Recommendations for the next step up from a BrewZilla v3.1.1

[Chippy_Tea]

Isn't the Braumeister the only system that allows every component to be replaced hence the price.

 

[Rodcx500z]

Yes @sifty the Braumeister has a metal coil there at the bottom for heating the mash and boiling the wort. How does it do it in the brewzilla?

They are underneath and do not touch the wort

 

[Session]

Have you looked at the Darkfarm brew vessels ?

Thanks for the recommendation - I have spent some time today having a look at this option. It looks amazing! I’m not quite sure how to use it however, as I have only used three-vessel systems and AIOs. I presume it’s fairly similar to something like the BrewZilla but with more replaceable/sturdy parts?

Does anyone on here have one?

 

[Crappyfish]

Hi everyone,

I am looking for a solution to address a couple of ‘ease of use’ issues with my BrewZilla 35L, and wondered if you lovely people could help me? My budget is £2k, but if I can get away with spending as little as possible on shiny things and put more of that into ingredients to brew with I would be very happy. I ferment in cornys, so typically only do a maximum of 18-20L batches. I would prefer an AIO as they take up less space than a three-vessel. I would only want to consider electric, not gas.

I feel my current system, a v3.1.1 BrewZilla, is great value for money, however having used it for a couple of years there are three areas which I would like to address in my next all-in-one unit. I’m not looking to make better beer here, I feel the BrewZilla v3.1.1 makes an excellent brew, but I’d like to refine a few areas:

1. I hate tipping it up to clean it! I would really like to have a centrally-draining conical/dished bottom to enable easy cleaning at the end of a brew day, and particularly so I don’t need to lift anything.
2. The controller is pretty basic. Due to this I really only use it in fully manual mode, and am starting to dislike having to lie down on the floor to change the temperature! Something with more bells and whistles would be nice, however I appreciate as with all electrical purchases a better version will inevitably be released about a month after I buy it.
3. The malt pipe lets quite a lot of grain through unless I use aftermarket GrainFather silicone seals, which are a pain to fit (and keep fitted!). So I’d like something that used a different design.

Now, I know the sensible option would be to just get the new v4 BrewZilla, as it addresses literally every one of my complaints above… I just feel I’d like something a little more ‘premium’, you know?

For a while I was very interested in the Braumeister 20L, however from my reading it seems to lack a dished bottom plate, so I have mentally struck that one off my list. Have I been too hasty? How do you lucky buggers who own one of these beauties clean it?

Having previously owned a GrainFather G30 prior to upgrading to the BrewZilla, I felt the BrewZilla was comparable in build quality and better made/thought out in others (cam locks as standard, false bottom, bottom tap) whilst also being a much cheaper price. The controller is more basic, however after the absolute farce that was the GrainFather software in 2018 I was very happy with basic! I also felt I was paying more for the advertising budget and the GF brand than anything else, so I wouldn’t be very keen to go down the GF route again unless there is compelling reason to do so. I also now would like to have a more premium controller, but am a little reluctant to use GrainFather after the last debacle.

The BrewTools B40Pro looks lovely but… it strikes me as an unfinished, continually-evolving design. I would worry that there are issues that still need to be ironed out that are yet to be identified. My main dislike however is that they have added in an overflow pipe, which is something I was very glad to do away with on my BrewZilla. I would rather dough-in without an overflow pipe getting in the way. Not to mention all those lovely valves will need cleaning!

Is there anything obvious you guys and gals feel I have missed? Should I suck it up and just get the v4 BrewZilla after all? I would love to hear your thoughts, and am grateful to be able to benefit from the forum’s collective experience.

Not got myself have you seen Dark Farms brewing Kit. There is some good reviews about it

 

[Mash Monster]

Not got myself have you seen Dark Farms brewing Kit. There is some good reviews about it

I’ve just taken delivery of a Dark Farms 40L Brew Tank although I haven’t used it yet it looks a serious bit of kit that appears to be very well made

 

[Old Fart At Play]

Yes I meant tap, good to hear it has a hole for one. What does one do with the hole if a tap is not available?

It comes with a bolt in the hole, you don't actually need a tap to drain it you can just remove the bolt. But I prefer a tap.

 

[RoomWithABrew]

I went from robobrew 3 to a Guten 70, it has a drain hole on the outer edge which is great for whirlpool and trub trapper in the middle. Cleaning easy pump it out add more water and pump out. Recirculation with pbw as well.
I've modified it now with a SmartPID, 3 way valve on the recirculation up pipe to whirlpool and counter flow chiller.
Added a condenser to the lid.
It's working very well and even with these modifications still costs less than the big grainfather.

 

[gyurmaember]

Did you consider a bigger brewtools? They're much better value for money.

 

[starseeker]

I’ve just taken delivery of a Dark Farms 40L Brew Tank although I haven’t used it yet it looks a serious bit of kit that appears to be very well made

A review would be good ,a quite fancy one of these .

 

[Mash Monster]

A review would be good ,a quite fancy one of these .

Will post a review after I’ve got a couple of brews under my belt
Hope to start next week

 

[starseeker]

Will post a review after I’ve got a couple of brews under my belt
Hope to start next week

I shall be looking forward to it :)

 

[Session]

I’ve just taken delivery of a Dark Farms 40L Brew Tank although I haven’t used it yet it looks a serious bit of kit that appears to be very well made

Hey very exciting news! I’m sure I’m not the only one who would love to hear your thoughts once you’ve got a couple of brews down.

 

[sifty]

Yes @sifty the Braumeister has a metal coil there at the bottom for heating the mash and boiling the wort. How does it do it in the brewzilla?

Did a brew yesterday so took some pics of cleanup. First one shows where the element sits underneath, and I just clean with a microfibre cloth with hot water (saved from from the chill) and home-brew PBW mix. If there's any deposits that don't wipe off a bit of white vinegar works. Probably a 5 minute job to get sparkling clean, then a rinse with the hose, plus through the pump, and upside down to dry overnight. Done...

 

[muppix]

The BrewTools B40Pro looks lovely but… it strikes me as an unfinished, continually-evolving design. I would worry that there are issues that still need to be ironed out that are yet to be identified. My main dislike however is that they have added in an overflow pipe, which is something I was very glad to do away with on my BrewZilla. I would rather dough-in without an overflow pipe getting in the way. Not to mention all those lovely valves will need cleaning!

I've had my B40 Pro setup getting on for two years now, and I absolutely love it!

Yes, it's a lot of money. Back in my research stage I considered several other systems, but the standard Brewtools kit looked as though it was made up of components which would prove to be other manufacturers' optional but ultimately necessary upgrades, so while it was quite expensive I'm satisfied with the choices I made putting it all together; B40 Pro, 3 valve kit, counterflow chiller, clean-in-place (CIP) kit, steam hat and condenser. The whole thing sits on a plastic pallet in what used to be a spare bathroom, in which has since appeared a small workbench and a dedicated fermentation fridge. Very happy.

To the other points you raised, I've not gone for the overflow pipe because I keep a close eye on my mash and constantly adjust the balance of flow between the centre pipe and the recirculation so that overflow never becomes an issue. I do remove all the external valves after each brew and run a bottle brush through them, but I'm not sure that's strictly necessary because circulating 5 - 10 litres of Stellar Clean seems to do a great job. Then again breaking the system down into as many pieces as possible will help with drying, and that can't be a bad thing.

It's true that there is a 'constantly evolving' feel to the system, but I take that as a positive sign. Brewtools appear to listen to user feedback and bake that into new products, which are sometimes expensive but usually do improve things - like the laser-cut filter and the improved sparge manifold. That said I don't get as much use out of the Trubinator as I thought I would, swings and roundabouts I suppose...

 

[Session]

I've had my B40 Pro setup getting on for two years now, and I absolutely love it!

Yes, it's a lot of money. Back in my research stage I considered several other systems, but the standard Brewtools kit looked as though it was made up of components which would prove to be other manufacturers' optional but ultimately necessary upgrades, so while it was quite expensive I'm satisfied with the choices I made putting it all together; B40 Pro, 3 valve kit, counterflow chiller, clean-in-place (CIP) kit, steam hat and condenser. The whole thing sits on a plastic pallet in what used to be a spare bathroom, in which has since appeared a small workbench and a dedicated fermentation fridge. Very happy.

View attachment 71960​

To the other points you raised, I've not gone for the overflow pipe because I keep a close eye on my mash and constantly adjust the balance of flow between the centre pipe and the recirculation so that overflow never becomes an issue. I do remove all the external valves after each brew and run a bottle brush through them, but I'm not sure that's strictly necessary because circulating 5 - 10 litres of Stellar Clean seems to do a great job. Then again breaking the system down into as many pieces as possible will help with drying, and that can't be a bad thing.

It's true that there is a 'constantly evolving' feel to the system, but I take that as a positive sign. Brewtools appear to listen to user feedback and bake that into new products, which are sometimes expensive but usually do improve things - like the laser-cut filter and the improved sparge manifold. That said I don't get as much use out of the Trubinator as I thought I would, swings and roundabouts I suppose...

That was really helpful to read - thanks for taking the time to discuss the B40. The main thing I’m trying to improve upon from the BrewZilla is really the cleaning and would love to hear feedback from someone who owns a BT system. Do you need to do anything aside from attaching the CIP and running some ChemSan (or similar) through the system or is it more involved?

 

[muppix]

The main thing I’m trying to improve upon from the BrewZilla is really the cleaning and would love to hear feedback from someone who owns a BT system. Do you need to do anything aside from attaching the CIP and running some ChemSan (or similar) through the system or is it more involved?

The Brewtools is my first all-grain setup so I don’t really have a comparison, but I’ve not found the cleaning to be overly onerous, and some of it can be done while brewing. For example, I’ve found that it’ll take 10 - 15 minutes to get to a boil after sparging, which is enough time to take the malt pipe outside, empty the spent grain and give it a hose down to remove all husks etc which would otherwise block up my sink. During the boil itself there’s time to properly clean the malt pipe, mash paddle, dough-in beaker, etc using a pressure sprayer with ChemSan and a bowl of hot water, with more time during the hop stand / chill stages to dry and store the previously washed bits.

Once the kettle is empty I remove the centre pipe, switch the transfer line to the lowest tap in the system and set the main valve to ‘drain all’ while using a hose to rinse down the inside of the kettle, collecting the output in an old fermentation bucket. The condenser kit comes with a handy hose adapter (or did I buy that separately?) which lets me push hot, clean water through the chiller coil and pump, again draining to the plastic bucket which is then set aside.

Having removed the solid rubbish from the system I reconnect the transfer hose to the top tap, fit the CIP kit to the centre pipe, and fill the kettle with roughly 7 litres of hot water and a couple of scoops of Stellar Clean - just enough to ensure the dip tube doesn’t suck air once everything’s worked its way around the chiller. By now the steam hat has been placed to one side and I refit the standard kettle lid before switching the pumps on max for 20 minutes with the flow divided between the CIP ball on the centre pipe and the recirculation through the chiller. While the chemicals are doing their thing I wipe down the inside of the steam hat and empty the bucket of green gunk in the garden.

Stellar Clean does a great job of loosening any remaining dirt, so I typically finish by wiping down the heating coils using a plastic scouring sponge with the chemicals still in there before draining the system and rinsing / flushing everything out, again using the hose adapter. If you do this right then you don’t have to take off the valves or pull out the dip tubes, but I find that doing so helps the system to dry better and also lets you inspect and clean any seals as necessary, which is an additional 10 minutes well spent in my experience.

Seeing these steps written down makes it all sound like a bit of a faff, but in practice it’s not that bad. My brew days usually start around 06:00 and I’m normally pitching yeast by 12:00. It then takes another hour to run through the above steps, finishing with everything spotlessly clean and spread out on two tea towels in front of me. Looking at all those shiny things awaiting their next mission gives me a feeling comparable to seeing the first signs of fermentation in my FV, and already I’m looking forward to my next brew day.

 

[Session]

The Brewtools is my first all-grain setup so I don’t really have a comparison, but I’ve not found the cleaning to be overly onerous... It then takes another hour to run through the steps, finishing with everything spotlessly clean and spread out on two tea towels in front of me. Looking at all those shiny things awaiting their next mission gives me a feeling comparable to seeing the first signs of fermentation in my FV, and already I’m looking forward to my next brew day.

Thanks @muppix, that’s so helpful!

 

[Paul Bennett]

You need the Brewzilla 60l gen 4. I love mine. I upgraded from 35l gen 3.
No regrets whatsoever. You do need to get an electrician in to fit you a commando socket. Addresses all of your issues

 

[hoppyscotty]

Well if I were you I'd invest my money in the fermentation side rather than the mash side - upgrade the fermenter...or glycol chiller if you already have a decent fermenter...I've just 'invested' and got a pretty serious plate chiller and its the mutts nuts - in fact its too good as I have to warm up the wort in the fermenter before pitching the yeast...I need to upgrade my pump to a higher flow one!!

The BZ 3.1 has a few flaws (never thought cleaning was one to be honest)...my biggest gripe is a very unsophisticated temp control system can lead to some irratic temp behaviour, and the crap false bottom that doesn't work properly - a centre drain is a hinderance and disadvantage if you don't have a decent and effective false bottom and from what I can gather the BZ v4 still has a sub-optimal false bottom, so all you're going to do is transfer all that crap that is captured in the bottom of the v3.1, so not sure BZ are quite finished finalising the v4 design. And I'm dammed if I'm going to use a bag. If you're going to brew in a bag then you don't need to spend hundreds of pounds, or even thousands, on a fancy stainless brew system.

Other than that I'm struggling to see what other alternatives offer that are any different/better so personally I'd only replace for a larger system...and I've done just that....I have built a larger system and went 3 vessel system with a RIMS tube and to be honest I'd never go back to an all in one again unless I was really struggling for space. I still use my BZ for smaller batches, but 3 vessel systems are relatively cheap as chips on eBay, thanks to the rush for AIO systems people are ditching their 'old fashioned' 3 vessel systems for the new spangly kit, and for the price of a Grainfather you can set yourself up with a proper 3 vessel system that would have cost two or three times more than the GF when new.

But if I were to get another AIO I'd certainly give the Dark Farms Brew Tank a very very good look. I love the idea of that thing, just looks so configurable with so many options. Brewtools is lovely (I have a Brewtools fermenter and its awesome), but boy, you don't half pay for it and they're not without their issues and glitches if you follow the Brewtools Users group on FB, but I'm sure they'll sort that and their support seems to be pretty good.

 

[Mash Monster]

Well if I were you I'd invest my money in the fermentation side rather than the mash side - upgrade the fermenter...or glycol chiller if you already have a decent fermenter...I've just 'invested' and got a pretty serious plate chiller and its the mutts nuts - in fact its too good as I have to warm up the wort in the fermenter before pitching the yeast...I need to upgrade my pump to a higher flow one!!

The BZ 3.1 has a few flaws (never thought cleaning was one to be honest)...my biggest gripe is a very unsophisticated temp control system can lead to some irratic temp behaviour, and the crap false bottom that doesn't work properly - a centre drain is a hinderance and disadvantage if you don't have a decent and effective false bottom and from what I can gather the BZ v4 still has a sub-optimal false bottom, so all you're going to do is transfer all that crap that is captured in the bottom of the v3.1, so not sure BZ are quite finished finalising the v4 design. And I'm dammed if I'm going to use a bag. If you're going to brew in a bag then you don't need to spend hundreds of pounds, or even thousands, on a fancy stainless brew system.

Other than that I'm struggling to see what other alternatives offer that are any different/better so personally I'd only replace for a larger system...and I've done just that....I have built a larger system and went 3 vessel system with a RIMS tube and to be honest I'd never go back to an all in one again unless I was really struggling for space. I still use my BZ for smaller batches, but 3 vessel systems are relatively cheap as chips on eBay, thanks to the rush for AIO systems people are ditching their 'old fashioned' 3 vessel systems for the new spangly kit, and for the price of a Grainfather you can set yourself up with a proper 3 vessel system that would have cost two or three times more than the GF when new.

But if I were to get another AIO I'd certainly give the Dark Farms Brew Tank a very very good look. I love the idea of that thing, just looks so configurable with so many options. Brewtools is lovely (I have a Brewtools fermenter and its awesome), but boy, you don't half pay for it and they're not without their issues and glitches if you follow the Brewtools Users group on FB, but I'm sure they'll sort that and their support seems to be pretty good.

I went with the brew tank and really pleased with it