Setting up my gas supply to Cornelius kegs

[PaulCa]

I've found 20psi to force carb then leave the corny a week in the fridge. connect to tap and serve at 3psi works well.
Occaisionally a brew might need 30psi initially

My hose is only 4 inches long, think it's about 6mm ID. I gather extending the hose to a few feet might make a difference... what do you think?

 

[PD]

as yet I've not altered my pipe lengths since I set it up on guesswork
I use 3/8 pipe and the lengths are around 1 meter.

I have a new gas managment board to fit in soon so I might take the oportunity of altering the pipework to a smaller diameter to see what difference it makes.

 

[PaulCa]

I found this, http://www.brewersfriend.com/2009/07/18 ... -pressure/

Which suggests I would need 3 feet of 3/16" line to serve at 10PSI. I have about 4 or 5 inches.

I'll try ordering a longer line.

 

[Fil]

I found this, http://www.brewersfriend.com/2009/07/18 ... -pressure/

Which suggests I would need 3 feet of 3/16" line to serve at 10PSI. I have about 4 or 5 inches.

I'll try ordering a longer line.

to serve at 10psi i would suggest a length of 5-6ft of 3/16" line as it will restrict the pressure at about 1-2psi per foot length.. so to balance the keg pressure to minimise the pressure gradient at release (probably whats stimulating foam) 5-6ft should do it..

any shorter drop the pressure. the aim is for a pressure gradien (di9fference) of circa 1psi at release anything above can stimulate foam, if u use 3/8" line then it as it wont restrict much until you have about 10m or so of it so u will need to drop the keg pressure to 1-3psi to serve and risk loosing condition while online.

 

[PaulCa]

I got some 3/16" line and put 6 feet between the keg and the tap. I still get a lot of foam at <5psi. Maybe my regulator is lying to me about pressure. But I tested it with another pressure gauge it seemed close enough.

Has anyone had trouble with the regulator valve leaking when you remove it from the fridge? I was cleaning my keg last night and the reg was hissing at 20psi and wouldn't go higher. Yet I put it back in the fridge, was able to get the the keg to 30PSI and disconnected the in-disconnect and turned off the bottle. Tonight it still read 30psi, so can't be leaking still. Odd. Maybe the different materials warm up at different rates causing a leak? <shrug>

It does feel (by wieght) as though it used an awful lot of CO2 on my last brew.

 

[ECLIPSE]

I started with about 5tf of 3/16 beer line to my taps but I found that the flow was extremely slow. After shortening to about 1ft it was better but not perfect.

Now I use 3/8 beer line.... About 2ft and it pours a perfect pint every time. What temp are your kegs at whilst serving? And what taps are you using?

 

[PD]

I use 3/8 beer line with dalex taps....works for me. beer lines are about 3 foot in length corny to tap.
Mine are stood on concrete floor behind the baa...r in the garage, beer has been warm during the summer but never undrinkable...and now with the cooler weather its getting around perfect temp.

 

[PaulCa]

I'm using a cheap party tap that came as a unit with disconnect and 6 inches of 3/16" line. I replaced the line with 6 foot of line. I'm assuming we are talking about 3/16" inner diameter line here.

Keg is around about 5*C.

The keg was nearly empty when I fitted the new line. I put a new brew in on Weds and might be able to pull a sample glass some point over the weekend.

The regulator does slightly concern me as it's gauge is measured out in litres per hour and cubic feet per minute. However when I connected a pressure gauge to the gas line, it read 1 bar at 15 cfm and 2 bar at 30 cfm, so I figured it was close enough. However my pouring symptoms might suggest a building of pressure over time, even though the reg gauge doesn't move up. For example if I dump the pressure completely and set the reg to 3psi, the pour is very, very slow. Leave it for 30 minutes and pull another and I can barely crack the tap open or I get foam.

I have a 2 stage regulator hopefully arriving for my aquarium, but it's looking like I could use this on the beer keg instead, swap the regs over basically, assume my leaking valve problem was a one-off. Aquarium is less pressure critical, as long as it's between 1 and 3 bar it will be fine.

 

[pittsy]

I've been having issues too , i had 7 ft of 3/8 beer line and i was still getting too much foam . Today i have just fitted 3/16 line and it's now good .

 

[Fil]

I'm using a cheap party tap that came as a unit with disconnect and 6 inches of 3/16" line. I replaced the line with 6 foot of line. I'm assuming we are talking about 3/16" inner diameter line here.

Keg is around about 5*C.

The keg was nearly empty when I fitted the new line. I put a new brew in on Weds and might be able to pull a sample glass some point over the weekend.

The regulator does slightly concern me as it's gauge is measured out in litres per hour and cubic feet per minute. However when I connected a pressure gauge to the gas line, it read 1 bar at 15 cfm and 2 bar at 30 cfm, so I figured it was close enough. However my pouring symptoms might suggest a building of pressure over time, even though the reg gauge doesn't move up. For example if I dump the pressure completely and set the reg to 3psi, the pour is very, very slow. Leave it for 30 minutes and pull another and I can barely crack the tap open or I get foam.

I have a 2 stage regulator hopefully arriving for my aquarium, but it's looking like I could use this on the beer keg instead, swap the regs over basically, assume my leaking valve problem was a one-off. Aquarium is less pressure critical, as long as it's between 1 and 3 bar it will be fine.

hi Paul, if you drop the pressure in the keg to serve below the level suited to maintain the beers condition it will start to release that condition until it hits a new equilibrium and the pressure in the keg will build up regardless of what u set on your reg.

if you vent the keg before you pour any excess pressure will be gone and the reg will reset to your desired serving pressure. the flip side is of course over time the beer will get flatter, but you can just recondition if that hapend before you have emptied thye keg.

the idea with the thin line is to balance the keg pressure with the resistance it offers, so when u let it out of the tap the difference between atmospheric pressure and the beer at the tap point isnt too big so wont contribute to a foam out. the thin line will restrict at about 1-2psi per foot length iirc, so if 10psi keeps your beer conditioned at the temp your storing it at slap 5-6ft of thin line before the tap and it should sort you out

 

[PaulCa]

I think I get it now and feel a little stupid for not getting it before.

If I gas the keg to 30psi for a few days and then dump the pressure, at first it will pour slowly. Left for a while, 30mins even, the beer will be degassing CO2 as the pressure has dropped. CO2 in solution doesn't not produce much pressure, but CO2 in the headspace does. Thus It will take possibly a day for the beer and headspace to return to equilibrium and that will be a pressure much higher than the 1-2PSI I pulled that first pint with. Hence foam.

So, in theory I should gas it to 30psi and leave it for a week, then while the keg is still full, dump the pressure down to serving pressure and leave it for a day or two, dumping pressure where needed until it settles at a more constant pressure. I then accept the carbonation level I get from that pressure and things should be fine if left alone.

The fact I'm inpatient and only have 1 keg makes this difficult.

I mean I gave in and decided to get a little drunk on my keg last night, it's only been on at 30 psi for 2 days. I dumped the pressure and left the reg off, in disc off. By the second pint it was hard to pour and by the third I was getting half a glass of foam. The beer was not very carbonated and this was to be expected, so I put the keg back to 30psi. Tonight I will probably repeat this and it will continue wasting CO2 until the keg is empty.

Time to see if I can find a bargain for another keg and get a conditioning/carbing pipeline going.

 

[ECLIPSE]

OK. So I've made a few change to my gas system into the kegerator last night. Instead of the main gas feed coming in through the drain hole of the fridge, being bent quite a lot to get it in. I've cut the line where it enters the fridge and fitted a JG 90 degree fitting. Which has taken the strain off the pipe.

My question is, it is fairly wedged in the gap below the drain hole and when you pull up on the gas line from inside the fridge the pipe comes out from the JG fitting because its pulling the release collar of the fitting up against the drain hole. Its not got 20psi in the lines and its not leaking so does this seem OK to leave as it is? Or is there a risk of the pipe coming out of the JG fitting whilst under pressure?

 

[Fil]

yes it is at risk.. BUT u can get collars to slip round and hold the bit off the body and stop it getting pulled off barneey did have loads?

 

[ECLIPSE]

Cheers fil. Thought it wasn't worth the risk. I've decided to take it out and just go with the slightly bent pipe like I had before. Will sort it tonight once I get home from work

 

[PaulCa]

So I'm having a problem with this one particular keg of beer. It will not settle down at all.

I gassed it to 30psi via the out disconnect, rolled it around the floor until the bubbles stopped flowing and put it in the fridge. 3 days later I dropped the pressure to 10psi and the next night I dropped it to 3psi to sample the beer.

I normally get quite a lot of foam this way for a day or two, then it settles down and I alternate between 2-3psi for serving and then leave it at 10psi when I'm not using it and this has been working for the past 3-4 keg fulls.

This keg just won't settle. If I pour at 2-3psi I get foam in the glass, if I leave it to settle the beer line fills with CO2 and it takes half a pint of foam to clear. It I lower the pressure I just get foam in the lines, if I raise the pressure I get foam in the glass. It's like it's degassing in the line itself before it even reaches the glass.

I originally put it down to being over carbed and so left the keg with the pressure released overnight a few times to decarbonate it. This didn't work, the keg pressure stopped rising suggesting the beer had degassed and there wasn't enough pressure to pour a pint, but adding CO2 in until it would pour and sure enough bubbles forming in the line and a half pint of foam.

It's a crappy kit brew and I've written it off as a "just drink it" beer, but if there anything that can be done?

 

[Fil]

Hi Paul, how full was the keg? if less than usual the extra volume headspace full of 30psi co2 may have contribulted to over conditioning the beer?

also the cooler ambient temperature (if applicable?) when you did your rolling may also have contributed.

Im doing pretty much the same with my kegs (without the rolling and feeding co2 thru the out feed. conditioning under 20-30psi for a few days and then leaving a while. but with the ambient temp being low out in my keg store I may soon be experiencing the same.

just keep removing the condition by venting daily or twice daily till you get there, if you end up loosing too much, try adding more but being less agressive, try a lower pressure and less agitation.

as i now crash cool or chill my beer prior to kegging i dont even shake a keg when conditioning its just not needed.

its also a great help when filling as condensation on the keg lets u know how full it is..

 

[Mther]

So if I am using the party tap will I end up with foam? I was thinking of cooling down the beer,kegging it, force carb at 20 psi for 24 hours, then 10 psi for 4 to 5 days and then serve? Do you think this will work ok?

 

[PaulCa]

Fil your post made me realise what might have done it. When I put it into the fridge after the rolling I left the gas on, it was only when I came to drop it to 10psi that I realised as it began flowing more gas in and the reg stayed at 30psi. So might just be over carbonated.

Normally after rolling and popping in the fridge I disconnect the gas, pressure usually falls quite a lot.

Keg is nearing it's end, so next one I will just put it to 30psi and disconnect it. I may still roll it as I currently only have one keg and waiting on it means no beer, need express carb'ing. (Out of interest I have another coming over xmas, so I can give my beer a few weeks to condition).

 

[PaulCa]

So if I am using the party tap will I end up with foam? I was thinking of cooling down the beer,kegging it, force carb at 20 psi for 24 hours, then 10 psi for 4 to 5 days and then serve? Do you think this will work ok?

It's less the tap and more the carbonation state of the beer. I think any tap will foam if the beer is over carbed or served at too high a pressure. It will depend on your lines, pressures, carbing level etc. The tap may play a small part.

I have found that it's certainly not a matter of set the reg to 10PSI and have perfect pints on tap. This may be the case if you store the beer for a while at 10psi and serve though a long micro line at 10psi, but for me I like fizzy beer but my 3/16" line and party tap don't seem to be able to serve without foaming above about 2 psi. So I have to vary the keg pressure from storage to serving and thus it never really stabilises and every pint pours slightly differently.