Deionised water - reassurance wanted

[Agentgonzo]

Is it food grade Gonzo reckons it isn’t?

https://www.spotlesswater.co.uk/contact/faq/
Make of that what you will.
As I said, I'm sure it'll be fine, but they don't guarantee it.

 

[The Baron]

I wouldn't use it until they fully disclose where the treated water comes from. If its treated tap water then it is food safe but is it?

 

[JockyBrewer]

I've been looking into this too for a stout recipe as my tap water has too much stuff in it I can't strip out so looking to dilute tap water with distilled or deionised. I suspect it's more of a case that it hasn't been tested to be labelled as food safe rather than it definitely or likely contains anything that is harmful so it's a backside covering thing. I decided not to go with the Carplan stuff and not risk it as you can buy food grade stuff off eBay cheaply enough if you can wait for the delivery.

I was more wondering about the difference between deionised water and distilled and which is better for brewing.

For dark beers like a stout I don't think there's water in the UK that has 'too much stuff in it'.

Some in Scotland, West/North Wales and North West England might not have enough in it for stout.

For most of England though all you really need is to test your water's alkalinity (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Salifert-KH-Alkalinity-Profi-Test-Kit/dp/B001EJ3DOG) and then use some AMS (Sterilisers, Chemicals and Sundries - AMS (CRS) 500ml) to reduce it down a level appropriate for the beer.

If you're making lighter lagers there's a case for using deionised/reverse osmosis water, but until you can make a very high quality version without it you really won't notice the difference.

 

[nickjdavis]

View attachment 81442
https://www.spotlesswater.co.uk/contact/faq/
Make of that what you will.
As I said, I'm sure it'll be fine, but they don't guarantee it.

I would be surprised if they did guarantee it. Mineral additions to create brewing water sits well outside their area of expertise!

The moment they guarantee something there will always be some idiot who half reads the web site and interprets it as saying the water is safe to drink under any circumstances!!

 

[AJA]

I wouldn't use it until they fully disclose where the treated water comes from. If its treated tap water then it is food safe but is it?

I've asked the question, but I'm 90% sure it is fed from mains water and waste water is returned to sewerage.

 

[Agentgonzo]

I would be surprised if they did guarantee it. Mineral additions to create brewing water sits well outside their area of expertise!

The moment they guarantee something there will always be some idiot who half reads the web site and interprets it as saying the water is safe to drink under any circumstances!!

Exactly. They make it for industrial uses like cleaning/washing/etc. They don't make it for consumption so it's not worth their time to see whether it is or isn't for consumption. So it's not in their interest to say it's safe, so just put up a generic disclaimer.

 

[Agentgonzo]

I've asked the question, but I'm 90% sure it is fed from mains water and waste water is returned to sewerage.

I can't imagine where else they would get it from. It's not economically viable to get spring/river water, filter it and transport it to all of their different locations before selling it on at 3.5p/l.
They'll just have a container with the filters etc in it, and plug it into the mains water wherever they set a site up.

 

[nickjdavis]

Exactly. They make it for industrial uses like cleaning/washing/etc. They don't make it for consumption so it's not worth their time to see whether it is or isn't for consumption. So it's not in their interest to say it's safe, so just put up a generic disclaimer.

If it was truly bad then they wouldn't promote/advertise its use in building up water for fishkeeping purposes...cant see them being popular when half the UK's population of Neon Tetra's start floating on the surface of their tank.

 

[AJA]

I can't imagine where else they would get it from. It's not economically viable to get spring/river water, filter it and transport it to all of their different locations before selling it on at 3.5p/l.
They'll just have a container with the filters etc in it, and plug it into the mains water wherever they set a site up.

I'm in 100% agreement this is most likely what happens, I'll let them confirm though.

 

[nickjdavis]

I can't imagine where else they would get it from. It's not economically viable to get spring/river water, filter it and transport it to all of their different locations before selling it on at 3.5p/l.
They'll just have a container with the filters etc in it, and plug it into the mains water wherever they set a site up.

The only alternative is that they are re-filtering waste water from local business premises....but they would have to find locations that were generating significant volumes of waste in order to do that....my local station sits in the car park of a local sports and social club....and every time I visit...be it day or night...the place is as dead as a dodo, so cannot imagine that it would generate anything like the volumes of waste water required.

 

[Agentgonzo]

The only alternative is that they are re-filtering waste water from local business premises....but they would have to find locations that were generating significant volumes of waste in order to do that....my local station sits in the car park of a local sports and social club....and every time I visit...be it day or night...the place is as dead as a dodo, so cannot imagine that it would generate anything like the volumes of waste water required.

and it'd be cheaper/easier just to use tap water which is a reliable, steady source of clean water

 

[hoppyscotty]

and it'd be cheaper/easier just to use tap water which is a reliable, steady source of clean water

Good old Peckam springs!!

Well the whole point of selling the water in the first place is for people who need it for very specific purposes and require the water to be pure so I would assume the water has been manufactured in a sterile and clean process. If you're buying it to wash your car with to prevent streaking then it defeats the object if there is contaminants in the water that will create streaking. Also if you're using for chemical processes and there are contaminants present then that will affect the chemical processes people want to use the water for. So I'd assume that its pretty clean...certainly cleaner than some peoples hose pipe water.

 

[Zoiks]

I would be surprised if they did guarantee it. Mineral additions to create brewing water sits well outside their area of expertise!

The moment they guarantee something there will always be some idiot who half reads the web site and interprets it as saying the water is safe to drink under any circumstances!!

Yep it makes zero business sense to take that on as a liability for the 1 or 2 idiots like us that are pulling 40L out once every couple of months when their main business will be window cleaners taking 1000L plus at a time.

 

[Agentgonzo]

Good old Peckam springs!!

Well the whole point of selling the water in the first place is for people who need it for very specific purposes and require the water to be pure so I would assume the water has been manufactured in a sterile and clean process. If you're buying it to wash your car with to prevent streaking then it defeats the object if there is contaminants in the water that will create streaking. Also if you're using for chemical processes and there are contaminants present then that will affect the chemical processes people want to use the water for. So I'd assume that its pretty clean...certainly cleaner than some peoples hose pipe water.

I meant "use tap water as the input for their filtering process" (instead of the waste water that was mentioned above). Not that they were just reselling tap water

 

[The Baron]

I know I could get this answer on the tinterweb but is there a difference between de-ionised and RO water?

 

[Agentgonzo]

I know I could get this answer on the tinterweb but is there a difference between de-ionised and RO water?

One is the end result, to one is the process. You can make deionised water by using an RO filter (I think), but you can also make deionised water by distillation

 

[AJA]

I know I could get this answer on the tinterweb but is there a difference between de-ionised and RO water?

Yes. The process is different in the DI water uses ion exchange and RO uses pressure through a membrane. DI purity is measured using conductivity of the water (it is almost a perfect insulator), RO is less pure, with 0 TDS as a target, even though Spotless get pretty close.
DI is more expensive, and the machines I used in the lab could maybe only produce a litre or two an hour.

 

[stripeyjoe]

No RO water would be fit for human consumption as, drinking it neat, is bad for you as it will extract vital minerals from your body. The process of brewing adds minerals back in, making the beer produced fit for human consumption.

I use Spotless mixed with tap water, usually around 80% for my lagers and 50% for pale ales and bitters. For stouts and porters I just use my London tap water. For all of these I add salts/CRS/lactic acid as appropriate for the beer I’m brewing.

 

[Justin Dean]

Spotless water is good I use it for every brew

 

[Agentgonzo]

Good old Peckam springs!!

Can anyone remember the Dasani debacle?