Bosch
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I hate talking about Farrage, but I see he was blaming NATO and the EU for provoking Russia into attacking Ukraine.
Farrage on NATO
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The Ukrainian war could of been avoided, he is telling some truth. NATO expanding is one factor.
Agentgonzo
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He's like Ryan air. Will say anything to keep himself in the headlines and drum up publicity
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Perfectly true. Russia warned NATO in 2008 not to recruit Georgia or Ukraine into Nato, to make matters worse Nato and Ukraine carried out military operations in 2021. What was the urgency to recruit Ukraine into NATO?
Ukraine and Georgia are sovereign nations, and have the right to do as they wish.
Putin makes threats about things all the time, it doesn’t give him the right to invade sovereign nations.
The only blame NATO nations should take is that they didn’t take the threat of Putin seriously much sooner, and as a result we’re on the verge of WW3.
I highly recommend reading “Winter is Coming” by Gary Kasparov to understand Putin’s view of the world and modus operandi.
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I am well aware they are sovereign nations, but while a very large and powerful country that has an authoritarian dictator is their neighbour, it is far better not to antagonise the bear.
NATO knew what it was doing when they carried out military operations with Ukraine in 2021 on Russia's doorstep and Putin fell for it by going into Ukraine. The resulting war and sanctions have damaged the world economy more than the Russian economy plus the loss of lives of a great number of people.
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It isn't about what the EU did, more what it didn't do. The existing rules on third countries could have been made more lenient for a member who has been in the EU for 40 plus years, Barnier played it by the strictest rules possible, standards don't change overnight.
France threatening to cut power over fishing right wasn't exactly friendly.
As for getting laughed at the Poms should be used to that by now.
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Bosch
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NATO had the war game after Russia massed troops on the Ukraine border.
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All the more reason for not going ahead, but they wanted Russia to cross the border, that was the reasoning.
Bosch
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Why would NATO want a war with Russia?
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They don't, they want Ukraine to have the war. America and NATO purposely ignored what Russia believed to be against their own national interest. All America and NATO had to do was wait, there was no urgency in recruiting Ukraine into NATO.
While Ukraine and Georgia have been invaded, Estonia and Latvia who share large borders with Russia have not, and have been free to follow their own political and economic paths.
Perhaps if they had not joined NATO then they could have been vassal states of Russia like Belarus, and Putin wouldn’t have felt as threatened.
I have two issues with this idea.
1. Belarus and Ukraine are really poor. Belarusians in particular are not remotely free. In comparison Estonia and Latvia are flourishing with free trade and movement of workers. Who are we to say that Ukraine must remain poor to avoid bruising the ego of a despot?
2. Putin grabs everything he can. If it wasn’t Ukraine it would have been somewhere else he could exploit.
Sorry, where do you take the figures?
The reason why I am doubtful is because I knew several people who did one of the following:
1. One was offered a job in London, but moved to Belorussia from Russia because he concluded his buying capacity would be higher there. And it turned out to be true - he built himself a mansion, got 6 kids, quite settled and confident (though now thinking to migrate to Latin America if the war starts)
2. LBS MBA student from Lithuania, he absolutely confidently told me he would move to Russia instead of staying in London or moving back to Vilnius because Russia offers way more opportunities for him
3. A friend of mine who works for Apple now, but used to be a researcher in a university. He told me he liked taking PhD students from Eastern Europe outside the EU because he could not trust EU students - they often quit unexpectedly if they found a job. While he liked taking students from Russia, their number dropped by 2015 because a scholarship did not attract them any more, so he focused on Central Asia until he got an offer from Apple
4. I worked extensively with people from Ukraine, Kazakhstan and Russia. There were much more people willing to relocate to the UK from Ukraine than from Russia or Kazakhstan. In fact, I myself contemplated relocating to Kazakhstan (though glad I didn’t eventually, Astana is quite boring place, Almaty is much more fun, but the offer was for Astana)
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Right have to make a few disclaimers here
1. I am not a Reform voter or a fan of Nigel Farage
2. Due to nature of my former jobs I directly worked in a NATO related role so have to be careful in what I say here.
On the comments made by Farage I think they have been taken out of proportion on this occasion yes Nigel has some cringe worthy sound bites but on this occasion he was making the point correctly it turns out that the strategy and actions of NATO were in effect poking the bear. I think he was making the point that greater statesmanship or joined up thinking by world leaders this could have turned out differently.
I could be wrong but that was what I took out of the interview, other points he made were not very clever tbh.
Speaking personally and in no way representing any other interest NATO flexed their muscles and waited for the reaction but then they stopped and that empowered Putin sadly.
What this has exposed among NATO is the huge interoperability issue they have with new former eastern block members their weaponary and munitions are not interchangeable.
Also the rate of resupply has exposed that NATO could not launch a large scale operation until they have restocked their supplies of munitions and equipment.
Russia went to a war footing and started producing what they needed to support the invasion NATO took too long to respond.
NATO is also missing a trick the emerging technologies that they have to test and simulate extensively could be fast tracked actually try them in the field see if they work, but the fear remains that they will not trust Ukraine with the latest newest technology or kit for fear of the enemy getting hold of it.
Lets take the directed energy weapons systems lasers and other classified kit, they could be trailed in the field at relatively low costs and risk if used well away from the front. Missiles costing best part of a million quid compared to less than a hundred quid in energy for the new weaponary
1. I am not a Reform voter or a fan of Nigel Farage
2. Due to nature of my former jobs I directly worked in a NATO related role so have to be careful in what I say here.
On the comments made by Farage I think they have been taken out of proportion on this occasion yes Nigel has some cringe worthy sound bites but on this occasion he was making the point correctly it turns out that the strategy and actions of NATO were in effect poking the bear. I think he was making the point that greater statesmanship or joined up thinking by world leaders this could have turned out differently.
I could be wrong but that was what I took out of the interview, other points he made were not very clever tbh.
Speaking personally and in no way representing any other interest NATO flexed their muscles and waited for the reaction but then they stopped and that empowered Putin sadly.
What this has exposed among NATO is the huge interoperability issue they have with new former eastern block members their weaponary and munitions are not interchangeable.
Also the rate of resupply has exposed that NATO could not launch a large scale operation until they have restocked their supplies of munitions and equipment.
Russia went to a war footing and started producing what they needed to support the invasion NATO took too long to respond.
NATO is also missing a trick the emerging technologies that they have to test and simulate extensively could be fast tracked actually try them in the field see if they work, but the fear remains that they will not trust Ukraine with the latest newest technology or kit for fear of the enemy getting hold of it.
Lets take the directed energy weapons systems lasers and other classified kit, they could be trailed in the field at relatively low costs and risk if used well away from the front. Missiles costing best part of a million quid compared to less than a hundred quid in energy for the new weaponary
Exactly what would any of us done if we were in Putins position.
Can I again ask what you would have done if you were him?
I would've left after my second term and would not have filled the Duma with cronies to change the constitution to ensure I could rule for life. He is just a gangster.
Hey not making apologies for a murderous dictator all I am saying is the warning signs were there NATO did not respond the correct way either back up your chest pumping or back out the half way house we have just now is the result.Can I roll my eyes at people that clearly want to apologise Putin? His plan is, and always has been, to recreate theCCCPUSSR. And as for trying to appeal to Putin, Dane-geld. And as for Farrage, I always wonder why he hasn't been buried under a pile of pies yet?
In previous conflicts when proof of violation of Geneva convention a no fly zone was imposed by peace keepers not an act of war but a measure to prevent innocent civilians being attacked from the air.
Personally I would like to see the UN security council request this with NATO assistance that would show Putin that NATO will not tolerate his actions. If he wants to pick a fight then see if his military and gangster buddies want a full scale war with the combined NATO forces I would give it 2 weeks until he vanished
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