Which yeast to pick?

[jceg316]

I'm in need if a pack of US and English yeast and wouldn't mind going for something a bit different. For now I'm gonna keep with dried yeast and usually use US-05 and S04, but am looking at MJ West Coast yeast Vs Liberty Bell for my American style IPAs, pales, blondes etc.

For my English styles - best bitters, IPAs, porters, etc - I'm looking at Empire Ale, British Ale (M07) and Burton Union.

Was wondering if anyone has any experience with these and what they would prefer, or if one type of yeast is really good at some styles but not so great with others etc.

Thanks

 

[strange-steve]

I've never used the MJ yeasts so can't comment on them, but I've had good results with Danstar Nottingham and Windsor yeast.
Nottingham is quite clean, neutral, attenuative and works well with many styles including IPA. Windsor is less attenuative but a lot more flavourful and works great for more malty styles, one of my best ever stouts was made with Windsor.

 

[MyQul]

The Liberty Belle is just Burton Union renamed btw, so probably not so good for clean American pales. MJ West coast I think would be what you would want but I've never used it myself

I've used Empire Ale (well actually I've used MJ Dark Ale M03 but it has now been renamed Empire Ale). It's very English but has got quite a low attenution, about 65% I think. But I used some Golden Syrup in the Bitter I used the EA/DA yeast in to dry it out a bit. It still only got 71% attenuation but I managed to get the balance right between the malts, drying effect of the golden syrup and low attenuation of the yeast, and it turned out to be a fantastic bitter.
I havent used Burton union/liberty belle yeast

 

[jceg316]

Thanks for the help on this. I got a pack of West Coast, British Ale Yeast (M07), and a pack of Windsor. Doing some reading it seems it's great in stout and will save it for my next stout/porter.

 

[dad_of_jon]

I'm in need if a pack of US and English yeast and wouldn't mind going for something a bit different. For now I'm gonna keep with dried yeast and usually use US-05 and S04, but am looking at MJ West Coast yeast Vs Liberty Bell for my American style IPAs, pales, blondes etc.

For my English styles - best bitters, IPAs, porters, etc - I'm looking at Empire Ale, British Ale (M07) and Burton Union.

Was wondering if anyone has any experience with these and what they would prefer, or if one type of yeast is really good at some styles but not so great with others etc.

Thanks

MJ west coast yeast M44 is my go to for hoppy beers.

for darker beers I use MJ belgian m27 ale yeast.

I've also tried the MJ saison M29 but can't comment on that yet because
it's still fermenting. (it sounds like the m27 but in a revamped packet!)

I have an m31 & an m47 to try out too.

I have to say I've been more impressed with the MJ dried yeasts than fermentis - even though I started out with fermentis. Their abbeye makes a hell of a mess. - leave lots of headroom if trying that nutter!

I've not had any escape attempts with the MJ range of yeasts so far, and their bavarian wheat beer yeast made a lush weizen.

 

[MyQul]

MJ west coast yeast M44 is my go to for hoppy beers.

for darker beers I use MJ belgian m27 ale yeast.

I've also tried the MJ saison M29 but can't comment on that yet because
it's still fermenting. (it sounds like the m27 but in a revamped packet!)

I have an m31 & an m47 to try out too.

I have to say I've been more impressed with the MJ dried yeasts than fermentis - even though I started out with fermentis. Their abbeye makes a hell of a mess. - leave lots of headroom if trying that nutter!

I've not had any escape attempts with the MJ range of yeasts so far, and their bavarian wheat beer yeast made a lush weizen.

I've also been quite happy with the MJ yeasts. I've been eyeing up the Bavarian Lager yeast for pseudo lagers

 

[jceg316]

MJ west coast yeast M44 is my go to for hoppy beers.

for darker beers I use MJ belgian m27 ale yeast.

I've also tried the MJ saison M29 but can't comment on that yet because
it's still fermenting. (it sounds like the m27 but in a revamped packet!)

I have an m31 & an m47 to try out too.

I have to say I've been more impressed with the MJ dried yeasts than fermentis - even though I started out with fermentis. Their abbeye makes a hell of a mess. - leave lots of headroom if trying that nutter!

I've not had any escape attempts with the MJ range of yeasts so far, and their bavarian wheat beer yeast made a lush weizen.

I've used M47 on my last 2 Belgian beers which I made within days of each other. First one I tried out the fermenter and was very good. Yeast was a bit more subtle than I wanted though and it didn't attenuate too well.

Second one was a Belgian/IPA cross over and again left the FG a bit high. Trying out the fermenter the dry hops were overpowering and I couldn't taste anything else.

I'm interested to see how these beers come out once conditioned in the bottle. The hop character in beer 2 should even out and make way for the yeast character.

I've tried Fermentis Abbey twice and both times the beer came out quite bad. TBH it may not be due to the yeast but a few mistakes I made in both brews.

It's good to see MJ producing a wider range of dried yeasts though, as it's quite annoying there aren't more types.

 

[MyQul]

It's good to see MJ producing a wider range of dried yeasts though, as it's quite annoying there aren't more types.

I think MJ spotted a gap in the market and decided to plug it

 

[jceg316]

I think MJ spotted a gap in the market and decided to plug it

It's about time someone did that!

I have plans next year to do a bunch of tests. My kit is 50 litres so I can make 2x 20 litre brews from one batch, and would like to make 2 batches, then ferment with a liquid yeast and dried yeast equivalent. This way I can find out whether liquid yeast is better, or how it makes a beer different.

I will pick three different yeast styles which I make regularly and see what happens.

 

[dad_of_jon]

I've used M47 on my last 2 Belgian beers which I made within days of each other. First one I tried out the fermenter and was very good. Yeast was a bit more subtle than I wanted though and it didn't attenuate too well.

Second one was a Belgian/IPA cross over and again left the FG a bit high. Trying out the fermenter the dry hops were overpowering and I couldn't taste anything else.

I'm interested to see how these beers come out once conditioned in the bottle. The hop character in beer 2 should even out and make way for the yeast character.

I've tried Fermentis Abbey twice and both times the beer came out quite bad. TBH it may not be due to the yeast but a few mistakes I made in both brews.

It's good to see MJ producing a wider range of dried yeasts though, as it's quite annoying there aren't more types.

some of their yeasts have quite a temp range so I suspect their saison brewed at the low end would be quite different from brewing at the high end almost like 2 yeasts in one.

I've have good attenuation (in line with MJ's figures) with their yeasts but I do re-hydrate the yeast as per mj's instructions.

 

[jceg316]

some of their yeasts have quite a temp range so I suspect their saison brewed at the low end would be quite different from brewing at the high end almost like 2 yeasts in one.

I've have good attenuation (in line with MJ's figures) with their yeasts but I do re-hydrate the yeast as per mj's instructions.

I always rehydrate, but haven't tried playing with temps yet. Most ales I keep at 20C whilst fermenting. I tried playing around with the temps with some Fermentis yeasts and there wasn't much, if any, difference in taste. What temp do you ferment your Belgian yeasts at?

 

[strange-steve]

Belgian beers ususally have a dry finish which requires a low fg, so to help with this fermentation temperatures are often ramped up to keep the yeast awake. My recent quad was pitched at 19° but this was ramped up to 27° over a week. Some saisons are fermented in the high 20s or even into the 30s, but they love high temps and don't kick off weird flavours and fusels like other strains would at those temps.

 

[jceg316]

Belgian beers ususally have a dry finish which requires a low fg, so to help with this fermentation temperatures are often ramped up to keep the yeast awake. My recent quad was pitched at 19° but this was ramped up to 27° over a week. Some saisons are fermented in the high 20s or even into the 30s, but they love high temps and don't kick off weird flavours and fusels like other strains would at those temps.

I've brewed 2 saisons for myself and used that NBS dried saison yeast for both, I got it from the Malt Miller, not seen elsewhere. I know saisons are fermented a bit warmer than standard ales, but didn't feel comfortable pushing this yeast as I'm not sure how great it is.

Both beers came out really well but the yeast was quite subtle and would have liked it to be a bit more in your face. I'm planning another saison and will use the same yeast harvested from a bottle, I would like to play around with the temps to get more from it, but just worried. There's very little online about this strain.

Have you read Brew Like a Monk? The main takeaway from that book is to brew Belgian beer well, it's all about the yeast. Two beers can be almost identical in ingredients, but the fermentation temperature profiles can cause a world of difference. It's something I need to experiment around with more.

 

[strange-steve]

I can't speak for the dry yeast specifically but in general don't be afraid of giving saison a bit of heat. Particularly if you found yours a little too subtle, pitch slightly warmer. Ramping the temperature is more to encourage the dry finish rather than to influence the flavour. Most of the yeast derived flavour will be produced in the first few days, this is why pitching temp is important.
Yep BLAM is a great book, all fans of the Belgian art should read it! What intrigues me is how simple most Belgian recipes are, yet the flavours are astonishing. Westvleteren for example is simply pils malt and sugar :wha:

 

[jceg316]

That's very interesting about the flavour, and has given me much to think about. Belgian beers are quite common in my brew schedule, I look forward to playing around with this.

With my next saison - it's gonna have a load of blackberries in secondary as I plan to brew it in blackberry season, yet I do want some balance of flavours. I normally cool my beers down to ~20C before pitching, would pitching at 25C and holding at this temp bring out the yeast flavours more do you reckon?

My GEB order arrived with the yeasts, they packed the wrong English ale. Instead of M07, a standard English ale, they've given me M42 New World Strong Ale. I can't really be arsed to send back a pack of yeast for one which is probably quite similar anyway. And it says it's suitable for IPAs which is what this yeast was gonna be pitched into. If anything I've saved about 60 cent!

 

[Covrich]

Yes saison really benefit from heat.. push it beyond 24 if you can.. I used the MJ saison yeast .. it was okay not bad actually, I think tbh that style benefits more from the liquid although this wasn't bad.

Thing with saison yeasts is though they are not as versatile..

 

[strange-steve]

Ideal pitching temp will be strain dependant so have a look at the manufacturers recommendations. I agree with the above, I would go for a liquid yeast for this style. The Dupont will easily take 25° or more, the Thierez (which I love) I usually pitch at 23°.

 

[jceg316]

Unfortunately the only instructions I found were very vague, just said something like "ferment above 20". I'll give it a go though and if there are off flavours I'll just add more blackberries and/or dry hop it to high heaven to cover any nasty flavours. :lol:

 

[geigercntr]

I've also tried the MJ saison M29 but can't comment on that yet because
it's still fermenting. (it sounds like the m27 but in a revamped packet.

A beast of a yeast! About to bottle a saison with O.G. 1.078, ended up at F.G. 1.000 after about 4 weeks in the FV at room temp :twisted:

 

[dad_of_jon]

I always rehydrate, but haven't tried playing with temps yet. Most ales I keep at 20C whilst fermenting. I tried playing around with the temps with some Fermentis yeasts and there wasn't much, if any, difference in taste. What temp do you ferment your Belgian yeasts at?

last one I did.... 23-24 deg C which is a little low for the MJ yeast and a little high for fermentis abbaye. I used MJ's that was great as was the bananas I had from their bavarian weiss yeast at the same temps :-)