Partygate a new low.

[JeffDragon7]

Let me just refer you to my post,
The main point behind the whole thing is that Johnson stood up and repeatedly lied to the House.

Yep
Politician = liar
they may do it outright and in your face or they may use clever words but at the end of the day they lie or change the subject.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

The main point behind the whole thing is that Johnson stood up and repeatedly lied to the House.

Boris lied and if found guilty Starmer lied they should both resign but Boris wont, will Starmer?

 

[moto748]

Yep
Politician = liar
they may do it outright and in your face or they may use clever words but at the end of the day they lie or change the subject.

Unfortunately politicians who tell the truth rarely get elected. It's the same old story, people want the benefits of a civil society, but don't want to pay the taxes to fund them. A sensible poltician would say, Brexit was a terrible mistake (which it clearly was), but it'd be electoral death for anyone saying that, because 'you can't tell the public they were wrong'.

 

[JeffDragon7]

Boris lied and if found guilty Starmer lied they should both resign but Boris wont, will Starmer?

Be interesting to find out CT.

 

[An Ankoù]

Maybe later. Bit busy at the moment.
Is there a site where I can just copy and paste arguments against each point.
Maybe with a foreword with someone who's not Boris Johnson.
Jimmy Nail perhaps?

I agree with you, @Brianbrewed . Tory. Lies. Both four-letter words. Stands to reason.
Joking aside, and in all seriousness, how can anybody trust anything that comes out of the Cabinet? Since when is fact checking and going though all the points with a fine-toothed comb the job of the electorate? We have a right to be able to trust our Government; not necessarily agree with it, but at least to trust that it's telling the truth.
I'm getting more than a bit fed up with those Tory apologist gaslighters on this thread who think standing up to wrong has to be justified to the nth degree and that there should be balance.
Let's reconsider Hitler while we're at it, shall we?

 

[trueblue]

The main point behind the whole thing is that Johnson stood up and repeatedly lied to the House.
He has already been sacked for lying as a Cabinet member, unfortunately standards within this Conservative government have reached new depths.

He has also been sacked as a journalist - twice. It is some feat for a journalist to be sacked for lying - twice.

 

[Robin54]

And Starmer has today had a news conference banning GB News, with only 3 selected journalists with pre - prepared questions present - and then Starmer ran away from journalists. Its democracy at work whatever political pursuation you follow. They are all as bad as each other.

 

[Dutto]

Here’s a statement from The Accused which I thought some of you might like to read; especially those who condemn people before something is proven.

“Ever since the first covid lockdown, I have always followed the rules.

In that time, the British people have made heart-wrenching sacrifices.

People were left desperately lonely.

They were separated from family and friends tragically, many were unable to see dying loved ones.

This was a collective sacrifice.

People were entitled to expect that politicians would follow the same rules as everyone else.

When my mother-in-law passed away suddenly just before the lockdown, my wife and I were unable to provide her father with the support we wanted to afterwards, because we followed the rules.

Barely a day has passed where we haven’t agonised over that decision, but we did it, because we followed the rules.

We all found those rules frustrating at times -

And I’m no exception to that.

I had to isolate six times during covid, pulling me away from my work and the things that I love.

But I did it, because we followed the rules.

The idea that I would then casually break those rules is wrong.

And frankly I don’t believe those accusing me believe it themselves.

They are just trying to feed cynicism, to get the public to believe all politicians are the same.

I am here to say they’re not.

I believe in honour, integrity and the principle that those who make the laws must follow them.

And I believe that politicians who undermine that principle, undermine trust in politics, undermine our democracy, and undermine Britain.

I am absolutely clear that no laws were broken.

They were followed at all times.

I simply had something to eat while working late in the evening.

As any politician would do days before an election.

But if the police decide to issue me with a fixed penalty notice, I would, of course, do the right thing and step down.

This matters.

It matters because the British public deserve politicians who think the rules apply to them.

They deserve politicians who hold themselves to the highest standards.

And they deserve politicians who put the country first, rather than themselves.

They will always - always - get that from me.

Thank you.

Keir Starmer
Leader of the Labour Party”

Enjoy!
:hat:

 

[Chippy_Tea]

But if the police decide to issue me with a fixed penalty notice, I would, of course, do the right thing and step down.

Or to put it another way -

"If i ****** up and they have the evidence to prosecute me i will fall on my sword"

having called Boris out so many times over this what option do i have!

 

[Dutto]

……….

having called Boris out so many times over this what option do i have!

None of course, which is probably why the Daily Wail started up the “now he’s pressuring the police” ‘cos they knew he’d outflanked them and they had to respond.


Personally, I’m very conflicted!

If Mr Starmer is fined and resigns as a result:

• Will Boris follow suit? (It’s not something any sensible person would put money on!)
• Will the change of Leadership in the Labour Party strengthen or weaken the Party? (Again, I wouldn’t put on money either way!)

On the other hand, if Mr Starmer isn’t fined and doesn’t resign:

• How many people will realise that the Daily Wail’s original accusation was obviously false? and that
• No pressure was applied to the Durham Police

Again, not something to gamble on!

Yep! “Conflicted” just about sums up my thoughts!
:hat:

 

[DavidDetroit]

A similar situation arose here in the US. A Democrat (NY governor) screwed up badly and he was out.
A Republican screws up just as badly or worse. Nothing happens.
The difference is that the party will or won't stand for it.

 

[starseeker]

How about if Keir Starmer is found to of broke the rules but is not fined ? He could slip off the hook on a technicality ,he is a barrister after all.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

How about if Keir Starmer is found to of broke the rules but is not fined ? He could slip off the hook on a technicality ,he is a barrister after all.

I think that was the reason behind his "If i get a fixed penalty" speech if he doesn't get one he will stay.

 

[starseeker]

I would not be at all surprised if he has not already being told that whatever happens there will be no fine ,he is after all close to the police crime commissioner of Durham ,not that i am cynical mind :)

 

[Chippy_Tea]

If Mr Starmer is fined and resigns as a result:
Will Boris follow suit? (It’s not something any sensible person would put money on!)

Not a change he has weathered the storm he isn't going anywhere (we all know he should have gone)

Will the change of Leadership in the Labour Party strengthen or weaken the Party? (Again, I wouldn’t put on money either way!)

I don't think Stramer is the best man/woman for the job he comes over as a Tory in a red tie and i cringe every time he mentions his working class roots.

On the other hand, if Mr Starmer isn’t fined and doesn’t resign:
How many people will realise that the Daily Wail’s original accusation was obviously false? and that

If he isnt guilty he shouldnt stand down but i hope he does some time soon.

 

[Cheyne_brewer]

I’m not a Starmer fan but he seems to be acting with integrity. There is a world of difference between a party during lockdown whereby those who made the rules for all chose not to apply them to themselves and a group of people working late in an office having something to eat and drink to keep them going. If Starmer was pictured drinking a coffee or bottle of water and eating a slice of pizza would it affect perceptions?

The difference is in intent - a birthday party under strict lockdown is one thing, legitimately working & needing sustenance quite another. As someone who worked through lockdown delivering IT services to bank staff who were wholesale moved to home working I absolutely believe there is no case to answer and it’s just an attempt at ***-for-tat by the Do As I Say , Not As I Do party.

 

[Crappyfish]

Not a change he has weathered the storm he isn't going anywhere (we all know he should have gone)
I don't think Stramer is the best man/woman for the job he comes over as a Tory in a red tie and i cringe every time he mentions his working class roots.
If he isnt guilty he shouldnt stand down but i hope he does some time soon.

Yeah he's a bit boring who would you like to see. It's quite a tough decision.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Yeah he's a bit boring who would you like to see. It's quite a tough decision.

I would have to see a list of those who would like to throw their hat in.

 

[Dutto]

I would have to see a list of those who would like to throw their hat in.

How about Lisa Nandy?

She’s taken Boris to bits a few times during PMQ’s!
:hat:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lisa_Nandy

 

[moto748]

Anyone who can string a sentence together can take Johnson to bits; he offers you so much material! Nandy is my MP, but she can stay on the backbenches for me,

I think Cheyne_brewer sums it up well and fairly.