Supermarkets and the race to the bottom

[Dutto]

craft beer
noun
A beer made by a person called Tristan with a twatty beard, who is taking time out from surviving on his meager trust fund to 'live the reality' with the common man by producing keg beer that costs £25 a pint.

It's a pity that I can't press that "Like" button more than once!

 

[Dutto]

......... and maybe it really does come out at circa £1 a Litre.

........

My "underselling" comment had absolutely nothing to do with the cost ...

... and everything to do with your comment "... beer of maybe roughly similar quality."

If you are only making "beer of maybe roughly similar quality." then you really aren't trying!

 

[Slid]

My "underselling" comment had absolutely nothing to do with the cost ...

... and everything to do with your comment "... beer of maybe roughly similar quality."

If you are only making "beer of maybe roughly similar quality." then you really aren't trying!

Nice one, mate! Well appreciated.

 

[simon12]

Over the last few months I have got a load of trade price lists from small breweries (nearly all 10BBL or less) and theres not a can or bottle between them I can get for £1.25 regardless of the quantity I buy and thats without the VAT added. Not really making a specific point except what you can get in supermarkets is made on a seriously large scale at a low profit margin which must make the brewers cut costs on everything but doesn't mean bad beer but suggests it won't be the best.

 

[Scottyburto]

Can i throw the minimum wage amount into the price debate? Its £7.83 an hour for over 25s outside of london. Even donald trump couldnt run a micro brewery at £1 a litre. Therein lies the rub, what defines a "micro brewery"?
Its all just marketing vocabulary really! If hobbycraft sold carlsberg would it be craft beer?

 

[Dutto]

........ If hobbycraft sold carlsberg would it be craft beer?

Nope! It would still be sh!te beer!

 

[Scottyburto]

About 8-10 years ago i worked in a pub in north yorkshire and the landlord used to do "extra curicular" events to earn some extra money away from the brewery who had the tenancy! He used to order "bright" casks for cash on delivery from local breweries! (Lets say Simothy Sailor and Copper Dinosaur as examples) These were more expensive because they were already conditioned, mobile and you'd get almost the full 11gallon/50 litre yield! Back then the cost was £100-£130 delivered! Meaning £2 to £2.60 a litre. God knows what theyd charge now but id only describe those as independent breweries & not micro breweries!

 

[Hoddy]

Over the last few months I have got a load of trade price lists from small breweries (nearly all 10BBL or less) and theres not a can or bottle between them I can get for £1.25 regardless of the quantity I buy and thats without the VAT added. Not really making a specific point except what you can get in supermarkets is made on a seriously large scale at a low profit margin which must make the brewers cut costs on everything but doesn't mean bad beer but suggests it won't be the best.

This is exactly what Im getting at and why I started this thread. What damage does this mass production / sell it cheap / low margin do to the quality craft beer movement and the proper micro guys. How can they survive on a 5p a can margin?


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[Scottyburto]

Im afraid your under the illusion supermarkets actually pay the vat they charge! Im not a supermarket accountant but i dont think they pay vat when they sell a product at a "loss" irrespective of all the other myriad of tax loop holes!

 

[Scottyburto]

So...
The supermarket demand killed the quality and variety of mass produced lager and beer. People wanted more variety or something better which led to cask and now craft becoming more popular. Now supermarkets want to squeeze them too?

 

[dan125]

I have no problem paying more for very hoppy beers as I know they are much more costly to make.
The AIPA I'm making tomorrow uses £50 worth of ingredients for 28L (excluding yeast) whereas the bitter that's in the FV now cost £20.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if the profit margins on the macro tradtional ales is bigger than the craftsters make on the hoppy beers, just because of the cost of the hops.

 

[GerritT]

Craft has become meaningless.
And consider for instance this: "Grandma's apple pie".
What if grandma couldn't cook?

 

[MickDundee]

The AIPA I'm making tomorrow uses £50 worth of ingredients for 28L (excluding yeast)

What are you putting in it? I made a NEIPA with a GEB custom gain kit and 375g of hops and it only came in at around £30 including yeast!

 

[Martybhoy]

Craft has become meaningless.
And consider for instance this: "Grandma's apple pie".
What if grandma couldn't cook?

I never even had a Grandma.

 

[dan125]

What are you putting in it? I made a NEIPA with a GEB custom gain kit and 375g of hops and it only came in at around £30 including yeast!

It breaks down roughly to:-
£5 - Ashbeck water
£13 - 8kg grain
£32 - 475g hops inc citra, denali & nelson

 

[Hoddy]

It breaks down roughly to:-
£5 - Ashbeck water
£13 - 8kg grain
£32 - 475g hops inc citra, denali & nelson

YEEEESSSSS!


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[Scottyburto]

I think u need to look at growing ur own hops!

 

[dan125]

I think u need to look at growing ur own hops!

I am growing a cascade plant, but sadly I don't think the garden is big enough to be self sufficient.

 

[dan125]

YEEEESSSSS!

Its pretty much the same as the last one I sent you - 28L batch remember so not toooo outrageous

 

[Slid]

I never even had a Grandma.

You have and had exactly two grandmothers, same as everyone else. Whether you met them or not is a completely different matter.