Disappointing brew-where am I going wrong?

[Covrich]

Johnnyboy you work in a kitchen right?? woudl you say extract is a better way to go then? I seen someone say they found using cherry extract a better method than cherries in a stout..

Looks like it isn't a cheap ingredient adjunct to have.. (never used it myself)

 

[johnnyboy1965]

Johnnyboy you work in a kitchen right?? woudl you say extract is a better way to go then? I seen someone say they found using cherry extract a better method than cherries in a stout..

Looks like it isn't a cheap ingredient adjunct to have.. (never used it myself)

Your right...36 years a Chef. I looked int cherry exract a few years ago after having a bottle of ( I think it was Bauhaus Cherry Beer) Ill post a link its available at Tescos. The price put me off a little, so I dropped the idea. I must go back to this

 

[johnnyboy1965]

Its Bachuss Kriekhttp://www.tesco.com/groceries/product/details/?id=259940757&sc_cmp=ppc-_-sh-_-msh-_-bg-_-px_%7C_alc._%7C_shopping_gsc_%7C_all_products-_-&gclid=Cj0KEQiA5bvEBRCM6vypnc7QgMkBEiQAUZftQCPEIeM3DfTBnTlnd7FywbSvmfzVW2xWFDmCHjRteBcaApMY8P8HAQ&gclsrc=aw.ds

 

[johnnyboy1965]

I wouldnt even try to clone it. Just buy a bottle and enjoy
This is in my top 5 commercial beers to drink.

 

[Leon103]

Hmm could be- although to me it is still a bit "bland" for a porter. I know you shouldn't compare but I popped open a commercial baltic porter at the same time as my own and mine was like water next to that one; flavours wise.

Baltic porter is a bit different to a normal porter though.

 

[johnnyboy1965]

Johnnyboy you work in a kitchen right?? woudl you say extract is a better way to go then? I seen someone say they found using cherry extract a better method than cherries in a stout..

Looks like it isn't a cheap ingredient adjunct to have.. (never used it myself)

Id always go for extract. the suppliers do the work for you.
How much to use?.... I have absolutly no idea, but what i would do when using cherry extract is divide your bottles...ie...
40 bottles:-
10 bottles...no extract at all (this will give you a base to work on)
10 bottles with 5ml (1tsp)
and keep going lower
a cheap plastic pipette comes in handy. i wouldnt put any more that 1tsp (5ml) in each bottle

And I dont think that a stout is the right type of beer to try this on...A SMaSH is probably better...then when you know how strong the cherry extract is, go onto a stout.

 

[Hengoedbrewer]

You will want some extract in there to help isometrise (sp) the hops.

What I would do is add 50% of you extract at the start of the boil (post steeping any speciality grains) and the last half at the end.

Adding all the extract will make the gravity of the wort you boil higher and will reduce the hop utilisation.

What I would do is then get your hops for your 60 min boil set it at around the IBUS you want and then personally I would have some late additions in the boil, some after the boil whilst cooling and steeping and then you could add some for a dry hop

The hop schedule is a point in contention where as some throw ALL their flavour and aroma hops in after flame out whereas some of us still have late additions and flame out work better for various levels.. I fall in the latter category but as with all these things you are better off trying them for yourself.

Just had a quick check and Punk IPA is 45 IBU's apparently (I thought it'd be higher) so anything around that level is fine by me. I have never used a recipe builder- so shot in the dark here- would something like this be okay d'you think for a hoppy IPA? More hops would not be an issue if needed. The young's IPA kit I was looking at has a 100g dry hop!

120g Chrystal Malt, steeped- unsure of other grain needed...(?)
3KG light DME
15g of simcoe and 15g chinook; 60 mins
15g of simcoe and 15g chinook; 10 mins
15g of simcoe and 15g chinook; 0 mins
15g of simcoe and 15g chinook, dry hop 3-5 days before bottling

Steep grains at 65-67c for 30 mins. remove grains; add half of DME and boil wort. Add hops as schedule there. Add remaining DME once wort has cooled to 80c. Wait for wort to cool to 20f and pitch Mangrove Jack's M44 yeast, ferment at 19-20c. Hopefully cooler temps and that yeast would lead to a nice fresh clean IPA with hops coming through and fruity esters from the yeast.

If anyone has any ideas or if I have done something really stupid there then some pointers would be good- I think I am definitely giving up on pre-prepared recipe packs.

 

[Hengoedbrewer]

Baltic porter is a bit different to a normal porter though.

It was the first time I ever had one and it was amazing. Good Chemistry's Becoming North.

 

[Razor]

Id always go for extract. the suppliers do the work for you.
How much to use?.... I have absolutly no idea, but what i would do when using cherry extract is divide your bottles...ie...
40 bottles:-
10 bottles...no extract at all (this will give you a base to work on)
10 bottles with 5ml (1tsp)
and keep going lower
a cheap plastic pipette comes in handy. i wouldnt put any more that 1tsp (5ml) in each bottle

And I dont think that a stout is the right type of beer to try this on...A SMaSH is probably better...then when you know how strong the cherry extract is, go onto a stout.

I've been wanting to try a cherry beer too, probably a wheat or pale ale. Would this type of extract be the right kinda thing? https://www.olivenation.com/black-cherry-flavor-fountain.html

 

[BeerCat]

Which extract did you use?

I have only used the cheap stuff which admittedly is not very good. Not tried anything more expensive but i have a small bottle of Krupnik vodka with about 6 pods in soaked for months. Its dark brown and tastes lovely but does not carry over into a 20l batch.

 

[Covrich]

Id always go for extract. the suppliers do the work for you.
How much to use?.... I have absolutly no idea, but what i would do when using cherry extract is divide your bottles...ie...
40 bottles:-
10 bottles...no extract at all (this will give you a base to work on)
10 bottles with 5ml (1tsp)
and keep going lower
a cheap plastic pipette comes in handy. i wouldnt put any more that 1tsp (5ml) in each bottle

And I dont think that a stout is the right type of beer to try this on...A SMaSH is probably better...then when you know how strong the cherry extract is, go onto a stout.

Thanks , Worth knowing. Tbh I am not sure its my cup of tea but I might try it like someone suggested on a wheat type beer maybe..

 

[Covrich]

Just had a quick check and Punk IPA is 45 IBU's apparently (I thought it'd be higher) so anything around that level is fine by me. I have never used a recipe builder- so shot in the dark here- would something like this be okay d'you think for a hoppy IPA? More hops would not be an issue if needed. The young's IPA kit I was looking at has a 100g dry hop!

120g Chrystal Malt, steeped- unsure of other grain needed...(?)
3KG light DME
15g of simcoe and 15g chinook; 60 mins
15g of simcoe and 15g chinook; 10 mins
15g of simcoe and 15g chinook; 0 mins
15g of simcoe and 15g chinook, dry hop 3-5 days before bottling

Steep grains at 65-67c for 30 mins. remove grains; add half of DME and boil wort. Add hops as schedule there. Add remaining DME once wort has cooled to 80c. Wait for wort to cool to 20f and pitch Mangrove Jack's M44 yeast, ferment at 19-20c. Hopefully cooler temps and that yeast would lead to a nice fresh clean IPA with hops coming through and fruity esters from the yeast.

If anyone has any ideas or if I have done something really stupid there then some pointers would be good- I think I am definitely giving up on pre-prepared recipe packs.

What you have suggested doesn't seem too outrageous to me.. and a good start, simple..

If you have any left over hops , you could boost your later hop additions such as flame out and dry hop. Your flame out hops you could also add at 80ºc and then leave the wort steeping (without cooling for 20-30 mins) before proceeding to chill..

Best to get yourself some brewing software, even for extract it will help you calculate things like ibus ect.. you can dial the settings in and adjust Alpha Acids percentages of the hops you are using.

Based on what you put above you will get around 55-60 IBUs I guess but it depends on the AA% of the actual hops you buy/ have.

 

[Hengoedbrewer]

What you have suggested doesn't seem too outrageous to me.. and a good start, simple..

If you have any left over hops , you could boost your later hop additions such as flame out and dry hop. Your flame out hops you could also add at 80ºc and then leave the wort steeping (without cooling for 20-30 mins) before proceeding to chill..

Best to get yourself some brewing software, even for extract it will help you calculate things like ibus ect.. you can dial the settings in and adjust Alpha Acids percentages of the hops you are using.

Based on what you put above you will get around 55-60 IBUs I guess but it depends on the AA% of the actual hops you buy/ have.

Thanks Covrich- I don't actually have anything in at the moment so I could adjust if anyone has any other suggestions as I would have to buy it all anyway. I do have some unopened fuggles I was going to use in a Coopers English bitter but not sure they would fit the style I like to drink these days. I'll bear it in mind the brewing software. At the risk of repeating myself everyone has been super helpful here and it is much appreciated.

 

[Hengoedbrewer]

I have actually just found a recipe I had bookmarked when I was doing kits and just fiddling with hops and grains. It was using a coopers IPA kit as a base; which I think I can probably now just use DME for instead? and hops as follows though I'd be tempted to add an additional dry hop

100g Crystal Munich (or Crystal Light (60)) Steeped
12g Citra @15min
15g Mosaic @15min
10g Centenial @15min
15g Amarillo @15min
15g Mosaic @ Flameout
8g Amarillo @ Flameout
20g Centenial @Flameout
12g Galaxy @Flameout

Any thoughts- other than my own which is does it need some hops at the start of the boil? I have tried all of those hops mostly in single hop so know I like them, singly at least...

 

[dad_of_jon]

I have actually just found a recipe I had bookmarked when I was doing kits and just fiddling with hops and grains. It was using a coopers IPA kit as a base; which I think I can probably now just use DME for instead? and hops as follows though I'd be tempted to add an additional dry hop

100g Crystal Munich (or Crystal Light (60)) Steeped
12g Citra @15min
15g Mosaic @15min
10g Centenial @15min
15g Amarillo @15min
15g Mosaic @ Flameout
8g Amarillo @ Flameout
20g Centenial @Flameout
12g Galaxy @Flameout

Any thoughts- other than my own which is does it need some hops at the start of the boil? I have tried all of those hops mostly in single hop so know I like them, singly at least...

Hi,

dme will be fine and you only need a 15 min boil so the hops@15 go straight in. yes i'd do a massive dry hop 5 days before bottling.

 

[DoctorMick]

I have actually just found a recipe I had bookmarked when I was doing kits and just fiddling with hops and grains. It was using a coopers IPA kit as a base; which I think I can probably now just use DME for instead? and hops as follows though I'd be tempted to add an additional dry hop

100g Crystal Munich (or Crystal Light (60)) Steeped
12g Citra @15min
15g Mosaic @15min
10g Centenial @15min
15g Amarillo @15min
15g Mosaic @ Flameout
8g Amarillo @ Flameout
20g Centenial @Flameout
12g Galaxy @Flameout

Any thoughts- other than my own which is does it need some hops at the start of the boil? I have tried all of those hops mostly in single hop so know I like them, singly at least...

I'm not an extract expert so I could be wrong but if the original recipe used a hopped extract then it will have accounted for the bitterness in the kit. If you're not going to use hopped extract I'd suggest increasing the 15 min additions by quite a significant amount as you won't get a huge amount of bitterness from the quantities you have in the recipe. Maybe whack it thru some brewing software and see what it comes out like.