The Coronavirus thread.

[MyQul]

The herd immunity is the only option left open as I said in post 2,628. You yourself mentioned mumps being the quickest go to whoa vaccine produced, the corona virus SARS still has no vaccine. Unfortunately there will be more deaths but there is no other way out of the situation the world finds itself in. We just have to keep it at a minimum.

Your right it's going to probably be years before we get a vaccine and your also correct we will be getting a lot of deaths (we already have 15,000 and that's just the ones in hospital. There's loads out in the community who arent being counted. But the question is, is enough being done to minimise the deaths. As mentioned we dont have a proper lockdown here and if we all wore face coverings that would greatly reduce the spread

 

[foxy]

Your right it's going to probably be years before we get a vaccine and your also correct we will be getting a lot of deaths (we already have 15,000 and that's just the ones in hospital. There's loads out in the community who arent being counted. But the question is, is enough being done to minimise the deaths. As mentioned we dont have a proper lockdown here and if we all wore face coverings that would greatly reduce the spread

From what I have read a scarf is sufficient for those in the community, the police are handing out fines, in most countries. Singapore is 6 months jail! And they aren't faring to well. What else can any government do, lock downs only work when people are locked down, relax the lock down and away it goes again! Gradual easing IS the only way forward, keeps the pressure off the hospital system. I do hope that a vaccine can be found, but I wouldn't be holding my breath.

 

[MyQul]

From what I have read a scarf is sufficient for those in the community, the police are handing out fines, in most countries. Singapore is 6 months jail! And they aren't faring to well. What else can any government do, lock downs only work when people are locked down, relax the lock down and away it goes again! Gradual easing IS the only way forward, keeps the pressure off the hospital system. I do hope that a vaccine can be found, but I wouldn't be holding my breath.

Track and trace and quarintine does work well. BUT every country on the planet with the money to buy them is trying to get tests

 

[foxy]

Track and trace and quarintine does work well. BUT every country on the planet with the money to buy them is trying to get tests

That's Scomo's intention, but time is running out, we just can't stay becalmed.

 

[MyQul]

That's Scomo's intention, but time is running out, we just can't stay becalmed.

Scomo?

 

[An Ankoù]

Scomo?

Scott Morrison.

 

[An Ankoù]

I have very little sympathy with Andrew Marr, but sometimes he has some decent interviews. This morning's interview with the Oxford University Professor of Virology leading her team towards producing a vaccine was absolutely fascinating and really makes a lot of this very interesting debate redundant. If you have iPlayer or the opportunity to watch this, I would recommend it. I wouldn't recommend the rest of the show.
While everything she said was fascinating, what struck me was her explanation about tackling reinfection. There are two kinds of immunity it would seem, the immunity acquired from surviving infection, which is very short-lived (so herd immunity won't work) and the immunity afforded by vaccination which can last for a number of years. An effective vaccine isn't made from the target virus. but from a related virus in order to provide this long-term immunity. She is about to start human trials next week or very soon after and, with luck, a vaccine could be on the cards around September. Upscaling to provide sufficient doses for mass immunisation will take until the middle of next year provided the Government funds those companies that are capable of doing that to put aside their present work and focus on this project.
It's so refreshing to listen to someone is totally focused and is the leader in her field, who has no political interest, no commercial interest, who knows exactly what she does and doesn't know and has no agenda to pull the wool over our eyes. Watch it if you can.

 

[Leon103]

Indeed - a good debate.

I've also read that many companies are furloughing companies to save the company profits. But what about the employees. But surely it's better that they stay at home and be furloghed (obviously there are many companies whereby you can work at home and not need to be furloughed - are these exclusively the ones you mean?)

I wasn't referring to any company in particular but I can imagine a company taking 80% off all staff costs and shutting down the business yo save overheads than continue trading and making scrubs for the nhs for a couple of quid a pop, there are a reason these things get made overseas.

 

[Clint Eastwood]

I have very little sympathy with Andrew Marr, but sometimes he has some decent interviews. This morning's interview with the Oxford University Professor of Virology leading her team towards producing a vaccine was absolutely fascinating and really makes a lot of this very interesting debate redundant. If you have iPlayer or the opportunity to watch this, I would recommend it. I wouldn't recommend the rest of the show.
While everything she said was fascinating, what struck me was her explanation about tackling reinfection. There are two kinds of immunity it would seem, the immunity acquired from surviving infection, which is very short-lived (so herd immunity won't work) and the immunity afforded by vaccination which can last for a number of years. An effective vaccine isn't made from the target virus. but from a related virus in order to provide this long-term immunity. She is about to start human trials next week or very soon after and, with luck, a vaccine could be on the cards around September. Upscaling to provide sufficient doses for mass immunisation will take until the middle of next year provided the Government funds those companies that are capable of doing that to put aside their present work and focus on this project.
It's so refreshing to listen to someone is totally focused and is the leader in her field, who has no political interest, no commercial interest, who knows exactly what she does and doesn't know and has no agenda to pull the wool over our eyes. Watch it if you can.

This explanation about global vaccination & the drive behind them is a very interesting point of view.
The Corona Scam

 

[MyQul]

I wasn't referring to any company in particular but I can imagine a company taking 80% off all staff costs and shutting down the business yo save overheads than continue trading and making scrubs for the nhs for a couple of quid a pop, there are a reason these things get made overseas.

Thats exactly what I've read. Companies taking the 80% staff costs not paying the other 20% and then hunkering down to ride things out

 

[Chippy_Tea]

I wouldn't put it down to incompetence or deliberate neglect,

Neither would i there is a world shortage of PPE as ive mentioned elsewhere they have only just managed to get some into SWMBO's care home after weeks of trying.



Can supply meet demand?

The government acknowledges it will require a "Herculean logistical effort" to get the right PPE to those who need it.

Global demand for this equipment is at unprecedented levels and several countries have placed export bans on the sale of PPE.

Ministers have recruited UK companies, like Burberry, to turn over production lines and start making PPE.

Deliveries of kit will now happen every day, rather than every few days, says the government.

There is a hotline that NHS and social care workers can call to request PPE.



How much kit has the government sent out?

By the weekend of 18 and 19 April, one billion items of PPE will have been shipped in the UK - according to Health Secretary, Matt Hancock.

The government has not yet given a breakdown of those items, but on 10 April, when it said it had provided 761 million pieces of PPE, it gave the following details:

• Deliveries to hospitals, hospices, care homes, home care providers, GPs, pharmacists and dentists
• 158 million masks (surgical masks and more highly protective FFP3 masks, but it is unclear how many of each type)
• 135 million aprons
• one million gowns
• 360 million pairs of gloves

The 761 million figure also included body bags, pulse oximeters, swabs, clinical waste containers, cleaning equipment and detergent to NHS Trusts.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52254745

 

[Chippy_Tea]

So the owners of the small clothing manufacturers would sooner go broke than manufacture whatever they can, and get paid, are they stupid or something? Maybe Boris has been to generous with his hand outs.

I am only kicking the tyres but i wonder if the material used in these gowns that repel fluids is in short supply hence hundreds of manufactures not churning out gowns.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Your right it's going to probably be years before we get a vaccine and your also correct we will be getting a lot of deaths

5 months if the scientists are to be believed -


Scientists at the University of Oxford say they should have at least a million doses of a coronavirus vaccine by September this year.

The UK government, which is backing the project, said there were "no guarantees" and it was not possible to put a date on a vaccine.

The first patients are expected to take part in the Oxford trials next week.

However, it is still too soon to know whether it will be either safe or effective.

Most experts still estimate it will take 12 to 18 months to develop and manufacture a vaccine.


What is a coronavirus vaccine?

Vaccines train the immune system to prevent people developing a disease, such as Covid-19.

If enough people become immune then the coronavirus would not be able to spread so effectively and social distancing measures would no longer be necessary.

Approximately 80 groups around the world, including major pharmaceutical companies, are trying to develop a vaccine and some have already begun human trials.

This research is taking pla

Full article - Scientists target a million vaccines by September

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Not sure if this has been posted already: support the Nhs....not like this though. Thursday 8pm London

WTF are the police doing.

 

[MyQul]

Neither would i there is a world shortage of PPE as ive mentioned elsewhere they have only just managed to get some into SWMBO's care home after weeks of trying.



Can supply meet demand?

The government acknowledges it will require a "Herculean logistical effort" to get the right PPE to those who need it.

Global demand for this equipment is at unprecedented levels and several countries have placed export bans on the sale of PPE.

Ministers have recruited UK companies, like Burberry, to turn over production lines and start making PPE.

Deliveries of kit will now happen every day, rather than every few days, says the government.

There is a hotline that NHS and social care workers can call to request PPE.



How much kit has the government sent out?

By the weekend of 18 and 19 April, one billion items of PPE will have been shipped in the UK - according to Health Secretary, Matt Hancock.

The government has not yet given a breakdown of those items, but on 10 April, when it said it had provided 761 million pieces of PPE, it gave the following details:

• Deliveries to hospitals, hospices, care homes, home care providers, GPs, pharmacists and dentists
• 158 million masks (surgical masks and more highly protective FFP3 masks, but it is unclear how many of each type)
• 135 million aprons
• one million gowns
• 360 million pairs of gloves

The 761 million figure also included body bags, pulse oximeters, swabs, clinical waste containers, cleaning equipment and detergent to NHS Trusts.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52254745

There's a shortage of PPE in the uk possibly because the government didnt keep stockpiles up rather than because of a world shortage

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...uk-pandemic-stockpile-fell-by-40-in-six-years
Those are some big figures but also in the link;

"Is this enough?
This is the vital question that is difficult to answer.

There are around 1.58 million NHS staff across the UK in hospitals and the community. All of them will require varying amounts of PPE depending on the type of work they are doing"

Were getting a delivery of 84 tonnes of gowns today from turket but they wont last long perhaps only a few days

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52340215
"An 84-tonne shipment of gowns from Turkey on Sunday will be welcomed, but it won't last long given there are around half a million front-line NHS staff."

 

[Chippy_Tea]

MyQul said:

"An 84-tonne shipment of gowns from Turkey on Sunday will be welcomed, but it won't last long given there are around half a million front-line NHS staff."

A personal protective equipment (PPE) delivery from Turkey to the UK has been delayed, the government has said.

Cabinet minister Robert Jenrick said on Saturday that 84 tonnes of PPE would arrive on Sunday, after accepting it was in "short supply" in some areas.

A government spokesman confirmed the delay on Sunday, saying they were working "to ensure the shipment is delivered as soon as possible".

A source told the BBC they hoped it would arrive in the coming days.

The pledge to take delivery of more PPE came after warnings that some hospitals' intensive care units could run out of gowns over the weekend.

Niall Dickson, chief executive of the NHS Confederation, said the shipment contained only "a few days' supply" - and while it "may be enough to avert an absolute crisis over this weekend... it doesn't solve the longer term problem".

Public Health England changed its advice on Friday to allow the NHS to re-use gowns if stock was running low, saying "some compromise" was needed "in times of extreme shortages".

NHS England's medical director Prof Stephen Powis said for the guidance on the use of protective equipment to be properly followed, it was "absolutely critical above everything else that we have the supplies of PPE going out to the front line".

But some frontline staff say they do not have the equipment they need.

Cabinet Office Minister Michael Gove said the UK had built up stocks of PPE in expectation of a flu pandemic - as well as to prepare for the possibility of a no-deal Brexit - but he said there was a "worldwide pressure" on supplies.

However, he told the BBC's Andrew Marr the extra resources would be coming from Turkey "this weekend", along with another 25 million gowns, that were coming from China.

The government has appointed Lord Deighton, who headed the organising committee of the London Olympics, to resolve problems with supplies and distribution of PPE.

 

[bobukbrewer]

Barbour in Tyne and Wear are making gowns etc.........

 

[Chippy_Tea]

There's a shortage of PPE possibly because the government didnt keep stockpiles up rather than because of a world shortage

I think we all realise the government slipped up by not storing millions of pounds of PPE just in case (its been discussed several times in the thread) but we are not the only country to do so and all countries are now chasing PPE and struggling (see my post below)

 

[MyQul]

I think we all realise the government slipped up by not storing millions of pounds of PPE just in case (its been discussed several times in the thread) but we are not the only country to do so and all countries are now chasing PPE and struggling (see my post below)

But as it has already been discussed we "wargamed" a pandemic in 2016 with Excercise Cygnus so we shouldnt have slipped up. And yet more revelations today;

"The government is under pressure to reveal how it responded to four key recommendations made three years ago after a major simulation exercise found the NHS would not cope in the face of a flu pandemic.

The recommendations are revealed in the June 2017 minutes of the New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group – Nervtag – which advises the government on pandemics.

They were made after Exercise Cygnus, a three-day simulation involving national, regional ad local government bodies, conducted in October 2016."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/19/government-under-fire-failing-pandemic-recommendations

 

[Chippy_Tea]

But as it has already been discussed we "wargamed" a pandemic in 2016 with Excercise Cygnus so we shouldnt have slipped up. And yet more revelations today;

No one will disagree they ****** up but what is the point in keeping bringing that up its not going to change anything as it isn't in all the other countries that didn't stockpile PPE, its what they do now that is important and how they handle bringing lock down to an end.