new pan

[Tony1951]

PS -

The only concern I have now about 'no cool' is the effect on the flame out hops. I'm thinking that the recipe intention was that these would go into the boiling wort and then rapid cooling would preserve the volatiles to add flavour, but in 'no cool' they end up at nearly boiling for hours on end. Don't know how that will effect results. Perhaps instead of adding Flame Out hops, it might be better to put them in some boiling water and then add the lot to the FV instead...... No idea really.

 

[MyQul]

Yes - properly done, it is pretty much like canning food. Heat it right up - keep it there - then seal it, and it's good for a long time. My problem was about meddling and lifting the lid on the insulated boiler now and again to see what was going on.....

Moral: Boil it - seal the vent with clingfilm - leave 24 hours to cool AND DO NOT TOUCH IT.

Then I can run it straight into the FV and pitch the yeast. That's the plan anyway. I had thought of buying a water carrier to store the hot wort, but why? The boiler can store the wort and then I'm not messing about with large volumes of boiling stuff in plastic carriers.

Yup, Leave it alone! As it cools the wort contract and can suck in microbes so you don't want to take the cling film/seal of before your ready to pitch.

The only point of the the cubes/plastic carriers as far as I can work out is to store your wort for a long time and I'm not entirely sure why people do that.

Another point, do you filter out the hops somehow or do you leave them in the boiling wort as it cools down? If you leave em in there you'll get a higher IBU than you planned. You can get things on calculators to adjust for this. Brewmate has a no-chill tick box. But you can get around it altogther by doing a 90 min boil as I''ve read that after 90 mins there is no more hop utilisation going on. So it doesn't matter if the hops are sitting in the hot wort for an extended period of time.

 

[Tony1951]

Another point, do you filter out the hops somehow or do you leave them in the boiling wort as it cools down? If you leave em in there you'll get a higher IBU than you planned. You can get things on calculators to adjust for this. Brewmate has a no-chill tick box. But you can get around it altogther by doing a 90 min boil as I''ve read that after 90 mins there is no more hop utilisation going on. So it doesn't matter if the hops are sitting in the hot wort for an extended period of time.

I've only used the new boiler once so far, so I'm completely new to this. In my first brew I couldn't remove the hops - though I could in future have them in a hop sock and fish them out. I used the no-chill tick box on Brewer's friend to work out IBU. My main concern was the effect on late additions.... They were boiled to buggery by the slow cool down. In future I am probably going to keep the late additions to add as a scalded addition to the FV - I mean pouring boiling water on them, leaving them for five minutes in that boiling water and adding it to the FV. Otherwise, my very slow cool down in an insulted boiler / mash tun will inevitably counteract the whole intention of a late hop addition - FO hops for example are not meant to sit in near boiling water for hours on end, and neither are the oils given off by them. A lot of the flavour oils and compounds of late additions are volatile and will dissipate in the steam given off in hot wort. I think I will adapt the recipes so that late additions go into the FV as hoptea (with leaves left in) or as dry hopping. That way, I am more likely to keep the volatiles as flavour and aroma.

 

[MyQul]

I've only used the new boiler once so far, so I'm completely new to this. In my first brew I couldn't remove the hops - though I could in future have them in a hop sock and fish them out. I used the no-chill tick box on Brewer's friend to work out IBU. My main concern was the effect on late additions.... They were boiled to buggery by the slow cool down. In future I am probably going to keep the late additions to add as a scalded addition to the FV - I mean pouring boiling water on them, leaving them for five minutes in that boiling water and adding it to the FV. Otherwise, my very slow cool down in an insulted boiler / mash tun will inevitably counteract the whole intention of a late hop addition - FO hops for example are not meant to sit in near boiling water for hours on end, and neither are the oils given off by them. A lot of the flavour oils and compounds of late additions are volatile and will dissipate in the steam given off in hot wort. I think I will adapt the recipes so that late additions go into the FV as hoptea (with leaves left in) or as dry hopping. That way, I am more likely to keep the volatiles as flavour and aroma.

I usually strain my hops out of the boiling wort using a seive before going intothe FV. Most of the recipes I folow from BYOBRA have hop schedule of 60/10 with the occasional reciepe calling for FO. I'm not much of a hop head but your thoughts and ideas on late additions sitting in the near boiling wort for ages give one pause for thought. For a 10 min addition would you think your 'scalding' method would be approriate do you think?

 

[Tony1951]

I usually strain my hops out of the boiling wort using a seive before going intothe FV. Most of the recipes I folow from BYOBRA have hop schedule of 60/10 with the occasional reciepe calling for FO. I'm not much of a hop head but your thoughts and ideas on late additions sitting in the near boiling wort for ages give one pause for thought. For a 10 min addition would you think your 'scalding' method would be approriate do you think?

I was thinking that way, but I have to say, I'm a complete beginner at AG, having done so far only five. Four of them were small brews done in a 12l pot, so I am just firing off ideas and expecting someone 'who knows' to put me straight if they are ridiculous in some way.

 

[MyQul]

I tend to regard hops simply as a balance to the malt sweetness so don't bother doing much research about them (I'm more interested in other stuff like yeast). So don't know the effects of no chill on late additions just the stuff I've already posted about bittering.

Clibit's the man to to 'speak' to about hops but he hasn't been on the forum for few days. Maybe he's on holiday

 

[MyQul]

I was thinking that way, but I have to say, I'm a complete beginner at AG, having done so far only five. Four of them were small brews done in a 12l pot, so I am just firing off ideas and expecting someone 'who knows' to put me straight if they are ridiculous in some way.

It's too feckin hot in London at the mo (about 30C and bleedin humid) so I've just been sitting in me pants reading homebrew articles, and I think I've sussed what to do.

Basically...If I was doing a 10 min addition, set aside some of your wort (in the thread below they're using 3L, but that's for a full brewlengh so thats 13%. If your doing 12L set aside 1.5L. Then boil it for 15 mins. At the 10 min point chuck in the hops. Cool wort in sink then add to main body of wort.

Have a look at this forum thread and you'll be able to work out what you want to do seeing as there are a number of different suggested ways to do it all base on the same 'take some wort out, boil, then add additions' way

http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/49819-late-hopping-and-nochilling-it-can-be-done/

Never really thought about no chill and late additions before but I think I will be doing this from now on

 

[Tony1951]

Have a look at this forum thread and you'll be able to work out what you want to do seeing as there are a number of different suggested ways to do it all base on the same 'take some wort out, boil, then add additions' way

http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/49819-late-hopping-and-nochilling-it-can-be-done/

Never really thought about no chill and late additions before but I think I will be doing this from now on

Excellent find that MyQul. Basically, I can omit the late additions, let the wort cool in the boiler for 24 hours, then tap off a few litres into my Wilco brewing pot and put on stove to boil. Meanwhile, drain the now cool wort from boiler into FV Add the late hops for five minutes or whatever time is required to the boiling wort in wilco pot, and then decant through a strainer into the cool wort and pitch.

That should work well I think and no stewed late additions.....

 

[MyQul]

Excellent find that MyQul. Basically, I can omit the late additions, let the wort cool in the boiler for 24 hours, then tap off a few litres into my Wilco brewing pot and put on stove to boil. Meanwhile, drain the now cool wort from boiler into FV Add the late hops for five minutes or whatever time is required to the boiling wort in wilco pot, and then decant through a strainer into the cool wort and pitch.

That should work well I think and no stewed late additions.....

Exactly! This is what I'm going to do too. :thumb:

 

[Tony1951]

Exactly! This is what I'm going to do too. :thumb:

It's been hot and humid here today, but nothing like 30C. Maybe 25C - not sure, but pretty warm. Had a string of thunder showers over last two hours and big downpours. I was cutting hedges and was glad to stop. Had a shower while the downpour got going. Saw some pretty cool lightening flashes - great big zig zag forks coming out of the sky to earth about two miles away. Hope its doesn't curdle me ale..... :electric:

 

[MyQul]

It's been hot and humid here today, but nothing like 30C. Maybe 25C - not sure, but pretty warm. Had a string of thunder showers over last two hours and big downpours. I was cutting hedges and was glad to stop. Had a shower while the downpour got going. Saw some pretty cool lightening flashes - great big zig zag forks coming out of the sky to earth about two miles away. Hope its doesn't curdle me ale..... :electric:

It's orrible at the moment 30C is a consevative estimate based on the BBC weather report for London being 35C :shock:. Took a wander up to the supermarket to buy some 500ml water bottles to freeze for the water bath as I'm brewing tommorow and nearly died of heat stroke on the way back

 

[MyQul]

Been doing a bit more research on no chill and late hop additions and it seems that 'hop standing' or adding your 15min-20min additions at flameout has the same effect flavour wise

 

[dad_of_jon]

Been doing a bit more research on no chill and late hop additions and it seems that 'hop standing' or adding your 15min-20min additions at flameout has the same effect flavour wise

so adding more high AA hops at start of a 15-20 min boil and then chucking flavour hops in at flameout means you can do a short boil and then no-chill overnight? That would give a similar result to trad brew times but reduces the amount of effort to brew e.g shorter boil and no coil chiller or ice packs etc.

the only disadvantage I see would be splitting a brew over 2 days. but for me it means I could do the first part in the evening and have pitched before lunch having had a lie-in the following morning :party:

 

[MyQul]

so adding more high AA hops at start of a 15-20 min boil and then chucking flavour hops in at flameout means you can do a short boil and then no-chill overnight? That would give a similar result to trad brew times but reduces the amount of effort to brew e.g shorter boil and no coil chiller or ice packs etc.

the only disadvantage I see would be splitting a brew over 2 days. but for me it means I could do the first part in the evening and have pitched before lunch having had a lie-in the following morning :party:

That would kinda work but what your proposing is doing a 15-20 min total boil time? I've not really come across anyone doing a boil this short but there a brulospophy experiment where he does a 30min vs 60min boil with not much difference between the two: http://brulosophy.com/2015/03/11/the-impact-of-boil-length-ale-exbeeriment-results/

So what you could do is add loads of hops at 30mins to get your correct bittering addition IBU then add your flavour hops at flame out (i'd suggest you do a bit of research on exactly what late addition time corrispondsto no chill flame out) and then dry hop for aroma as no chill batters your aroma addition as all the hop oils evaporate away with the steam unless you use a cube which traps em in.

I'm actually going try a three day brew day on my next brew.

D1 - Overnight Mash
D2- Sparge, Boil & no chill
D3- Pitch Yeast

 

[Southport_sunset]

I recently bought a 33l stock pot for around £35 (inc delivery)
It was from a german company called bergland but goes under catering-portal on german ebay.
They do cheap pots up to 100l, thermopots with spigots as well.
I contacted them by email: [email protected]
Whilst reading through forums it seemed as if they had stopped exporting to U.K for a period but have now resumed.
Very swift response and delivery, would recomend. Quality seems good but not brewed in it as of yet

 

[Tony1951]

Interesting article on 30 minute boil Myqul. I'd have thought you might not get a proper hot break, but not a problem, at least on that occasion. I think I'll stick with 60 mins though - I like my IBUs too much and am too tight to be forking out more for hops to get the same effect only 30 mins quicker.

 

[MyQul]

Interesting article on 30 minute boil Myqul. I'd have thought you might not get a proper hot break, but not a problem, at least on that occasion. I think I'll stick with 60 mins though - I like my IBUs too much and am too tight to be forking out more for hops to get the same effect only 30 mins quicker.

There's not that much difference in IBU between a 30min boil and a 60min, . Well not with the lowish IBU beers I make anyway may be 4 or 5 IBU. Might give it a go next brew.

 

[BeerCat]

Can you post up some links please to the pots your using? I cant seem to find any Induction ones on wilko's website I just bought the brupaks 32l and its does not work properly. The induction does not always come on and after 30mins of full power still hadn't heated 5l of water over 70c. Gonna use it to chill with in the sink but i still need a smaller pot. A 15l or even 20l would be ideal. My hob is only 18cm. Thanks

 

[MyQul]

It's too feckin hot in London at the mo (about 30C and bleedin humid) so I've just been sitting in me pants reading homebrew articles, and I think I've sussed what to do.

Basically...If I was doing a 10 min addition, set aside some of your wort (in the thread below they're using 3L, but that's for a full brewlengh so thats 13%. If your doing 12L set aside 1.5L. Then boil it for 15 mins. At the 10 min point chuck in the hops. Cool wort in sink then add to main body of wort.

Have a look at this forum thread and you'll be able to work out what you want to do seeing as there are a number of different suggested ways to do it all base on the same 'take some wort out, boil, then add additions' way

http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/49819-late-hopping-and-nochilling-it-can-be-done/

Never really thought about no chill and late additions before but I think I will be doing this from now on

Well I've just tried boiling 3L of wort that I made yesterday and adding a late addition. It was supposed to be a 10min addition but I accidently chucked it in as soon as the wort was boiling so it is a 15 min addition - can think the extra 5 mins will make much of a difference.

I blended the 3L with the rest of the wort and took a gravity sample. After of course, I tried the trial jar. It really does seem to work. The trial jar had a lovely soft hop flavour from the EKG I added, which I never used to have in my sweet worts before.

The only downside was things took longer than expected because this is the first time I've done it. Hopefully the next time I do this the time should be shorter as I streamline my technique

 

[dad_of_jon]

That would kinda work but what your proposing is doing a 15-20 min total boil time? I've not really come across anyone doing a boil this short but there a brulospophy experiment where he does a 30min vs 60min boil with not much difference between the two: http://brulosophy.com/2015/03/11/the-impact-of-boil-length-ale-exbeeriment-results/

So what you could do is add loads of hops at 30mins to get your correct bittering addition IBU then add your flavour hops at flame out (i'd suggest you do a bit of research on exactly what late addition time corrispondsto no chill flame out) and then dry hop for aroma as no chill batters your aroma addition as all the hop oils evaporate away with the steam unless you use a cube which traps em in.

I'm actually going try a three day brew day on my next brew.

D1 - Overnight Mash
D2- Sparge, Boil & no chill
D3- Pitch Yeast

I tried the no chill you suggested - I'm a fan.

I extract brew so 15 mins boil is to kill anything in the DME. I know hop utilization takes a hit but for me the extra hop cost is acceptable(ish). Time in kitchen to brew is limited so that's what limits my brewing rather than ingredient cost. Having tried AG I can understand the pull of it but it's not the best option for me.