herms rims or just stay as we are

[shocker]

Muddydiscos RR jobs ? Range Rover ? Rail Road ? Royal Rogering ? Road Rage ? Renal Retention ? Rick Rubin ? :wha:

Im confused (again) :?

 

[Frisp]

Muddydiscos RR jobs ? Range Rover ? Rail Road ? Royal Rogering ? Road Rage ? Renal Retention ? Rick Rubin ? :wha:

Im confused (again) :?

Very definitely Rolls Royce,, I have one of these hand crafted works of art they are the Mutts Nutts,,,

 

[Mark1964]

Im still not clear on the overall herms process i understand 90% of it now the only part im not really clear on is the bit when you finish the mash after 90 mins whatever. Then its sparge time Does the pump play a part in sparging or does gravity sort it out??

 

[evanvine]

I increase my HERMS temp to 74C, connect the pump to the HLT and the HERMS output to the spinny sparger (or other sparging method).
The MT output goes to the boiler as normal

 

[Mark1964]

i see i get it now how long does it take to get the herms temp up from 66 to 74 then?

 

[Frisp]

i see i get it now how long does it take to get the herms temp up from 66 to 74 then?

You should have brought your HLT Temp up to darn near 74 before hooking it up to your heat exchanger. That way no heating Lag for your sparge..

 

[Springer]

Think you have got it now Mark, but just to clarify how I do it.
Leave pump and HE connected as before from the bottom of the mash tun
Let in sparge water by gravity into the top of the tun, I connect the spreader the was connected to the end of the HE out.
I then re set the HE as Frisp said and direct the output to the boiler, using the pump by pass, (quite open to give a low pump out ) to balance the flow with the water going in.
I find that the limiting factor with sparging is the time it takes to heat up to boiling point.
As soon as one element is covered on it goes, 3kw and then when the other is covered on that goes.
To my mind its no good filling the boiler by "fast" sparging to produce a boiler full of water that takes ages to heat to boiling,
i.e. spend heating up time sparging.
S
P.S.

Muddydiscos RR jobs ? Range Rover ? Rail Road ? Royal Rogering ? Road Rage ? Renal Retention ? Rick Rubin ? :wha:

Sorry Shock, but like your lateral thinking, :lol: thanks Frisp.

 

[evanvine]

Mark, it's as Frisp says!
During the mash period my HLT has been topped up and the PID set to 74C.
I pass the sparging liquor through the HE for two reasons:-
1 it replaces any heat losses.
2 it cleans the pump and HE.

To heat 2ltrs of water in the HE from 66 to 74 only takes a min or so.

 

[Springer]

Yes E, this is another option, which does sound better than my way, will give it a try
Probably will need a bit more of Vossy's hose, :lol:
S

 

[Mark1964]

Will probably understand properly when I actually do a brew but I think I've got it now I hope

 

[pjbiker]

First time out with my new HERMS system. I struggled with the flow rate (0.6-0.9L/m) and didn't really achieve a clear wort. I also started with too cool a mash (60 deg) which I was unable to get up to a reasonable mash temperature (as measured at the outflow) for over an hour. My efficiency was definitely down though I've not worked out exactly how much, probably around 65%.
The brew fermented down OK and tastes good and is clear.
Several things to try next time.
1. thinner mash (I usually use just over 2:1 ratio because my mash tun is a bit too small TBH) therefore, less grain.
2. let mash settle 10mins before pumping.
3. Invest in a false bottom, as currently my strainer is a 900mmx15mm SS braided hose with the hose cut out.
4. be more careful with the strike temperature and initial mixing.

Its all part of the experimentation.
I was very pleased how the actual HE and PID performed. It's outflow was bang on the whole time, just the flow rate was low.

 

[Vossy1]

Good and bad then, but well done on your maiden voyage :party:
A thinner mash and fb will definitely help. I usually use 2.5/1 but don't forget to add any 'dead space' to that figure.

which I was unable to get up to a reasonable mash temperature (as measured at the outflow) for over an hour.

Are you saying it wouldn't increase the temp from 60deg c to mash temp :hmm: . That sounds like an issue with heat exchange, and at that low flow rate you shouldn't have had any issues.

edit

I was very pleased how the actual HE and PID performed. It's outflow was bang on the whole time, just the flow rate was low.

Ahh...even so you recirced somewhere over 36ltrs of runnings, it should have got there.
Might be worth ramping the PID up to 70 deg c next time and then throttling it back when it reaches temp.

 

[artiums_enteri]

I brew on a 10 gallon RIMS system, and would not change back to a cooler or extract for the world. Having a fully automated brewery which simply needs button turns and toggles to make great award winning beer is very nice indeed.

I would not however recommend this setup to a newer all grain brewer. New brewers need to learn the science, the PH balance, fermentation temp control, boiling of sulfides, recipe formulation and many other key parts of brewing before they should be worrying about equipment like this. Plus I believe a new all grain brewer really should learn the true process of brewing without automation and after 5-6 hour long brew days of hauling 20 gallons of water up a three tier system, then maybe make the investment.

 

[Mark1964]

been there done it i know how it feels to hump 35 litres out in the yard so therefore need to upgrade we have been brewing over a year now and feel its time to progress :thumb:

 

[evanvine]

we have been brewing over a year now and feel its time to progress

Been brewing over 26 years and I am still progressing

 

[pjbiker]

Good and bad then, but well done on your maiden voyage :party:
A thinner mash and fb will definitely help. I usually use 2.5/1 but don't forget to add any 'dead space' to that figure.

which I was unable to get up to a reasonable mash temperature (as measured at the outflow) for over an hour.

Are you saying it wouldn't increase the temp from 60deg c to mash temp :hmm: . That sounds like an issue with heat exchange, and at that low flow rate you shouldn't have had any issues.

edit
[quote:patybc75]I was very pleased how the actual HE and PID performed. It's outflow was bang on the whole time, just the flow rate was low.

Ahh...even so you recirced somewhere over 36ltrs of runnings, it should have got there.
Might be worth ramping the PID up to 70 deg c next time and then throttling it back when it reaches temp.[/quote:patybc75]

Thanks Vossy, didn’t read this til after second time out and had much more success, thinner mash, let it settle before pumping, much higher flow rate (2.2L/min). Posted on my evolution thread.
viewtopic.php?p=210744#p210744

 

[pjbiker]

Im still not clear on the overall herms process i understand 90% of it now the only part im not really clear on is the bit when you finish the mash after 90 mins whatever. Then its sparge time Does the pump play a part in sparging or does gravity sort it out??

It's your choice, I see some use the HE and PID and pump sparge water through it (as Evanvine) I like that. The way my system is plumbed I have to use gravity, as the pump is tranferring from mash tun to boiler (as Springer). Obviously, you need to get your sparge liquor up to temperature during the mash period. I learned that I had to use the pump to get it into the HLT BEFORE STARTING THE RECIRC, As I had to use a jug and steps the first time :lol:
If you have the luxury of 2 pumps, you could do both I suppose.

 

[Mark1964]

can safely say the herms was a good investment i dont know if herms makes a difference to fermenting time as the 1st herms brew is still fermenting after 2 and a half weeks where as before it was usually ready to keg in a week. Also efficiency has gone right up the last brew target gravity was supposed to be 1.042 it ended up nearer 1.062 so definate improvement there :thumb:

 

[evanvine]

I agree Mark!
I have done several HERMS brews, all had higher OGs snd longer ferments.

 

[kebabman]

Why does herms make the ferments longer?