't reuse yeast then it's a good solution.

I have MJ's M-20 Bavarian Wheat in the fridge. That sounds like what you're recommending?

We know most companies don't make their own dry yeast, they just repack ones from the big boys. So M20 is almost certainly a repack of something else, and Munich Classic would be an obvious choice for a Bavarian Wheat even if we can't say for sure at this stage. See this table for some pretty educated guesses about which strain correlates to which : https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/16XRUloO3WXqH9Ixsf5vx2DIKDmrEQJ36tLRBmmya7Jo/edit

Also this thread on HBT : https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/dry-yeasts-identified-your-opinions-please.670466/

I didn't know that about de Struise, and with chinook. I have some cararoma... Hmm good idea for the next brew. Arrogant *******ish.

I have a few 4-6 year old 750s from deStruise, pannepot etc... Sounds likes a good idea to open one up one of these days.

The de Struise thing is only internet legend, but I offer it FWIW - they certainly make great beer.

I've found that with eg Chinook the biotransformation means you lose maybe 20% of hop intensity, but it turns the grapefruit of Chinook into something more limey and complex.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

That is interesting.

What's also interesting is how far away WLP028 is from WY1728. I always thought they performed differently. I guess this suggests they've definitely mutated away from each other even if the McEwan's was indeed the original source for both?

It's possible that White Labs and Wyeast just selected different members of a multistrain from the same source - the Edinburgh brewers used to swap yeast fairly regularly so the combined blend was probably a right hodge podge.

According to Wiki, they brewed draught in Edinburgh and bottled beer in Bedford, so perhaps used two different yeasts.

That was later, several mergers after the yeast crossed the Atlantic. But that kind of thing doesn't help.

London III is confusingly stated as being Boddington, who were acquired by Whitbread, from Bedfordshire. So perhaps they changed the yeast when they ruined Boddies.

Boddies ruined Boddies all by themselves, the big change seems to have come in ~1981, there's dark rumours that they "lost" their yeast at a time when they were making various recipe changes on cost grounds at the height of the recession. So one theory says that 1318 was a yeast that Boddies got from Courage, but there's no hard evidence for that AFAIK.

Don't forget that Whitbread were originally based in the City of London, and ran one of the biggest yeast banks in Europe, so if Boddies subsequently got yeast from them after the takeover in 1989 then it could have come from anywhere.

 

[Sadfield]

We know most companies don't make their own dry yeast, they just repack ones from the big boys.

Spot on. Although, I guess there's nothing to say that they don't blend those into new products. I know a few of the UK NEIPA brewers experimented with blending IIRC Windsor and Notty under advice from Lallemand. This might explain how CML were quick to the market with a NEIPA yeast.

 

[marshbrewer]

See this table for some pretty educated guesses about which strain correlates to which

I would be amazed if MJ Liberty Bell was S04 as suggested by the spreadsheet. Smells completely different, tastes completely different (I'm super sensitive to S04's tartness. I don't get that at all with Liberty Bell, I get lovely fruitiness)

 

[Drunkula]

I've left off posting this in case it killed replies from here but it's had a good rattle of the bog-chain, so :

https://www.*************.com/post/dried-yeast-guide-8138330

I check that post a lot. It's a great little piece.

EDIT: Ooooh.... ok then.

 

[marshbrewer]

.and it also appears to suggest that MJ New World Strong is Notty, which would also amaze me as I've used that a lot, as well as Notty, and I don't get that Notty buttery taste with NWS?

 

[marshbrewer]

I've left off posting this in case it killed replies from here but it's had a good rattle of the bog-chain, so :

https://www.*************.com/post/dried-yeast-guide-8138330

I check that post a lot. It's a great little piece.

EDIT: Ooooh.... ok then.

What's the ******* bit?

Edit - it's ok, my super sleuth skills have worked!

 

[MickDundee]

I would be amazed if MJ Liberty Bell was S04 as suggested by the spreadsheet. Smells completely different, tastes completely different (I'm super sensitive to S04's tartness. I don't get that at all with Liberty Bell, I get lovely fruitiness)

It also suggests that k-97 and M54 are the same, but K-97 definitely has what I would describe as a German fruitiness whereas M54 is much cleaner and maltier. The temperature differences and fermentation behaviour (K-97 has a thick, firm Krausen that refuses to drop whereas M54 ferments quickly after a lag and drops pretty clear in the FV) also suggest they are different.

 

[BridgeBrew]

CML California common, and there new Kiwi pale ale yeast are both very good.

 

[matt76]

Was just browsing the Mangrove Jack website and found this useful PDF - as well as details of each yeast, at the end there are recommendations for yeasts for BJCP categories.

(@Rodcx500z - is that the booklet you mentioned you got from your LHBS?)

 

[johncrobinson]

Yeast is such an utterly amazing subject.
As a country winemaker my goto is ec1118

But this year i hope to get into beers,and am lulled in by this kviek yeast.

 

[dad_of_jon]

Yeah I think it is a style which IMO dry yeast struggles to achieve. That and some German\ belgian styles

A lot of people like wilko/ gervin yeast but for me it is the beige of yeasts .. I just prefer US05 for most styles in leiu

magnolia surely?

 

[Rodcx500z]

Was just browsing the Mangrove Jack website and found this useful PDF - as well as details of each yeast, at the end there are recommendations for yeasts for BJCP categories.

(@Rodcx500z - is that the booklet you mentioned you got from your LHBS?)

yeah that's the one Matt I find it useful being a novice

 

[marshbrewer]

Was just browsing the Mangrove Jack website and found this useful PDF - as well as details of each yeast, at the end there are recommendations for yeasts for BJCP categories.

(@Rodcx500z - is that the booklet you mentioned you got from your LHBS?)

Thanks for that pdf, really useful.

 

[Sadfield]

Regarding MJ M42 New World Strong Ale. A bit of left field thinking, that it could be Safale F-2, a yeast sold by fermentis as a bottle/cask conditioning yeast.

SafAle F-2 has been selected specifically for secondary fermentation in bottle and in cask. This yeast assimilates very little maltotriose but assimilates basic sugars (glucose, fructose, saccharose, maltose) and is caracterized by a neutral aroma profile respecting the base beer character.
SafAle F-2 resists to high alcohol levels (>10% v/v) and allows brewers to obtain all the properties of refermentation:
- Beer preservation thanks to oxygene trapping
- Contribution in roundness and maturation aromas
- Carbonation
- Sticks well at the bottom of the bottles/casks and forms a nice haze when it is resuspended

This echoes the MJ description and spec for M42, particularly the following from the PDF, that states it is good for bottle and cask conditioned beers and finishes dry, yet sweet and not thin, suggesting it has the same trait of fermenting all but the most complex of the sugars. Similarly clean and very alcohol tolerant.

Observable traits
AROMA CHARACTERISTICS: Hops and malt aromas are enhanced and will tend toward earthy, nutty, orange peel, and mild spice. Esters will be nearly absent in normal strength beers fermented cool; below 20°C (68°F).
FLAVOUR/MOUTHFEEL CHARACTERISTICS: Beers fermented with this strain will finish dry, and very light beers will not be thin or watery. Acidity will be low, and mouthfeel will be light and soft on the palate with a smooth non astringent texture. As this strain is highly flocculent and resilient and not prone to autolysis, it is excellent for cask or bottle conditioning.
HIGHER ALCOHOL BEERS: Ester formation will be slightly elevated in higher alcohol beers. The character of the esters will be pleasant with ripe apple and pear dominating, along with faint banana. Beer will be dry, but a perception of malt sweetness will survive in the aftertaste along with malt character and complexity. Alcohol should be warming, not hot.

 

[Pennine]

Windsor followed by one of Nottingham/Wilko/M42, which are generally regarded to be at least equivalent if not actual repacks of Nottingham. In fact you could use any of them (Wilko being the obvious one as it's the cheapest) to help flocculate any other yeasts that don't drop so well. The only problem with that is if you reuse yeast, you'll end up with a blend that will drift on repitching. But if you don't reuse yeast then it's a good solution.



We know most companies don't make their own dry yeast, they just repack ones from the big boys. So M20 is almost certainly a repack of something else, and Munich Classic would be an obvious choice for a Bavarian Wheat even if we can't say for sure at this stage. See this table for some pretty educated guesses about which strain correlates to which : https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/16XRUloO3WXqH9Ixsf5vx2DIKDmrEQJ36tLRBmmya7Jo/edit

Also this thread on HBT : https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/dry-yeasts-identified-your-opinions-please.670466/




The de Struise thing is only internet legend, but I offer it FWIW - they certainly make great beer.

I've found that with eg Chinook the biotransformation means you lose maybe 20% of hop intensity, but it turns the grapefruit of Chinook into something more limey and complex.

Seems legit and from de struise. Last time I was there the Brewers were very open to discussing brewing methods. I wish at the time I was more into brewing. So it's very likely the internet legend is accurate.

And we practically have the recipe!

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Good find - the original discussion is at http://www.thebrewingnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8801 where Sylvain adds a few more details about fermentation/conditioning temps etc.

 

[dad_of_jon]

This is MJ M36, right? Any styles in particular you recommend it for?

I did actually pick up a few packs of dry yeast recently - S04, US05, M15, M36, M44 (which I used yesterday) and W34/70 (which I plan to use in a German pils).

yup I always do a couple of wheat beers a year and I use the MJ bavarian wheat. you won't get a low FG compared to their other yeasts but you're looking for 5%-ish and it hits the spot.

 

[Winterbournebrewery]

Us05.