Dry hopping w Grainfather GF30 conical fermenter

[SMP Brewery]

I have a valve on the top of mine. What I do is put my hops in a muslin sack that has a weight in it, at the start of the ferment after pitching the yeast I put the hops in the head space tied with some cord that then goes under the lid and tied on the outside. When I’m ready to dry hop the valve is closed for a while to get a bit of pressure, then loosen one of the clamps and drop the cord so the hops enter the beer, after a while open the valve again. When dry hopping is over I do the reverse, close the valve wait a bit, release the clamp a bit and then raise the bag into the head space, then open the valve. The valve has a tube into starsan similar to the above.

 

[vexedben]

Not sure if this is helpful or not, but at work when we dry hop we tend to do it 2/3ish through attenuation such that any O2 pickup from the addition is scrubbed out during active fermentation. Obviously you’ll lose a bit of aroma from them due to CO2 kicking it out from the beer.

Failing that any time we do open up the top of the tank we run a blanket of CO2 at 1bar through the blow off arm, to reduce O2 pickup when fining beer etc.

Hope this helps a little.

 

[MashBag]

One option for dry hopping is to add about 0.3G per 20litres of sodium metabisilphate with your dry hops. This will scrub dissolved oxygen in the beer and the air. It’s very effective if you can’t guarantee oxygen ingress. Some people think it impacts the flavour of the beer

Use potassium metabisulphate instead and there is no taste.

 

[JockyBrewer]

One option for dry hopping is to add about 0.3G per 20litres of sodium metabisilphate with your dry hops. This will scrub dissolved oxygen in the beer and the air. It’s very effective if you can’t guarantee oxygen ingress. Some people think it impacts the flavour of the beer but you can dose it lower than what I suggest above which is towards the higher end of dosing.

Be careful with metabisulphite. If there's any residual fermentation activity - even a little - the yeast will convert the metabisulphite into hydrogen sulphide, and you will have egg beer.

I've lost two batches this way, and it's not worth the risk imo.

 

[peebee]

Be careful with metabisulphite. ...

Too right. I wouldn't allow metabisulphite anywhere near my beer (except the minute scraps used to neutralise any chlorine in the water. I did use it to clean a hand-pump a while ago: Even after rinsing the pump repeatedly, the taste never disappeared in any beer run through it for a week.

There must be a very good reason why winemakers seem to use it as the primary sanitiser without consequence, yet it is hardly mentioned in beer-brewing literature. I think the reasons just been lost with time, but as beer-brewers continue to try it more and more, I guess they'll figure it out soon?

... The Grainfather website suggests using the pressure transfer kit to add 1 PSI of CO2 to the fermenter to create positive pressure with CO2 and so minimise oxygen exposure ...

All the chatter about pressurized transfers and purging introduced dry hops of oxygen. And using the GF pressure transfer tackle ... yet no mention of its workings:

It has no pressure relief valve. Because it doesn't need one! The GF fermenter lid won't stay sealed long above 1psi. There are quite a few "square inches" on that 300mm diameter lid, which amounts to quite a large force pushing on it at 1psi, and its only held down by a few spring clips. The lid seal cracks and vents the excess pressure. A heck of a lot more reliably than those poky little relief valves (and I don't know of any affordable relief valves that operate under 7psi anyway).

And "gas in". If you are going to be a little concerned about leaking away CO2 through the lid seal, I suggest using the manual valve supplied with the GF pressure transfer tackle to manually maintain the 1 or 2psi to push the beer out (the tackle is supplied with an electronic pressure gauge which is sufficiently accurate). If you want to automate it, a propane or butane gas regulator will do the job. They are designed to maintain very small pressures (100-150mbar should do the job, 150mbar = about 2psi). There are some ridiculous "low pressure" claims made for cheap conventional regulators and PRVs, but fortunately the "LPG" regulators are cheap because of the huge numbers of caravaners needing them. Avoid the common 37mbar regulators, they've not enough puff and probably have useless (to us) integrated "POL" adapters. The "Clesse" 50-150mbar (variable) are good ones (the only flippin' ones it seems).

And the bit I always try to remember, LPG regulators are to be used as "secondaries" ... do not connect them directly to CO2 cylinders!

 

[samosbrew]

I essentially use this:

https://www.themaltmiller.co.uk/product/pressure-transfer-and-low-o2-dry-hop-kit-v1/?v=79cba1185463
3/8" gas line connected to some 12mm silicon tubing, using a 1/2″ to 3/8″ JG fitting.

@Stu's Brews - I ended up getting one of these kits and it’s been perfect for dry hopping. I also tried it for pressure transfer from the gf30 to corny keg this evening, but the flow rate was painfully slow and it pretty much ground to a halt about halfway through, so I still have 9-10L left in the fermenter. Have you had this issue before / any idea what the issue might be? Any bright ideas on how to get the remaining beer out would be hugely welcome, but no worries if not!

 

[CookieMonster]

@Stu's Brews - I ended up getting one of these kits and it’s been perfect for dry hopping. I also tried it for pressure transfer from the gf30 to corny keg this evening, but the flow rate was painfully slow and it pretty much ground to a halt about halfway through, so I still have 9-10L left in the fermenter. Have you had this issue before / any idea what the issue might be? Any bright ideas on how to get the remaining beer out would be hugely welcome, but no worries if not!

So you'll need to make sure you're adding CO2 through the top or it'll create a vacuum. Also, the pipework can get blocked if you've done some big dry hopping. Try attaching a gasline to the push fitting at the bottom, where your line to the keg would normally go. Put maybe 5psi and feather the ball valve tap (red tap handle), make sure you reattached your blow off, when you see that there are bubbles coming out you'll have unblocked it. Return to transfer and you should be good, just means you may get a little hop matter in your transfer, don't worry though this'll settle out in the keg

 

[Stu's Brews]

@Stu's Brews - I ended up getting one of these kits and it’s been perfect for dry hopping. I also tried it for pressure transfer from the gf30 to corny keg this evening, but the flow rate was painfully slow and it pretty much ground to a halt about halfway through, so I still have 9-10L left in the fermenter. Have you had this issue before / any idea what the issue might be? Any bright ideas on how to get the remaining beer out would be hugely welcome, but no worries if not!

As @CookieMonster has said, possible that you have got a small blockage that needs clearing.

Other things to check/try:

• Make sure the nut on the underside of the pressure relief valve is as tight as possible. That means you are getting the maximum pressure in the fermenter before the relief valve opens.
• Raise the fermenter above the keg so that you get some help from gravity to keep the flow going.
• Make sure that the keg pressure relief valve is open throughout the transfer.
• Try shortening the length of pipe between the fermenter and the keg.
• If you are heavily dry hopping, you could consider using the longer dual valve inlet to prevent blockages: https://www.themaltmiller.co.uk/pro...dual-valve-160mm-liquid-inlet/?v=79cba1185463

It's never going to be super quick as the Grainfather concical isn't pressure rated, so you won't have a massive pressure difference between the fermenter and the keg.

 

[MashBag]

Too right. I wouldn't allow metabisulphite anywhere near my beer

Absolutely

 

[MashBag]

There must be a very good reason why winemakers seem to use it as the primary sanitiser without consequence, yet it is hardly mentioned in beer-brewing literature.

Properly trained winemakers use it to mop the floor and clean vessels. Never goes in the product, anywhere.

 

[JockyBrewer]

Also, the pipework can get blocked if you've done some big dry hopping. Try attaching a gasline to the push fitting at the bottom, where your line to the keg would normally go.

Yep. The holes at the top of the racking spike thing are pitifully small and easily blocked. Dump some yeast and hops before racking.

I've not got the hang of it myself yet - I'm wondering if it might be worth doing a couple of days before racking to let the remaining stuff settle out too.

 

[CookieMonster]

Yep. The holes at the top of the racking spike thing are pitifully small and easily blocked. Dump some yeast and hops before racking.

I've not got the hang of it myself yet - I'm wondering if it might be worth doing a couple of days before racking to let the remaining stuff settle out too.

I probably wouldn't worry about it, unless we're talking a huge amount of hops that could bung up a keg post, although that has never personally happened to me. I do have a Bouncer Mac Daddy large in-line. Bit pricey but does the job really well. Not part of my usual kegging process but got me out of a pickle on a few occasions, including a time where I completely forgot to put in the "racking spike thing"

 

[JockyBrewer]

I probably wouldn't worry about it, unless we're talking a huge amount of hops that could bung up a keg post, although that has never personally happened to me. I do have a Bouncer Mac Daddy large in-line. Bit pricey but does the job really well. Not part of my usual kegging process but got me out of a pickle on a few occasions, including a time where I completely forgot to put in the "racking spike thing"

It’s less the issue of clogging up a keg post, more that it makes it hard to rack the beer.

Might buy the extra long spike for my hoppier fermentations.

 

[Stu's Brews]

Yep. The holes at the top of the racking spike thing are pitifully small and easily blocked. Dump some yeast and hops before racking.

I've not got the hang of it myself yet - I'm wondering if it might be worth doing a couple of days before racking to let the remaining stuff settle out too.

My process is to dry hop, crash to 5degC, hold for 24 hours, add finings, wait 4-5 days and then transfer. I don't have any issues getting blockages from doing that.

 

[samosbrew]

As @CookieMonster has said, possible that you have got a small blockage that needs clearing.

Other things to check/try:

• Make sure the nut on the underside of the pressure relief valve is as tight as possible. That means you are getting the maximum pressure in the fermenter before the relief valve opens.
• Raise the fermenter above the keg so that you get some help from gravity to keep the flow going.
• Make sure that the keg pressure relief valve is open throughout the transfer.
• Try shortening the length of pipe between the fermenter and the keg.
• If you are heavily dry hopping, you could consider using the longer dual valve inlet to prevent blockages: https://www.themaltmiller.co.uk/pro...dual-valve-160mm-liquid-inlet/?v=79cba1185463

It's never going to be super quick as the Grainfather concical isn't pressure rated, so you won't have a massive pressure difference between the fermenter and the keg.

Thanks @Stu's Brews, @CookieMonster, and @JockyBrewer - all really helpful.

I returned to it today and took on board all advice (other than buying a longer valve inlet). I can confirm that it's not a blockage on the fermenter or the beer line from the bottom of the fermenter to the keg, because beer flows freely out of the fermenter and through the line when I remove the beer disconnect from the end of the line. So I can only guess that it's struggling to move through the beer post or, for reasons unknown to me, there's an issue with the post on my kegs (I'm doing it with the keg PRV open, so it's not that the keg is too high pressure for the liquid to flow).

Don't suppose you've got any bright ideas? No worries at all if not, but I thought it worth asking!

Potentially worth saying that I've tried doing this two ways: first, trying to push the beer through a beer disconnect and in the beer post down the dip tube (this worked to get the initial half the batch through, but then stopped working); second, trying to push the beer through a gas disconnect through the gas post (this didn't work at all).

 

[Stu's Brews]

Thanks @Stu's Brews, @CookieMonster, and @JockyBrewer - all really helpful.

I returned to it today and took on board all advice (other than buying a longer valve inlet). I can confirm that it's not a blockage on the fermenter or the beer line from the bottom of the fermenter to the keg, because beer flows freely out of the fermenter and through the line when I remove the beer disconnect from the end of the line. So I can only guess that it's struggling to move through the beer post or, for reasons unknown to me, there's an issue with the post on my kegs (I'm doing it with the keg PRV open, so it's not that the keg is too high pressure for the liquid to flow).

Don't suppose you've got any bright ideas? No worries at all if not, but I thought it worth asking!

Potentially worth saying that I've tried doing this two ways: first, trying to push the beer through a beer disconnect and in the beer post down the dip tube (this worked to get the initial half the batch through, but then stopped working); second, trying to push the beer through a gas disconnect through the gas post (this didn't work at all).

I can't think of anything beyond what I posted previously, however, this video may be worth a watch to see if there is anything you are missing.

 

[Tess Tickle's Brewery]

I can't think of anything beyond what I posted previously, however, this video may be worth a watch to see if there is anything you are missing.

I have that and I love it so far. The top valve is really useful for adding a tiny bit of pressure before you yeast dump. Going to keg my first beer out of it next week so I'm hoping everything goes smoothly.

I think not having to use that thin steel rack pipe along with dumping yeast every few days will eliminate blocking issues. The John Guest thingy they provide is much wider than the steel rack pipe. Fingers crossed!

 

[CookieMonster]

Thanks @Stu's Brews, @CookieMonster, and @JockyBrewer - all really helpful.

I returned to it today and took on board all advice (other than buying a longer valve inlet). I can confirm that it's not a blockage on the fermenter or the beer line from the bottom of the fermenter to the keg, because beer flows freely out of the fermenter and through the line when I remove the beer disconnect from the end of the line. So I can only guess that it's struggling to move through the beer post or, for reasons unknown to me, there's an issue with the post on my kegs (I'm doing it with the keg PRV open, so it's not that the keg is too high pressure for the liquid to flow).

Don't suppose you've got any bright ideas? No worries at all if not, but I thought it worth asking!

Potentially worth saying that I've tried doing this two ways: first, trying to push the beer through a beer disconnect and in the beer post down the dip tube (this worked to get the initial half the batch through, but then stopped working); second, trying to push the beer through a gas disconnect through the gas post (this didn't work at all).

Through process of elimination it can only be one of two things from what you've said. Either the back connector or the post is blocked. Have you got any spare connectors to trial? Note the grey connectors will only fit the gas post, and the black the liquid posts, they're not cross compatible. You can strip both the connector and post down if needed, but I wouldn't want to pull your liquid post unless absolutely necessary when youve already kegged half your beer. The connector is pretty easy to take apart. Silly question but did you make sure it was properly connected to the post? Very unlikely that you have an issue with your prv but you could also try connecting a line out from your gas post and running it into some sanatiser, that's what I tend tondonfor transfer