The Budget

[Bitter_Dave]

As said above, things like education and health are essential for a well functioning productive economy (and for companies to be successful). Employers need educated and healthy employees. Benefit levels are at poverty levels, but yet we have people on long term sick leave who can't return to work because of massive waiting lists to get help from the NHS. Meanwhile, our schools are crumbling and there are shortages of teachers in subjects like maths. Whether you like it or not, there has to be a huge injection of cash into public services and it has to come from somewhere. Bit too easy to just dispute the extent of the financial black hole.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Somebody hasn't got their head around the concept of children.

I am hoping Rod has an answer to the countries financial problems I am looking forward to reading it later.

 

[JockyBrewer]

As said above, things like education and health are essential for a well functioning productive economy (and for companies to be successful). Employers need educated and healthy employees. Benefit levels are at poverty levels, but yet we have people on long term sick leave who can't return to work because of massive waiting lists to get help from the NHS. Meanwhile, our schools are crumbling and there are shortages of teachers in subjects like maths. Whether you like it or not, there has to be a huge injection of cash into public services and it has to come from somewhere. Bit too easy to just dispute the extent of the financial black hole.

Yep. Schools and education solves pretty much everything, and only get more powerful over time.

 

[Stu]

I think for the majority of people, this budget is going to have a minimal impact. As above, inflation may go up, but then people might feel the hit in their pocket and spend less.

Frankly, I think we got away lightly. Starmer has been saying since he got into power that "difficult financial decisions would need to be made".

I've yet to see much official response from Big Nige (best paid MP in the commons apparently). The OBR said their plans were wild and completely unfunded.

 

[Stu]

Oh and on the children thing, we are now at the lowest childbirth rate in the UK ever. And that includes all the immigrants and everyone else.

We're an aging population. 1/3 of those not working are retired. That will increase to half (so 25% of the population) in the next few years.

I keep saying it. Go look at the issues that Japan have. Basically, families are expected to look after their parents because there's no money in the pot for pensions.

The full state pension in Japan (only available to those who paid in for 40 years) is around £5k a year. If you had kids and took some years out, tough!

 

[Agentgonzo]

I would love to know where people think the government were going to get the money from to get us out of the mess the Tories left the country in.

One of the Tories two favourite places:
* The Magic Money Tree: or
* Tax everyone else except me

 

[Agentgonzo]

We are now a nation of about 70 million, how many of those 70 million are working the answer is 37.4 million, the current known population as of 2024 is 69,275,873 million so just over half is supporting the other half, you don't need a degree in economics to know that it doesn't work, so their answer the government is to tax people more which is the easy option what they should do is sort it out properly it can't be that hard can it

If only you'd said that to Cameron 14 years ago... We'd be in a fruitful Nirvana!

 

[Rodcx500z]

What would you suggest Rod if you think it's easy to fix?

I wish i knew the answer Chippy, but something has to be done

 

[Agentgonzo]

so just over half is supporting the other half, you don't need a degree in economics to know that it doesn't work

I'm curious for your reasoning here. Why doesn't it work?

Think back to a typical 1960s household. Or a 1930s one. Or a 1970s one. A typical 4-person family had one working father supporting a housewife (not classified as working) and two children (not working). In that case only it was twice at bad as 50% working. I'm not an economics professor, so maybe you could explain to me how it doesn't work (and from what I can see "has never worked")

 

[Agentgonzo]

I wish i knew the answer Chippy, but something has to be done

... Like raising taxes to pay for things

 

[Agentgonzo]

it can't be that hard can it

What would you suggest Rod if you think it's easy to fix?

I wish i knew the answer Chippy

... Maybe it's harder than you think!

 

[Rodcx500z]

I'm curious for your reasoning here. Why doesn't it work?

Think back to a typical 1960s household. Or a 1930s one. Or a 1970s one. A typical 4-person family had one working father supporting a housewife (not classified as working) and two children (not working). In that case only it was twice at bad as 50% working. I'm not an economics professor, so maybe you could explain to me how it doesn't work (and from what I can see "has never worked")

Yeah and all you did was work eat and sleep, what a way to live your life

 

[Brew_DD2]

Somebody hasn't got their head around the concept of children.

Or retired people (a sizeable and growing demographic).

Unemployment isn't a massive issue in the country. Conversely, we have industries struggling to recruit.

 

[Agentgonzo]

Yeah and all you did was work eat and sleep, what a way to live your life

So you're not really explaining anything ... Just ranting. Got it.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Agentgonzo - I'm curious for your reasoning here. Why doesn't it work?

Think back to a typical 1960s household. Or a 1930s one. Or a 1970s one. A typical 4-person family had one working father supporting a housewife (not classified as working) and two children (not working). In that case only it was twice at bad as 50% working. I'm not an economics professor, so maybe you could explain to me how it doesn't work (and from what I can see "has never worked")

Rod - Yeah and all you did was work eat and sleep, what a way to live your life

Sorry Rod that is way too much of a sweeping statement for me to let it go.

My Dad did a 40 hour week he earned enough to pay the bills and bring up three kids, my Mam was a full time housewife (as called back then) my dad went out every Friday night he played in the local Darts league and on Saturday they went out together paying a sitter to look after us, life was so much simpler back then, no video, set top boxes, computers, laptops, mobile phones and must have kitchen gadgets etc, they didn't live beyond their means back then unlike today where most stuff is bought on credit so their outgoings were small we were not well off but we were happy.

 

[JockyBrewer]

I keep saying it. Go look at the issues that Japan have. Basically, families are expected to look after their parents because there's no money in the pot for pensions.

The full state pension in Japan (only available to those who paid in for 40 years) is around £5k a year. If you had kids and took some years out, tough!

Isn’t that more of a cultural thing?

Multi generational households can be a good thing as the grandparents help raise the grandchildren while parents work.

Grandparents are then cared for as they need it.

If you can stand living with your parents!

 

[Bitter_Dave]

We have had stagnant wages over much of the last 14 years and many of the jobs created after the financial crash were low paid and insecure. We have fallen behind most European countries and the US in terms of living standards by quite a wide margin. It's not just about how many people are out of work, it also matters the quality of the jobs of those in work have (and what they can do because of their skills, health etc.). The route out of this is investment as a country, not lowering taxes and it isn't about going back to a male breadwinner model - it is about encouraging and supporting dual earner households (increasing productive employment, and compensating to some degree for population ageing). A good number of European countries have higher tax rates than us (even now) and higher living standards. None of this is easy but the Tory experiment over the last 14 years of severe austerity has been a massive disaster.

 

[Agentgonzo]

Basically, families are expected to look after their parents because there's no money in the pot for pensions.

Cause Vs effect. Are they expected to look after them because there is no money in the pot.

Or is there no money for it in the pot because it's their culture the families look after themselves?

I honestly don't know.

 

[Leon103]

Or retired people (a sizeable and growing demographic).

Unemployment isn't a massive issue in the country. Conversely, we have industries struggling to recruit.

Problem with unemployment figures is that every government cooks the books amd changes the rules to what counts as unemployed.

The Financial benefits to remain unemployed are huge, these loads of hidden things such as free school meals, uniform, money towards school equipment and trips. Local authority grants, heating allowances etc etc.


My wife employs over 20 members of staff and the biggest barrier for growth is getting staff, she is forever in dialogue with DWP about taking people on. DWP often advice people to remain on benefits, it's crazy.

 

[Larse]

Problem with unemployment figures is that every government cooks the books amd changes the rules to what counts as unemployed.

The Financial benefits to remain unemployed are huge, these loads of hidden things such as free school meals, uniform, money towards school equipment and trips. Local authority grants, heating allowances etc etc.


My wife employs over 20 members of staff and the biggest barrier for growth is getting staff, she is forever in dialogue with DWP about taking people on. DWP often advice people to remain on benefits, it's crazy.

Would you do it? All those benefits must make it worth your while.