Should I go straight in at the deep end?

[Notlaw]

I love this forum, what a helpful bunch of buggers you all are!

You're right of course, I am eager to do AG. It feels like "real brewing" so it's largely psychological I suppose.

I am also worried about a few failures off the belt might scare me off (I hope not, but you never know), so maybe at least 1 or 2 kits IS the way to start. However, I do want to progress onto AG quickly if I can.

I'm a right fanny, so sterilising and cleaning are things I'm quite methodical about anyway, but everyone says you're never prepared for just how much cleaning and sterilising is actually involved.

Looking forward to being able to experiment, but I'm not the sort to just try random things and wonder what happens. If I experiment with something, I usually have it all worked out in my head what the result will be anyway.

I've already started a folder with recipes I've found and printed off that I fancy trying at some point and articles about hops and malt flavours and all that stuff.... I told you I was a right fanny.!!

Anyway, thanks gents. I appreciate the advice, I really do.

 

[Spapro]

As a lot of others have said, worth buying a starter pack including a kit to get you the basic equipment. Do a kit or 2 or 3, then move to all grain once you have mastered the basics.

This Greg Hughes book is worth picking up sooner rather than later, lots of easily digestable info on the brewing processes and also lots of great all grain recipes for when you are ready to move to all grain. A lot on here still use it as the basis for tweaked all grain recipes:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1409331768/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

Good luck with whatever you decide and enjoy the journey - its a bit addictive though this home brewing lark.

 

[geetee]

I used to do kits 25 years ago when they were not so good and gave up after 1-2 years. About 9 years ago I became interested in making beer, went to local HBS in Whitley Bay and the guy there gave me loads of information. I bought a boiler, FV, cool box and fittings and 1 week later was making beer.

My opinion would be just jump in at the deep end, it's a learning curve as things are bound to go wrong but these put you on the right track. My first brew I forgot to fit the filter into the kettle and got lumpy, cloudy wort but hey I filtered it with a sieve. I have never yet made a beer that was not drinkable.

One thing I would suggest if you do go AG is write out a check sheet to follow for the first few brews and follow it ( idiots guide if you want) because it's amazing how easy it is to miss something important (see filter above!)

Whichever way you go good luck and keep asking.

 

[oakchips]

I did kits 30 Years ago and yes they were rubbish, went for all grain very quickly although home brew shops were few and far between and no internet!!! - I now have a microbrewery and a pub - go for all grain it's a lot more fun !

 

[Wardy]

I did kits 30 Years ago and yes they were rubbish, went for all grain very quickly although home brew shops were few and far between and no internet!!! - I now have a microbrewery and a pub - go for all grain it's a lot more fun !

I agree AG is far superior and more fun but I am glad I started with kits. It's a huge learning curve and kits got me off to a good start especially after pimping them after 1 kit done as per instructions.

 

[hornaldo]

I started out with a couple of kits (coopers) then pimped on up with hops, moved on to 2 can kits, the went to extract and have just done my first allgrain.

its light an apprenticeship to build confidence, and as you get more confident you can build your equipment,

Im pleased I started like this as you can really tell the difference in taste.
good luck and there are plenty of people on hear for advice which ever way you decide to go.

 

[Birkin]

I did a wilko kit to begin with, all I really learnt from it was bottle priming by putting half a teaspoon of sugar in each bottle is a stupid idea and leads to very inconsistent carbonation.

Anyway, I jumped straight into all grain after that, my equipment was initially a bit Heath Robinson (in a way it still is..).

The wilko beer was OK.

I'm now about to start my 5th all grain (bulmers is hard to drink but I refuse to pay for bottles when I can get then for the same price with cider in).

And the 3 that are ready to drink have all been amazing. I like lager, and I've had the same 6 cans of Kronenbourg in the fridge since before Christmas, every time I find myself reaching for the home brew, because it's so good!

There's nothing wrong with starting with all grain, just get your head around how it works before you start, there's plenty of waiting for thing to boil etc for reading if you're not sure, and write the first one off. You learn so much more by doing and generally speaking you'll probably think it went terrible and still end up with great beer.

 

[Motorhomebrew]

Well from what I can see Is a fairly even mix here. So Notlaw, what you actually gonna do?

 

[baggybill]

Well, as the saying goes, "go slow - learn quick, go quick - learn slow!" iirc :grin:

I started with a single can kit and moved on pretty quickly. I wanted to make sure I tried all the variations e.g. extract, partial mashes etc. so I knew what people were talking about and I would know what the beer tasted like and the work involved.

Have to say I didn't stick to any order and was doing small scale AG (stock pot) before I ever tried extract or partial mashes but I'm glad I've tried them all.

Even though I've got a garage full of grain I still got a bunch of 1 can kits for Xmas presents from the wife/kids etc. so it's not like those days are over for me, I just mix it up a bit.

Take yer time, enjoy, learn.... :thumb:

 

[Notlaw]

Well from what I can see Is a fairly even mix here. So Notlaw, what you actually gonna do?

I reckon it would be wise to at least try a kit or two first. Maybe the same kit twice, but pimp the second one. I can then maybe try an extract or two and hopefully be AG by the summer months at the latest.

I'm itching to get started on something. Our lass mentioned replacing the fridge yesterday...I immediately thought about repurposing the old one for lagering. Haha

 

[Motorhomebrew]

I reckon it would be wise to at least try a kit or two first. Maybe the same kit twice, but pimp the second one. I can then maybe try an extract or two and hopefully be AG by the summer months at the latest.

I'm itching to get started on something. Our lass mentioned replacing the fridge yesterday...I immediately thought about repurposing the old one for lagering. Haha

BOOM do it. If not I need a new brewing fridge. Id happily take it off your hands

 

[Notlaw]

BOOM do it. If not I need a new brewing fridge. Id happily take it off your hands

Might see how healthy the bank account is and swing by Leyland or Spitting Feathers in Wigan tomorrow.

 

[Birkin]

Yeah.. I have a brewing fridge, I bought a temp controller off eBay for it. All in all including the box the temo controller cost about £15!

It works great!

It's filled with lager which is conditioning, I sampled it at bottling, think it's going to be a good one!

Do it...

 

[Batlugs]

Hi Notlaw,

Just read the whole thread and my best advice has only been mentioned right at the end.

I started in the 80's with kits and they mainly produced sludge. Im the 00's I moved to extract with some success and some failures. I am now on AG with a Grainfather, shiny piece of kit I know but cheaper, less convenient but equally effective set ups can be made or bought. All with top notch results that will match or beat your local brewpub.

You will brew acceptable beers with kits, fantastic ones with extract and exceptional ones with grain.

I found two things that will make the difference between success and failure, as has been previously said, one is cleanliness. Infected beer is always bad.

The one single piece of kit I would now never be without, should I choose to go kit, extract or AG is the brew fridge. Mine is an old larder fridge that takes the fermentation bin rigged with an STC1000 and a 60w tube heater. This can be got for as little as £25 depending on what the fridge costs. That, in my opinion, should be a must whatever style of brewing you go for.

Good luck which ever way you choose to go.

 

[mereside]

I started with a few kits and quickly went to BIAB from clibits ag thread I have only done three so far so only learning the process but I sat drinking my first AG stout last night which was so good I will not look back, I have found the process very interesting and as others said keep everything sanitised and ask plenty of questions you will be right, I would say try BIAB as per clibits post you need little gear to get you going but only you know how hands on you want to get, good luck and keep us all posted :thumb:, atb wayne

 

[Spapro]

I reckon it would be wise to at least try a kit or two first. Maybe the same kit twice, but pimp the second one. I can then maybe try an extract or two and hopefully be AG by the summer months at the latest.

I'm itching to get started on something. Our lass mentioned replacing the fridge yesterday...I immediately thought about repurposing the old one for lagering. Haha

Doing a kit or 2 is a great idea. Extract brewing is usually more expensive than using grain, beer isn;t quite so good and the process is almost as lengthy as all grain (certainly BIAB) so would suggest doing a few kits to build up equipment and experience then jump to all grain - missing out extract brewing.

 

[Wardy]

Doing a kit or 2 is a great idea. Extract brewing is usually more expensive than using grain, beer isn;t quite so good and the process is almost as lengthy as all grain (certainly BIAB) so would suggest doing a few kits to build up equipment and experience then jump to all grain - missing out extract brewing.

I totally agree. That's exactly what I did. I bought the Coopers starter kit from Tesco Direct when they had a sale and clubcard boost so it only cost about £26 in clubcard vouchers. After brewing the first kit and reading many threads here I decided AG was a huge step and playing about with a kit adding DME and other stuff gave me some experience and confidence to do AG. In my opinion experience (learning to clean and sanitise everything) with kits is a good foundation. I see AG brewers saying it's not vital to sanitise pre boil but I have the mindset to do it anyway. Now I'm onto AG I still clean already clean equipment and sanatise it and even go overboard with the FV and paddle leaving a starsan solution in there and then a final swill round and wipe down of the outside before the wort goes in.
If I ever get a failed brew I doubt it will be due to dirty equipment.
If AG brewing is a mountain I am sat in the valley with climbing gear ready.

 

[Birkin]

I totally agree. That's exactly what I did. I bought the Coopers starter kit from Tesco Direct when they had a sale and clubcard boost so it only cost about £26 in clubcard vouchers. After brewing the first kit and reading many threads here I decided AG was a huge step and playing about with a kit adding DME and other stuff gave me some experience and confidence to do AG. In my opinion experience (learning to clean and sanitise everything) with kits is a good foundation. I see AG brewers saying it's not vital to sanitise pre boil but I have the mindset to do it anyway. Now I'm onto AG I still clean already clean equipment and sanatise it and even go overboard with the FV and paddle leaving a starsan solution in there and then a final swill round and wipe down of the outside before the wort goes in.
If I ever get a failed brew I doubt it will be due to dirty equipment.
If AG brewing is a mountain I am sat in the valley with climbing gear ready.

AG brewing, too many people over think it. Sanitation is essential, but if you start with clean gear at worst you'll be stuck for 20 minutes to allow sanitation with starsan solution. (Everything post boil needs to be sanitised if its going to come into contact with the beer. Pre boil sanitation is a waste of time, as the boil sanitises the beer anyway)

All you're doing is steeping the grain at a temp for an hour, drawing off the wort, rinsing the grain then boiling it with some greenery.

It's really not a complicated process!

Also, the whole process is so much more forgiving than people think.

Just write the first batch off before you start, you'll probably finish it with a million ideas for things you'll do different next time, and be amazed when your beer actually tastes great at the end of it.

 

[Greenhorn]

Notlaw,

I'm in your position.

Dr Greenhorn bought me a Young's kit for Christmas. It was great fun getting it going and I'm so looking forward to bottling tomorrow.

But much more fun and rewarding has been finding out as much as I can about AG.

So next weekend I'll be setting out on a slightly modified version of Clibit's AG recipe.


As such, I'm not really in a position to offer much advice. Apart from this:

I frequently find myself reading about water chemistry or enzymes or some bafflingly complex brewing setup. And I think "bloody hell, this is way out of my comfort zone" and it's easy to get intimidated. At that point I go back and read Clibit's simple AG thread and it reminds me that it doesn't have to be so involved after all.

Everyone starts somewhere and no one is born an expert.

He he. Let's do it!

 

[Sandimas]

Extract brewing is usually more expensive than using grain, beer isn;t quite so good and the process is almost as lengthy as all grain (certainly BIAB) so would suggest doing a few kits to build up equipment and experience then jump to all grain - missing out extract brewing.

We all have different experiences, I disagree with all of that. BIAB takes me 5-6 hours, I can do an Extract in 1-2hrs. You don't have the mash stage with Extract, plus you don't have to spend anywhere near as long cooling because you're boiling a much smaller volume and adding cold water to it.

All my Extract beers have been superb, much better than your average pub ale, yet many of my AGs so far have been disappointing. Don't get me wrong, I'm a believe in ultimately getting to AG, but some people get there quicker than others, and Extract is really good middle ground in my book: yes it's comparatively expensive (but still way cheaper than going to the pub), and you can produce AG-quality beers, it's just that AG gives you infinite variations whereas the range of beers you can make with Extract is limited.