Soufflet Malt

[jambop]

Hi Anybody ever used Soufflet maltings products for their brewing? I am a great one for the saying " you get what you pay for " but a 25kg sac of pale malt is coming in at 33.80€ which seems a good price when compared to my normal Simpsons MO at 47€ for the 25kg thinking about getting a sac to try.

I sometimes wonder about malts in as much as if for example you use 4kg of pale for a 25L brew the soufflet comes in at 5.28€ and the Simpsons MO at 7.52€ so in fact the price difference is only 9 cents per litre... is buying cheap really just penny pinching?

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Bear in mind that Soufflet bought United Malt Group just over a year ago and seem to be in the process of imposing Soufflet branding over everything, so any British malt with Soufflet branding is probably what we know as Baird's. Who are not one of my favourite maltsters, whereas Simpsons are. So that would be worth something to me, and Otter is worth a premium over ordinary barley varieties.

But then I imagine Soufflet can do some of the other stuff like logistics to France, cheaper than Simpsons can. Malt is heavy, so transporting it anywhere gets expensive and so you'd expect that if you could get French domestic barley of the same quality as British barley, then the UK barley would be significantly more expensive just because of transport costs (and Brexit-imposed border costs). It sounds like you're talking about UK barley from Soufflet though?

So it's up to you, you're the brewer, if the Soufflet malt is good enough for your purposes, then save yourself the €14 per sack. Personally, for a typical pale ale, I would pay the extra for Simpson's Otter over Baird ordinary.

 

[jambop]

Yes you are right and I do normally buy Simpsons MO . All of my beers are in the British style so that is why I choose British malt when it is available. My suppliers are always keen to have British malts. The used to do Crisp but now are selling Simpsons, it costs a bit more but they do MO and GP as well as a really good selection of crystals and roasted. The other malts the do are Weyermann and de Chateau

 

[The Baron]

The only way is to buy a bag ad use it yourself to form your own opinion.
All brewers have favourite malts but there are plenty that swap from one to the other depending on price.
Minch is cheap but has always had a decent name

 

[An Ankoù]

Hi Anybody ever used Soufflet maltings products for their brewing? I am a great one for the saying " you get what you pay for " but a 25kg sac of pale malt is coming in at 33.80€ which seems a good price when compared to my normal Simpsons MO at 47€ for the 25kg thinking about getting a sac to try.

I sometimes wonder about malts in as much as if for example you use 4kg of pale for a 25L brew the soufflet comes in at 5.28€ and the Simpsons MO at 7.52€ so in fact the price difference is only 9 cents per litre... is buying cheap really just penny pinching?

I've just got a bag of their Pilsner, which I haven;t tried yet.
You don't have to buy Simpson's MO from Rolling Beers: their €47 is €65 with shipping. You could buy Paul's MO from Brouwland for €55 including shipping or get a sack of Minch Pale from HBC for €50 delivered- excellent malt!
But give the Soufflet a whirl. I'm going to. Why should it be awful?

 

[jambop]

I've just got a bag of their Pilsner, which I haven;t tried yet.
You don't have to buy Simpson's MO from Rolling Beers: their €47 is €65 with shipping. You could buy Paul's MO from Brouwland for €55 including shipping or get a sack of Minch Pale from HBC for €50 delivered- excellent malt!
But give the Soufflet a whirl. I'm going to. Why should it be awful?

Yes the Rolling beers del is pricey but excellent. I have ordered and recieved the goods next day. I have tried Brouwland too but I always return to Rolling beers.
I usually only make big orders so the cost of del is minimal but given the price differential maybe its time to start buying with economy in mind.

 

[jambop]

I've just got a bag of their Pilsner, which I haven;t tried yet.
You don't have to buy Simpson's MO from Rolling Beers: their €47 is €65 with shipping. You could buy Paul's MO from Brouwland for €55 including shipping or get a sack of Minch Pale from HBC for €50 delivered- excellent malt!
But give the Soufflet a whirl. I'm going to. Why should it be awful?

It is funny how making a simple enquiry can open your eyes . Looking at the malt Prices at Brouwland shows them to be very much cheaper that Rolling beers. I may be reaquainting myself with Brouwland

 

[An Ankoù]

Bear in mind that Soufflet bought United Malt Group just over a year ago and seem to be in the process of imposing Soufflet branding over everything, so any British malt with Soufflet branding is probably what we know as Baird's. Who are not one of my favourite maltsters, whereas Simpsons are. So that would be worth something to me, and Otter is worth a premium over ordinary barley varieties.

Yes they did, they also bought Malterie du Château but I don't see any evidence that either have been rebranded. Soufflet, too have been acquired and are now part of the InVivo group. Bairds are still operating as Bairds and Château are still operating as Château as far as I can see. Soufflet have several maltings of their own in France so I don't see why they should import British Pale malt to flog off under their own name.
Maris Otter has its place. There are other "premium" malts better suited to other styes of beer. Why would you want to use MO in a stout for example, or even a mild when a darker roast malt can give a richer flavour. Golden Promise has a place in the ales that can not really be substituted by MO. Crafty Maltings Laueate Pale is delicious. I'd use it all the time if I could get it. I don't know which barey Minch use for their Hookhead Pale, but that is a very good general purpose alt. The one that used to leave me cold was Crisp's Best Pale, but it was OK for many styles. It's not the case that MO is "premium" and all the others are "ordinary".

 

[An Ankoù]

It is funny how making a simple enquiry can open your eyes . Looking at the malt Prices at Brouwland shows them to be very much cheaper that Rolling beers. I may be reaquainting myself with Brouwland

I stopped using them ages ago because I found their delivery charges quite ridiculous. They seem to have turned this around in spades. I haven't tried Paul's Maris Oter (sic) yet. But I'll give it a go very soon.

 

[MashBag]

I used to use brouwland a lot for all sorts, alas they don't ship to the uk now.

 

[jambop]

I stopped using them ages ago because I found their delivery charges quite ridiculous. They seem to have turned this around in spades. I haven't tried Paul's Maris Oter (sic) yet. But I'll give it a go very soon.

I used Pauls MO which I got from Brouwland and it was very good for my Bitters, Pale ales and ESB style beers. I do not make stouts though I do make Dark milds and Porter at Christmas time. I am no expert when it comes to malt choices... but if all malts were the same then the cheapest would be the way to go. I bought a sac of Dingemans pale malt and it was a good price but to be honest maybe it was just my imagination but I thought it had a bit of a sour/ twangy after taste?

 

[An Ankoù]

I used Pauls MO which I got from Brouwland and it was very good for my Bitters, Pale ales and ESB style beers. I do not make stouts though I do make Dark milds and Porter at Christmas time. I am no expert when it comes to malt choices... but if all malts were the same then the cheapest would be the way to go. I bought a sac of Dingemans pale malt and it was a good price but to be honest maybe it was just my imagination but I thought it had a bit of a sour/ twangy after taste?

I don't think cheapest is necessarily the way to go. You need to find the malt that's right for you at the best price. When Saveur Bière were a proper company instead of the third-rate bottle shop they've become, they used to sell Castle Maltings products at a very reasonable price. Not much wrong with the products, but they're not suited to English styles: their pale is darker than many Viennas and their Pisner is more suited to French / Belgian blondes than the crisp German / Czech pilsners. Extraction from their base malts is not the best, either, in my experience. Their caramel malts and wheat malts, on the other hand suit my needs better than many UK equivalents. If you do want Castle (Château) stuff you can get it from Autobrasseur, but they're among my last ports of call.
Dingemans and Castle both offer Maris Otter. I wonder where it's grown, in England or in Belgium/France.
I haven't used their pale for ages. I remember it was a bit darker than UK pales
I get that sour/twangy taste every time I use Crisps Chevallier. I've quite gone off it and I shan't buy it again. Still got quite a bit left though so I'll try it in a stout.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Dingemans and Castle both offer Maris Otter. I wonder where it's grown, in England or in Belgium/France.

It'll be grown in the UK - everything to do with Otter is under the control of Robin Appel and Banhams, farmers can only grow it under contract to them. That Appel connection is one reason why the Warminster Otter is so good, they get the pick of the crop. Something similar happens with Golden Promise - Simpsons are the Plant Variety Rights holder so all GP goes through them.

I never said that Otter was the best option for all beers, but I don't think it's too controversial to say it's considered a premium variety, by price if nothing else. Personally I'm less of a fan of the East Anglian maltsters but the others - Warminster, Fawcett, Simpson - all bring their own take on it.

All of my beers are in the British style so that is why I choose British malt when it is available.

One of the best routes for British ingredients into the Eurozone is via Geterbrewed as they straddle the Irish border. Don't know how the delivery would work for France so they might not be the best for base malts (although €40/sack uncrushed Simpson Otter gives you some budget for delivery), but are probably your best bet for eg some of the hops that you may not be able to get easily in France.

 

[An Ankoù]

It'll be grown in the UK - everything to do with Otter is under the control of Robin Appel and Banhams, farmers can only grow it under contract to them. That Appel connection is one reason why the Warminster Otter is so good, they get the pick of the crop. Something similar happens with Golden Promise - Simpsons are the Plant Variety Rights holder so all GP goes through them.

That's worth knowing. So European maltsters supplying MO under their own name must be importing MO from the UK. Unless, they've got the required permits to grow it under licence. A moot point as I have no need to risk trying it.

One of the best routes for British ingredients into the Eurozone is via Geterbrewed as they straddle the Irish border. Don't know how the delivery would work for France so they might not be the best for base malts (although €40/sack uncrushed Simpson Otter gives you some budget for delivery), but are probably your best bet for eg some of the hops that you may not be able to get easily in France.

You would think so, but it's not the case. GEB used to be my preferred supplier. At the time of Brexit, they never managed to get their heads around delivery to Europe. I had several conversations with them and he always seemed to believe I was trying to accuse him of cashing in on delivery, which I wasn't.
Bottom line is a bag of Muntons MO costs €37.05 while the same bag from HBC costs €40,50 BUT GEB uses DHL economy at €41.35= a total of €78,40 for a bag delivered to France. HBC uses DPD.ie at €18 making it €59 for a bag of Muntons MO delivered to France. I haven't been back to GEB for years. A shame as I used to enjoy doing business with them.
My experience of DHL is that they are a very poor delivery company- certainly in France. DPD are much better.

 

[jambop]

That's worth knowing. So European maltsters supplying MO under their own name must be importing MO from the UK. Unless, they've got the required permits to grow it under licence. A moot point as I have no need to risk trying it.

You would think so, but it's not the case. GEB used to be my preferred supplier. At the time of Brexit, they never managed to get their heads around delivery to Europe. I had several conversations with them and he always seemed to believe I was trying to accuse him of cashing in on delivery, which I wasn't.
Bottom line is a bag of Muntons MO costs €37.05 while the same bag from HBC costs €40,50 BUT GEB uses DHL economy at €41.35= a total of €78,40 for a bag delivered to France. HBC uses DPD.ie at €18 making it €59 for a bag of Muntons MO delivered to France. I haven't been back to GEB for years. A shame as I used to enjoy doing business with them.
My experience of DHL is that they are a very poor delivery company- certainly in France. DPD are much better.

Yes I had a look at GEB and the cost fo delivery is not economic . Maybe for hops at a push though.