First Ageing (on a budget) Process Help

[aolcot]

Hi All,
I've been all grain brewing for a year now and really enjoying it.. I've made a number of very drinkable beers during 2016. Next year though I want to brew my first high ABV/Aged beer so it is ready for next christmas. I have a average range of equipment but can't afford to buy a used whiskey barrel or similar to age in, hence trying to come up with something else.

So here is a general outline that I have been working through in my head at the moment. Can anyone offer any advice or potential for problems with this please? I'm keen to avoid any mistakes as i don't want to throw away a beer that was a year in the making lol!..

1) brew all grain high abv stout style recipe (approx 10%) and ferment in the primary as per any normal ale. Was going to pitch 2 smack packs and maybe pitch another smack pack after around 7-10 days depending on fermentation is going
2) once finished, transfer to secondary FV and add bourbon soaked raisins/little vanilla essence
3) let sit in secondary FV for around 4 months
4) transfer to bottling bucket, pitch another smack pack/add sugar + bottle. condition for a further 3 months or so..

so general questions i have:
1) is this sensible or way off the mark? I can't afford a used barrel to age in.
2) what temp should i keep the secondary FV at? i was thinking around 8-10 degrees C or does this need to be similar temps as fermentation?
3) does the secondary need a bubbler or should it be sealed?
4) do i need more yeast at bottling time or will there be just enough left to carbonate?

My FV's are glass carboys and brew in a sealed grow tent so i can control temps + light fairly well.

Looking forward to hearing any help and suggestions..

Thanks.... Arthur

 

[IainM]

Hi Arthur,
I've only done short bulk conditioning (<6 weeks), but have read about it and your plan sounds like you have too!

(1) I would make a starter for a beer this big, as 2/3 smack packs mightn't be able to cut it. Big beers need more yeast not just because there is more alcohol to produce, but because they struggle more as the ABV increases, so you can't just double the amount needed for a 5% beer for a 10% beer. If you are putting in the effort to brew big and age for a long time, best to give it the best chance with a healthy initial yeast population. I'd also leave it in primary for at least three weeks, maybe four, and cold crash prior to racking.
(2) This sounds lovely!
(3) Glass carboy is perfect. Ideally you'd want to fill it as much as possible. After long enough in primary it will stop fermenting so you can seal it up completely, though a bubbler can't do any harm as long as you check it periodically to make sure the liquid hasn't evaporated. Low temp is good.
(4) Good idea to pitch some extra yeast. I'm currently carbing up a batch that was cold crashed for a month. It is getting there, but it is slow.

 

[aolcot]

Hi,
Thanks for the detailed info, that makes a lot of sense and very helpful.

With regards to the starter, how big would you recommend for a brew like this?

Although I do have one of those Erlenmeyer flasks, albeit only 1L, i've never made a starter. I've a couple of lagers planned before this big one so I can get a bit of practice in first..

Thanks again..

 

[strange-steve]

Iain's advice is spot on as usual. Just a couple of additionals, about 8 weeks at 10° is a good starting point for bulk aging. Use a pack of rehydrated US05 rather than another smack pack for your bottling yeast it's cheap and hardy and will make no difference to the taste.
For your starter you'll probably need about 2L if you have a stir plate or maybe 3L or more if using the shaking method.

 

[aolcot]

Thanks for the update Steve that info helps. I don't have the luxury of a stir plate yet so I'll invest in a bigger flask beforehand. If dried yeast is just as good at bottling time then I'll defo do that. I always have a couple of emergency dried packs on hand.

Just so i fully understand the time period, does your comment say that I should age for about 8 weeks before bottling it (being my first and all that) or rather, 8 weeks is the absolute minimum i need to age a beer like this for?

Thanks Again

 

[H0PM0NSTER]

I'm not sure I'd have the patience, but it sounds like it could turn out to be a corker.
I would go with a bubbler for your secondary FV (at least initially), as you might get a little extra fermentation from the sugar in the bourbon soaked raisins. Have you thought about adding some oak chips or cubes to the secondary? I've never used them, but there's a few articles on the web and it sounds like this would complement your recipe nicely.

 

[aolcot]

Hi H0pm0nster - thanks, I hope it turns out to be a corker too :lol:
Using chips has crossed my mind as well but i'm somewhat nervous about throwing too many things together that i've no experience with together especially around getting the balance right. I'm thinking that if this first big beer goes ok, then next time i'll do a split batch and definitely experiment with different things, different chips etc.
Your point with extra fermentation makes sense. I am leaning to using a bubbler though now, at least for the first few weeks. I'm going to get a cheap fridge off ebay to make sure a get a consistent temp. I was concerned about temp flucuations causing negative pressure through the bubbler but a fridge should solve that I hope.
Thanks again for all the advice.

 

[strange-steve]

Thanks for the update Steve that info helps. I don't have the luxury of a stir plate yet so I'll invest in a bigger flask beforehand. If dried yeast is just as good at bottling time then I'll defo do that. I always have a couple of emergency dried packs on hand.

Just so i fully understand the time period, does your comment say that I should age for about 8 weeks before bottling it (being my first and all that) or rather, 8 weeks is the absolute minimum i need to age a beer like this for?

Thanks Again

I would say 8 weeks would be enough in the secondary at 10℃ before bottling. I did that for my 10% quad and it helped smooth it out. A lengthy conditioning period in the bottle will help too.

Regarding your starter, if you buy a 5L bottle of water from Tesco the bottle is perfect for making up big starters using the shaken not stirred method.
Or have a look at my "stir plate for under a tenner" thread here.

 

[aolcot]

Or have a look at my "stir plate for under a tenner" thread here.

That is epic! I'm building me one of those over the chrimbo break. :thumb:

Thanks for clearing up the other point. I'll trim the time in the secondary to a couple of months then before bottling.

Great. looks like I have the foundation now to crack on. I just need to get on and do it! :lol:

Thanks for all the comments everyone; they've really helped me work out how best to approach this brew..

 

[Llanbrewer]

I'm not sure I'd have the patience, but it sounds like it could turn out to be a corker.
I would go with a bubbler for your secondary FV (at least initially), as you might get a little extra fermentation from the sugar in the bourbon soaked raisins. Have you thought about adding some oak chips or cubes to the secondary? I've never used them, but there's a few articles on the web and it sounds like this would complement your recipe nicely.

How steady do you have to take it with the prune porter? :whistle:

 

[H0PM0NSTER]

How steady do you have to take it with the prune porter? :whistle:

Pretty steady, but it keeps me regular :)
It's actually conditioned into quite a nice stout with good raisin and fruit flavours but it's taken a year to get there!