Declining bitter.

[Haversham]

My local pub sells 5 different beers on hand pump including a dark mild and a premium dark bitter. I think much depends on how we define bitter. What I just described as a 'premium dark bitter' (Harvey’s Tom Paine) I see is described by the brewery as 'a dry-hopped robust pale ale'. But anyway, where I live, there seems to be no shortage of decent bitter available. Thank gawd.

 

[Rodcx500z]

I live near Lewes where Harvey's is brewed and any pub that can will sell Harvey's Best. It is virtually a religion round here. They generally brew old style ales and so when I went into their (busy) brewery tap the other day I had a choice of Best bitter, their IPA (a weak bitter), their premium dry hopped bitter, mild, porter and old ale. I chose the porter which was lovely.

Had a few in there on holiday cracking ales on sale

 

[Cheshire Cat]

we had greenhalls bitter, and if kept proper was very good not far behind boddingtons yes i remember boddys in it's prime, lets not forget chesters dark mild the ale i cut my teeth on, i never got into the lager thing, the only lager i really like is peroni doppio malto reserver a cracking pint

I was brought up in Northwich where every pub was a Greenhall and Whitley pub and the beer was disgusting. We even lived in Greenhall Road. G&W have now closed their brewery in Warrington (thank god) which was a mile from where we live now.

 

[Cwrw666]

Am I missing something - but isn't traditional 'bitter' just pale ale plus varying amounts of sugar plus a colourant, usually caramel, to make it brown?
Oh I do miss the morning after hangovers. Not.

 

[Sadfield]

we had greenhalls bitter, and if kept proper was very good not far behind boddingtons yes i remember boddys in it's prime

I don't, but know those that do. And wonder if the 1970s Boddies they lament would fit into this conversation today, or whether it would be seen as another hoppy pale cask ale.

I think part of the problem is homogenization of the style by the big cask ale brewers, all making a product not to dissimilar to their competitors and for maximum profit.

Are the many Pale Ales, the true Bitters?

 

[gazzelle]

I don't, but know those that do. And wonder if 1970s Boddies would fit into this conversation today, or whether it would be seen as another hoppy pale cask ale.

I think part of the problem is homogenization of the style by the big cask ale brewers, all making a product not to dissimilar to their competitors and for maximum profit.

Are the many Pale Ales, the true Bitters?

Marketing nonsense is my feeling. Bitter is the drink of the old men in smokey tap rooms (Nirvana), not what the common bearded hipster wants to be seen anywhere near

 

[TonyT]

I live near Lewes where Harvey's is brewed and any pub that can will sell Harvey's Best. It is virtually a religion round here. They generally brew old style ales and so when I went into their (busy) brewery tap the other day I had a choice of Best bitter, their IPA (a weak bitter), their premium dry hopped bitter, mild, porter and old ale. I chose the porter which was lovely.

Sounds idyllic. I’ve always liked Harvey’s but don’t come down that way very often.

 

[Haversham]

I don't, but know those that do. And wonder if the 1970s Boddies they lament would fit into this conversation today, or whether it would be seen as another hoppy pale cask ale.

I think part of the problem is homogenization of the style by the big cask ale brewers, all making a product not to dissimilar to their competitors and for maximum profit.

Are the many Pale Ales, the true Bitters?

I lived in Manchester for a few years back in the 80s and never rated Boddingtons. Too light and feminine for my taste. I was keen on Robinson’s of Stockport and Hydes and Holts. But we ended up frequenting a pub we found that served Taylor’s Landlord, still a favourite bitter from the other side of the Pennines.

 

[The Baron]

In my era it was Tetley on hand pump we would do a tour of just those pubs that kept it well in my town, sadly every one of those pubs has gone

 

[Beerwegoagain]

It's the times we live in.
Heard that too many times but the point about following the money is spot on. My local is a brew pub (Brewhouse & kitchen) and thankfully they maintain a full range of 'homemade' stuff. Sometimes in a keg but it's still very nice. Or it's London Pride or an offering from Badger. The IPA and pale ale choice is immense and I like them but yes a bitter or mild? Lucky to find a mild in Dorset. Brewing my own instead. And maybe bring up at next CAMRA meet?

 

[Sadfield]

This is an interesting read about Boddies and gives some clues about the blandification of beer.

https://boakandbailey.com/2014/05/boddies-buried/
It does make me wonder how much other bitters have and continue to change.

The other interesting thing is that internally Boddies was labelled IP (india pale) but marketed as Bitter. Now Bitters it can be argued are branded is pale ales. Full circle?

 

[Cheshire Cat]

This is an interesting read about Boddies and gives some clues about the blandification of beer.

https://boakandbailey.com/2014/05/boddies-buried/
It does make me wonder how much other bitters have and continue to change.

The other interesting thing is that internally Boddies was labelled IP (india pale) but marketed as Bitter. Now Bitters it can be argued are branded is pale ales. Full circle?

Good article.

 

[chthon]

Isn't "Bitter" a designation that originated between WWI and WWII, or at least only since the end of the 19th century? When you look at all the recipes published by Ronald Pattinson, the 19th century consists of "Pale Ale" and "India Pale Ale" (of which an analysis by him definitely showed that there is no line there between the styles).

Also, he has a thread on Pale Ale.

The uptake that I get from reading "Shut up about Barclay-Perkins" is this:

• Breweries decided if they sold a beer as Pale Ale or India Pale Ale
• Sometimes they switched names, so that a recipe was once sold as Pale Ale, was later sold as India Pale Ale (and vice versa)
• Bitter was what you ordered at the pub, but you would get one of the above
• So it all seems to be the same

Names stayed the same, but due to financial reasons, gravities were lowered or tweaked, other ingredients used, other hops used, so a beer that was brewed around 1850, could have the same name but be a totally different recipe 30 years later. And then came WWI and WWII...

 

[chthon]

This is an interesting read about Boddies and gives some clues about the blandification of beer.

https://boakandbailey.com/2014/05/boddies-buried/
It does make me wonder how much other bitters have and continue to change.

The other interesting thing is that internally Boddies was labelled IP (india pale) but marketed as Bitter. Now Bitters it can be argued are branded is pale ales. Full circle?

So, who likes a really good bitter beer then? IBU bitterness that is. Because I understand what he is going at in the article, and the Belgian beers I brew have mostly a high bitterness, and I find that pleasant. I did brew an English style bitter too (maybe a tad too strong at 6.2%), something like an ESB I think, and it got reasonably bitter.

 

[fireworkmaster]

Local here still has bitter from our local brewery and from a couple others randomly but they have alot of these crazy hopped cloudy things which make me retch ( Elvis juice, hazy jane prime examples ) .
I get it brings the younger crowd in and a business needs to do what it has to for survival .
Most of the old boys that hit it in the lunch,early afternoon crowd hate these styles as they are often overpowering.
Pint of best or Guinness and a pack of scratchings an I'm happy lol.

Never been a fan of really ott hopped beers I do try new ones I see but so far nowt beets a good standard bitter.

 

[Sadfield]

So, who likes a really good bitter beer then?

Me. I find lingering bitterness completes the journey, for want of a better word, of tasting beer, as it hits different parts of your tongue an olfactory senses. I think bitterness plays a psychological part in drinkability of beer, making you go back for a mouthful of the contrasting and soothing sweet malt hit. Mainly why I find neipas and hazy pales boring, it's just one big upfront hop hit, then nothing. Bland, neutral malts and very little bitterness.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

I have never brewed a beer without bittering hops as to me it just never seems right.

 

[Sadfield]

I was brought up in Northwich where every pub was a Greenhall and Whitley pub and the beer was disgusting.

... and hearts are warm.......the girl I left behind.....

We used to get Robbies and Boddies from the North, Banks's from the South, Greenhalls from the West, Marstons from the East and Tetley's from over the Pennines. Change of pub for a different beer.

 

[AJA]

In London Anspatch and Hobday brew a decent bitter. A few pubs near me have a white labelled version.

 

[Baldylocks Brewery]

I’m very pleased to report that I had my first ever pint of pub cask mild on Saturday night. Had to be my First pint as you all love it so I had to try one and bought one for my neighbour too.
Unsurprisingly very good.
The sort of beer that just slips down and only 3.5% so good for a session
I’m in Herne Bay Kent and am spoiled with 6 “micro pubs” with just beer, snacks and old school conversation on offer.