How to tell when conversion is complete

[Sadfield]

Sounds like an efficiency mismatch issue. Geterbrewed kits designed for a higher efficiency than they are currently achieving.

From Geterbrew's instructions.

"Due to the wide variety of brewing equipment, we have included generic instructions and should be used as basic guidelines.
You may find minor differences or a need to adjust times and amounts as you gain knowledge of your own system.
These recipes are based on a 75% efficiency. Efficiency can range from 65-80% depending on your system"

As the grain is a fixed quantity in the kit, use less water.

 

[Caramel Ox]

I assume this kit https://www.geterbrewed.com/crisp-golden-ale-kit/
It’s a crisp kit. They have assumed 80% mash efficiency and 81% attenuation neither of which I think you are likely to achieve. So overall I just don’t think it’s a good kit.

 

[Twostage]

Predicted FG was 1008 but actual was 1012 so with the OG of 1043 made a low abv beer - very thin.

My experience of Windsor is a highish FG, possibly higher than your 1.012. A high FG should actually give you a full, sweetish mouthfeel rather than thin one as the un-fermented sugars fill your mouth but I sort of know what you mean, lower ABV can taste watery.

Still pondering the low carbonation part. Like I said the carbonation is dependent on the fermentable you add to the bottles/barrel. What did you use for carbonation ?

 

[David Woods]

I batch carbonated with dextrose - used an online calculator which gave 160g for 23 ltrs.

 

[Brewshed]

I agree with Sadfield and Caramel Ox. Putting the numbers into a brewhouse efficiency calculator they have based it on an 80% efficiency (which is difficult to achieve in home brewing) and you have achieved 65% (which is on the low side but not unheard of. I generally get 70% efficiency but occasionally it will drop to about 67%). You have about 4.6kg of grain in the kit but for a 1048 at about 33 litres I would normally have nearer 5kg grain. I am not sure about the carbonation issue. 160g dextrose seems quite a lot so should have given a high carbonation.

 

[The Baron]

So it looks like the kits are based on a higher EFF than you are achieving and the Windsor yeast as also contributed to the overall low ABV.
I had the Brewmonk and used to get between 70/75 Brewhouse eff so maybe worth looking at your process to improve the EFF. When buying AG kits look to see what eff they have based it on or asked if not in the info or make your own recipes to suit your system and EFF.
A easy way of improving EFF is longer mash and a few stirs here and there but that is only a quick assessment of how.
Another thread about AIO EFF improvements should get you loads of help to improve it or search the forum as it will have been answered many times

 

[Mash Monster]

I’m with you guys on Geterbrewed kits I recently purchased a Belgian Dubble kit from them which boasted an ABV of 7.8%. I duly plugged the figures into Brewfather and couldn’t get anywhere near their estimate even brewing short by several litres. I contacted them about this and was referred to the instructions that @Sadfield has posted #21. Strangely they have now amended the recipe to show a 6.5% ABV This is not an isolated incident, however I shan’t elaborate as I don’t won’t to be seen to be bad mouthing Geterbrewed

 

[The Baron]

If that is so it is not good marketing quoting higher figures to achieve as most established brewers would struggle to get that. Lets hope they have responded MM to all the kits in that way as it will cause a issue with plenty of systems

 

[Vinylwasp]

Sorry not paying attention! Yes the OG is low - 1041 instead of the expected 1048 and I even brewed at 23l instead of 25l in the recipe. The pre boil gravity seemed OK - using a refractometer.

Ok so you missed your target OG which points to conversion rather than attenuation, but just out of interest what was your FG?
Also:
what grain:water ratio are you mashing in at, i.e., how much strike water are you using?
what is the temp of the strike water?
mash pH?
what software are you using with the Brewmonk?

 

[David Woods]

So it seems the kits - and my inexperience may be at fault. this is the third brew with ingredients from GEB. The first was not a kit but based on a recipe I was given with about 5.2 kg of grain and US-05 Yeast. This was my first A/G and it turned out fine, nice abv and good carbonation.

I then bought two kits from them to practice with - an amber ale and a golden ale. Both of these kits produced a low OG and low carbonation and both had Lallemand yeast and fermented very very quickly leaving a thin under carbed beer. I think given the amount of work and time involved in making kits I will avoid them in future. GEB have good prices and have been good but I think the kits need to be improved if this is going to be the result.

Of course my lack of knowledge hasn't helped but I have been very careful with the process.

 

[David Woods]

Ok so you missed your target OG which points to conversion rather than attenuation, but just out of interest what was your FG?
Also:
what grain:water ratio are you mashing in at, i.e., how much strike water are you using?
what is the temp of the strike water?
mash pH?
what software are you using with the Brewmonk?

Final gravity was 1010, I mashed at 17L - the Brew Monk has about 3L space below the malt pipe so 15L is too low. Strike water was about 71c, ph was 5.25.

When you say which software - I assume you mean like Brewfather? I used this but being new I kind of followed the recipe instructions I was given.

 

[Rodcx500z]

I assume you mean like Brewfather? I used this but being new I kind of followed the recipe instructions I was given.

This is were it has gone wrong, the recipe is based on their equipment, when i by a kit i always put the ingredients into brewfather, also have you set up the brew monk profile in brewfather

 

[David Woods]

This is were it has gone wrong, the recipe is based on their equipment, when i by a kit i always put the ingredients into brewfather, also have you set up the brew monk profile in brewfather

Sorry should have said that I did enter the ingredients and use the Brew Monk profile in Brewfather.

 

[Rodcx500z]

Just looked on brewfather and there is no profile for brewmonk, what i would do is set the machine up with the grain basket in then fill it to the level of the bottom of the grain basket, now pour the water into a large jug or bucket and measure it this is dead water under the basket

 

[Sadfield]

I'd take a step backwards and do as @Rodcx500z suggests. Also, I'd not rely on measurements on vessels, I'd spend the time filling them a litre at a time, making your own marks where possible, or a dipstick (or ullage stick).

Hopefully, there's someone on here who can share a reliable Brewmonk Profile for Brewfather, also.

I'd suggest making your next to brews with 5kg of pale malt only, a hop of choice and a reliable yeast like Nottingham. Use a nice round figure for total water volumn, and just brew without worrying about targets.

Measure everything as accurately as possible, volumns and gravities. Then use the data collected over the two brews to calculate your efficiencies, and make your own profile.

And, get some iodine. It's great for removing any doubt about conversion.

 

[The Baron]

I do not use Brewfather but the Brewmonk is the same as the Angelbrew, Klarstein, Ace and Brewdevil etc so hopefully there may be a profile for one of those on Brewfather

 

[Rodcx500z]

the dead space for Klarstein Maischfest 35 L is 7.5L

 

[allotment_fox]

With conversion question if its not possible to do an iodine test, just do a taste test on the grain,'
also recirculating during the mash and a mash out will help

 

[foxy]

Simple to do an iodine test. Get some iodine and dilute it into 1 part iodine 6 parts isopropyl or even water. Take a sample from the mash, just wort no bits, let it cool to ambient, and using a dropper or syringe put one drop into the wort sample.
If the wort stays brown/dark, then there is still starch in the mash if it clears to the colour of the sample you have a good indication the conversion is complete.

 

[The Baron]

I stopped doing Iodine tests years ago as I have never had a problem it had a 80% BHE and over 2 points above predicted SG