The Coronavirus thread.

[nige]

Per the WHO report on Wuhan "Among 344 clusters involving 1308 cases (out of a total 1836 cases reported) in Guangdong Province and Sichuan Province, most clusters (78%-85%) have occurred in families. "

And in reality lockdowns seem to reduce contact by 75% but not totally (per eg the Imperial modelling)

No not when a large proportion of self employed, motorway, and even mathalan? Construction Workers are encourages out to work or find work, social distancing for a proportion won't work, even a clip of BBC staff behind the scenes today shows people next to each other. We have no idea where it is either, I very much doubt we can get rid of this quickly, I think international travel will not be allowed for a long time.

 

[trueblue]

As I said Chrissy and most of he colleagues believe this is more of a PR stunt than a solution as opening up wards they have shut will highlight what has happened over the last several years.

 

[MyQul]

No not when a large proportion of self employed, motorway, and even mathalan? Construction Workers are encourages out to work or find work, social distancing for a proportion won't work, even a clip of BBC staff behind the scenes today shows people next to each other. We have no idea where it is either, I very much doubt we can get rid of this quickly, I think international travel will not be allowed for a long time.

I think UK airports are still open and flights still landing. It's only the airlines themselves which are stopping the flights because it's uneconomical to contnue

 

[Northern_Brewer]

An owner (like a brewery) obviously can't oversee the bar and the daily running, so an employee becomes licensed to run it. I grew up in a pub, my Dad was the Landlord of it, the Licensee.

Hence the little signs you see now and again 'Billy Bloggs is licensed to sell beer ales etc etc etc within the premises'

Those signs applied under the old system, but since 2003 effectively it's been split in two. The premises have a licence (which controls eg how late it can open), and the Designated Premises Supervisor has to have taken an exam (on licensing law etc) before they can have a Personal Licence. The DPS is typically the manager or tenant - the "publican".

These days the owner of the pub will typically be a brewery or pubco like Punch, Stonegate etc. They either employ a manager directly (in which case the owner retains pretty close control) or grant a lease to a tenant for 10 years or whatever. Typically the lease will be granted to a company owned by the tenant and the owner will have less control of the day to day stuff (but will usually still insist on the tenant buying beer from them).

According to Whatpub this pub doesn't sell cask, which suggests it probably isn't owned by a brewery. I imagine the DPS will have the book thrown at them and be stripped of their personal licence, and possibly conditions put on the premises licence.

 

[simon12]

I don't think the owner should lose his business as according to the article he was unaware this was going on, the licencee however is a different matter.

The premises has a license which has a premises supervisor (who has a personal license and is usually known as the licensee who would normally be the owner or manager but could be anyone who works there) who is responsible for training all staff in matters relating to the license. I don't see in this case the license has been violated as the rule to not open does not remove the license to sell alcohol, I don't really have any more knowledge on this but I don't see it as a licensing issue and have no idea if its a criminal issue.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

As I said Chrissy and most of he colleagues believe this is more of a PR stunt than a solution as opening up wards they have shut will highlight what has happened over the last several years.

Surely there's a pretty good medical reason to have dedicated COVID hospitals, and that's to keep the COVID patients (and staff) a long way away from the "regular" work of the hospital (which still goes on)? I've got a relative in intensive care after emergency surgery at the moment, and the last thing I want them to be doing is to be anywhere near hundreds of COVID patients.

 

[simon12]

Surely there's a pretty good medical reason to have dedicated COVID hospitals, and that's to keep the COVID patients (and staff) a long way away from the "regular" work of the hospital (which still goes on)? I've got a relative in intensive care after emergency surgery at the moment, and the last thing I want them to be doing is to be anywhere near hundreds of COVID patients.

I speculated early on they may dedicate some hospitals to Covid 19 and other try to keep as free from it as possible.

 

[Bevvied]

Thanks Northern Brewer
A DPS, you learn something new every day!

 

[trueblue]

Surely there's a pretty good medical reason to have dedicated COVID hospitals, and that's to keep the COVID patients (and staff) a long way away from the "regular" work of the hospital (which still goes on)? I've got a relative in intensive care after emergency surgery at the moment, and the last thing I want them to be doing is to be anywhere near hundreds of COVID patients.

She believes they could have done that easier by opening up closed ward just for covid.

 

[MyQul]

Surely there's a pretty good medical reason to have dedicated COVID hospitals, and that's to keep the COVID patients (and staff) a long way away from the "regular" work of the hospital (which still goes on)? I've got a relative in intensive care after emergency surgery at the moment, and the last thing I want them to be doing is to be anywhere near hundreds of COVID patients.

I read there's a country doing the opposite (think it might be austria but cant remember tbh) They put all the 'normal' patients in nightingale like 'pop up' hospitals and all the covids in the regular hospitals so the all the Drs and Nurses can concentrate on the Covids

 

[nige]

I think UK airports are still open and flights still landing. It's only the airlines themselves which are stopping the flights because it's uneconomical to contnue

It's almost funny as that's how it spread over the world in the first place, each country is now responsible for somehow cornering and isolating this virus until its starved of hosts and killed before any international travel allowed, airports should be shut down, only airforce emergency aid of materials needed allowed if any. I fear the government tactics on this are only to prevent total chaos. That's it.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

I don't see in this case the license has been violated as the rule to not open does not remove the license to sell alcohol, I don't really have any more knowledge on this but I don't see it as a licensing issue and have no idea if its a criminal issue.

The new Coronavirus Act/Regulations are pretty wide-ranging, and I think it's pretty clear that this get-together was in breach of them.

Remember the statutory licensing objectives :
• The prevention of crime and disorder;
• Public safety;
• The prevention of public nuisance; and
• The protection of children from harm

I think you could argue that this lockin contravened just about all of those.

 

[MyQul]

It's almost funny as that's how it spread over the world in the first place, each country is now responsible for somehow cornering and isolating this virus until its starved of hosts and killed before any international travel allowed, airports should be shut down, only airforce emergency aid of materials needed allowed if any. I fear the government tactics on this are only to prevent total chaos. That's it.

Seems obvious that you'd close the airports you'd think (with the exception of repatriation of those trapped abroad). Why there still open I dont know. Apparently they're all deserted anyway. If I lived near one that's where I'd go for my daily exercise

 

[nige]

I drive a transit van, luckily I work alone but if you notice any vehicle with two or more people in ie all police, emergency services not to mention taxis and every other, that's isn't social distancing either.

 

[nige]

I think the facts are, we've totally lost the plot on this now and have no choice but to try and slow it down whilst it goes through the population, eventually corner it but without testing we are blind.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

I drive a transit van, luckily I work alone but if you notice any vehicle with two or more people in ie all police, emergency services not to mention taxis and every other, that's isn't social distancing either.

I work alone so distancing isn't a problem, the blokes that double up can only do so in HGV's.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

I think the facts are, we've totally lost the plot on this now and have no choice but to try and slow it down

Wasn't this always the plan lower the curve so the NHS doesn't get overwhelmed.

 

[Rodcx500z]

Look at this 3-49 home bargains in a secret location

 

[dad_of_jon]

Yes we are all individual and for the record i am a free market kind of guy foxy.

Its the trust and competance of our elected representitives from all parties i am worried about.

If those in power were as smart as the salarys would seem to indicate we all would have fewer problems in life.

One thing i did learn from years in buisiness is over promotion of an individual above and beyond natural abilities leads to disaster ( every time!!!)

The Famous Peter Principle... An ex colleague in my department became head of the department. I left and with no-one there to wipe his derriere for him to clean up his **** he failed big time. My new job payed the same as my old job, I had a nice brucie bonus and not only work 1/2 the year. Even in the midst of injustice karma seems to play a role

 

[nige]

Wasn't this always the plan lower the curve so the NHS doesn't get overwhelmed.

Yes but I think it was supposed to be about saving lives. It is that bit that's gone it's now more die slowly so we can cope.