Co2 help

[Daddynoob]

Have just done my first co2 batch in a pressure barrel but the co2 is not releasing when I tighten it
After fermented I carbonated about 12 bottles which were ok apart from a huge head (1 and a half ts)
And put the rest in the pressure barrel
Tried it after 2 weeks and it’s flat and just say fills a pint glass
Have inspected the co2 capsule and it seams like the seal is not getting pierced
Any ideas

I have a couple of spare pbs which are all relatively new

 

[Obadiah Boondoggle]

Hi

I have never used co2 capsules but have used pbs and found them less than useless

It seems to me that if the beer is flat the pb may have a leak somewhere (assuming that you secondarily fermented in the barrel - if you did you shouldn't need the co2 capsule at least until coming to the end)

I guess you have ensured that all the seals on the pb have vaseline on them to make sure they are sealed proprerly

Don't know if that is of any use

 

[BlackRegent]

@Daddynoob Did you prime the pressure barrel with sugar before putting the beer in to condition?

If you were expecting to carbonate it using CO2 bulbs alone, that is probably not going to work unless you use a lot of them.

Re the bulbs not piercing, this is one of the many pains that come with using pressure barrels. I found that the bulb holder often did not screw in far enough for the bulb to be pierced by the pin on the valve. I ended up wedging a bit of cardboard between the bulb and the plastic holder to try and gain more depth when screwing it in.

You may want to think about kegs as an alternative to pressure barrels to avoid all their shortcomings. Kegs are a revelation by comparison, but that's an entirely different conversation and there is lots on the forum discussing their use.

 

[Daddynoob]

Will try the cardboard trick

after fermenting I filtered into PB then added sugar
Then left to carbonate for 2 weeks

 

[BlackRegent]

Will try the cardboard trick

after fermenting I filtered into PB then added sugar
Then left to carbonate for 2 weeks

If you primed properly and left it in a warm place to begin with, there may be an issue with the seals as @Obadiah Boondoggle points out (again another problem with PBs). I've had the same issues myself. I would act quickly though to avoid the beer oxidising and spoiling.

 

[Obadiah Boondoggle]

Likewise I had the same issues with seals that I could never resolve hence I don't use pbs anymore

As BR noted also it needed to have been in a warm place, if it's been in a garage or shed in this cold weather it may not have even fermented - sorry if that's insultingly obvious

 

[dannythemanny]

I have used PBs in the past and haven't had a problem with the CO2 cartridges. However, I found that I only needed to use them once the barrel was nearly half-empty. The priming sugar alone ought to create a lot of pressure in the barrel, and the first couple of pints should come out like nobody's business without using any CO2. When the flow slows down a bit, I would inject a little CO2. So it sounds like either seals are the not sealed, or there was a problem with priming (insufficient sugar, too cold, yeast in poor health, etc). I notice you bottled 12 bottles' worth: did you take this into consideration when figuring out how much sugar to prime with in the PB? Not sure by by how much, but you would need more sugar to pressurise more headspace.

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

The “cardboard trick” is almost certainly your answer to the CO2 bulb issue. Some brands are fine but others need this adaptation.

You might also find something useful in this thread if you haven’t already seen it:

Introduction

I use quite a few bottom-tap King Keg pressure barrels and I have very few problems with them. From discussions on the forum though it’s clear that many people do struggle with pressure barrels so I thought I might put together a few thoughts you might find useful. Although I will be talking about bottom-tap King Kegs in the main there’s quite a lot of information in here that will be useful for other pressure barrels. The tips on the S30 pressure release valve and about taps may still apply regardless of which barrel you use. I hope something in here solves your problem and if it doesn’t, update this thread when you find a solution for others to learn from. Cheers!

 

[Daddynoob]

Thanks a lot guys

as for carbonation I didn’t take into account the extra head space
Also was in the house for carbonation
And the first pint pulled just say came out
Bottles where ok apart from half of the pint was head

 

[Daddynoob]

Found the problem

done the cardboard trick which worked
The air was coming out of the seem. Not the lid
I could feel it on my face
So I wet my finger and could feel it coming out

is the lager ruined or could I transfer it no another Pb

also could I use that Pb just for fermenting or would it need to be glued or sealed in some way

 

[dannythemanny]

If it still tastes good and not like wet cardboard or vinegar, you may try adding more priming sugar into the barrel, mixing it in very gently, and then bottling it all straight from the barrel. Then sling that barrel, or find some other use for it (it may work as a fermenter if you can make it airtight), buy a new pressure barrel and brew up another batch for it.

 

[Daddynoob]

Tastes ok just flat
Will add more sugar and move it to another pb
How much more sugar do I add
Have put 28 one and a half TPS in
Probably not enough

 

[dannythemanny]

Well, assuming the sugar that you initially primed with has been fermented now, I would probably use this calculator: Priming Sugar Calculator

So, let's say you've got 15l of beer in a 25l barrel, giving you 10L headspace, and you want 2 volumes of co2. That gives you a figure of 107g of glucose (corn sugar). But be careful not to overdo it with a pressure barrel - they've a tendency to blow up or crack. Bear in mind that the sugar you first put in may or may not have fermented out.

 

[Daddynoob]

How much more have I to put in

 

[dannythemanny]

Without knowing how much beer you've got and how big the barrel is, I don't know I'm afraid.

 

[Daddynoob]

25ltr Pb
Less 12x750 bottles

then I put in 28 x 1 and a half tsp of sugar in the remainder

 

[dannythemanny]

If I were you, I'd probably be cautious in case of unfermented sugars and go with no more than 90-100g. That should get some carbonation in it assuming no leaks this time! But as I say, you might not want to risk an exploding pressure barrel, as they are probably quite messy and dangerous!

 

[LED_ZEP]

done the cardboard trick which worked

Re the cardboard trick: Be very careful. I've had to do this on occasion but once the cardboard slipped and bulb shot just past my head and made a hole in the plaster board wall. Make sure it's held in tight, your dealing with high pressure gas and a hard object that could be coming your way!

 

[Rodcx500z]

Most modern pb's are rated to 15 psi and will probably have some built in redundacy built in, i never prime with more than 80g of sugar after once trying 100, all i got was foam, and like Danny says if one lets go who knows

 

[531Man]

25ltr Pb

Whoah, when interestedly scanning through this just now, that little detail brought me up short!
Being a chemist for 40 years I instinctively read that as meaning 25 litres of Lead (yes the toxic heavy metal), as Pb is its elemental symbol.
Then my fuzzy brain realised it meant 'pressure barrel' and I calmed down a bit.
I know it was a unintentional use of the symbol but it does highlight the perpetual risks of using abbreviations without prior definition can be confusing.
In the context it was obvious really, but as I said, it was an alarming moment there.
Happy New year all.
Robin.