60 min vs 90 min boils

[AJA]

Will be interesting if decent cold IPAs pop up. Maybe I've been unlucky so far, but everyone I've had so far has been a sulphur bomb, akin to that homebrew cider smell.

 

[Tess Tickle's Brewery]

Cheers Dave! Love that channel so will watch that after tea.

 

[Davegase]

Cheers Dave! Love that channel so will watch that after tea.

You're welcome Tess.
Mr Scochpie also had a go.

 

[Leard]

I do a 30 minute boil. The ExBEERiment convinced me to change, as there doesn't seem to be much difference. I use a peco boiler, and I'm able to get a good rolling boil on it. It means more bittering hops, but in recipe development you just add the extra you want to achieve the same IBU.

 

[Sadfield]

60 min vs 90 min boils?​

I don't do a 60 or 90 minute boil and don't notice the difference, apart from the differences I notice, I then change my recipe.

 

[The Baron]

Here we go again I thought these threads had been done to death

 

[AJA]

As a short / no boil leaning guy I can add a few more downsides to this approach, which I'm not sure have been covered:

• Lower efficiency - less boil off = less pre boil volume = less sparge water - actually Pennine covered this looking back
• Greater need for post boil pH adjustments. The pH drops during the boil, so one may need to add a bit of acid pre fermentation to get towards pH 5 if short boiling.

 

[Sadfield]

As a short / no boil leaning guy I can add a few more downsides to this approach, which I'm not sure have been covered:

• Lower efficiency - less boil off = less pre boil volume = less sparge water - actually Pennine covered this looking back
• Greater need for post boil pH adjustments. The pH drops during the boil, so one may need to add a bit of acid pre fermentation to get towards pH 5 if short boiling.

Exactly, there are positives and negatives to different boil lengths. Even Dave Heath says he prefers the the flavour of a 30 minute boil, which indicates he notices a difference. Which is perfectly valid.

The recurring need to convince people that a 30 minute boil makes no difference, on a thread not about short boiling is hilarious.

 

[Davegase]

60 min vs 90 min boils?​

I don't do a 60 or 90 minute boil and don't notice the difference, apart from the differences I notice, I then change my recipe.

There are many factors that may cause a brewer to adjust a recipe besides boil time !
Availability of specific ingredients, cost of ingredients vs cost of energy and differences between hop harvests.

 

[Sadfield]

There are many factors that may cause a brewer to adjust a recipe besides boil time !
Availability of specific ingredients, cost of ingredients vs cost of energy and differences between hop harvests.

So? The comment was in response to changing hopping rate to directly account for shorter boil time, on a thread about boil time.

 

[Davegase]

So? The comment was in response to changing hopping rate to directly account for shorter boil time, on a thread about boil time.

Which is why I suggested to Tess she should experiment and do what suits her !

 

[Sadfield]

Which is why I suggested to Tess she should experiment and do what suits her !

Tess should do exactly that.

You've missed the point though, which had nothing to do with Tess's post. She clearly identifies a preferable difference in her shorter boil beers. Which is great. It's about the irony of others continually repeating the mantra that a 30 minute boils make no difference, then offering a solutions to account for differences.

 

[Davegase]

Tess should do exactly that.

You've missed the point though, which had nothing to do with Tess's post. She clearly identifies a preferable difference in her shorter boil beers. Which is great. It's about the irony of others continually repeating the mantra that a 30 minute boils make no difference, then offering a solutions to account for differences.

I didn't really miss the point, my point is there isn't right and wrong.
My point applies to everybody, experiment and do what suits you.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Surely it’s a balance between energy cost and hop cost.

 

[Sadfield]

I didn't really miss the point, my point is there isn't right and wrong.
My point applies to everybody, experiment and do what suits you.

You have. Where did I say that shouldn't be the case?

Same thread, last year.

Yes thanks. @Cheshire Cat

.... and no boil..... and 120 minutes boil....all valid methods......all different.

 

[DocAnna]

Next year I have a module which has the chemistry of the boil as part of the MSc... I'm almost looking forward to opening up this discussion all over again . I'm not sure I go with the 'everyone should experiment' route as for many people a brewday is a significant investment in time and resource, so many will want to know what is 'right' and 'wrong'. That the issue causes such debate clearly indicates that there's no clear black and white answer, but there will be preferences.... and speaking as someone who likes marmite with cucumber, I'm all too aware of differences in preference!

 

[Sadfield]

@DocAnna That there is an MSc module on boiling, should be enough to indicate it makes a difference. I look forward to your contribution. Always something to learn.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Next year I have a module which has the chemistry of the boil as part of the MSc... I'm almost looking forward to opening up this discussion all over again . I'm not sure I go with the 'everyone should experiment' route as for many people a brewday is a significant investment in time and resource, so many will want to know what is 'right' and 'wrong'. That the issue causes such debate clearly indicates that there's no clear black and white answer, but there will be preferences.... and speaking as someone who likes marmite with cucumber, I'm all too aware of differences in preference!

MSc... I'm almost looking forward to opening up this discussion all over again

watch out that you’re not thrown off the course

 

[Davegase]

Next year I have a module which has the chemistry of the boil as part of the MSc... I'm almost looking forward to opening up this discussion all over again . I'm not sure I go with the 'everyone should experiment' route as for many people a brewday is a significant investment in time and resource, so many will want to know what is 'right' and 'wrong'. That the issue causes such debate clearly indicates that there's no clear black and white answer, but there will be preferences.... and speaking as someone who likes marmite with cucumber, I'm all too aware of differences in preference!

As you said it's clear there's no black and white, which also means there is no right and wrong !
As I said boil time is one factor that will make a difference.
Which is why I said I would advise people to experiment and do what suits them and not try to find a right and wrong !
Some people will tell you that 30 minutes is wrong others will tell you it's not ! Simple really I usually boil for 58.25 minutes

 

[Tess Tickle's Brewery]

I have read most of this thread but haven't found any discussion on what I was looking for.

My next beer will be the majority pilsner malt, but I want to try the Floor-Malted type. Not sure if I should step-mash it and/or boil for 60 mins instead of my usual 30. All my best beers to date have had a 30 minute boil and much more flavour.

Has anyone brewed with Floor-Malted malts and boiled for 30 mins?

So nobody really had an answer for my question, so I've decided I will try a 30 minute boil on my Floor Malted Pilsner, and post back the results here when the beer is complete.

If it's full of DMS I'll try again with a longer boil.