Pellet hops and vegetable bags

[Rogermort]

I use leaf hops almost exclusively and when adding them to the boil kettle I use a vegetable bag. As a result I get virtually no hop debris in the bottom of the kettle or through to the fermenter. Does anyone use this system for pellet hops and does it work in a similar way or can I expect to see lots more hop 'gunge' coming through my chiller?

 

[The Baron]

Yes I think plenty of brewers use the veg bags for adding hops to the boil and for dry hopping.
It will stop most of the hop residue but not all.
You will get the argument not to use them and just throw the hops in as it should drop out but my thoughts have always been less to drop out will give clearer wort to start with.
You do whichever suits your method both will produce good beer

 

[Bang Road Brewery]

I thought of that dodge, too . Aldi has the veg bags for 25p , so may give 'em a go , if not to my liking, they can go in my shopping bag arsenal . May have to start buying veg if that's the case ! Perish the thought. Anyhoo , hops is veg , ain't they ? Currently , I use 2 Mangrve Jack's uop spiders in my Braumeister.

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

I use whole hops almost exclusively too - the exception being when (very rarely) I've wanted some variety I can only get as a pellet.
One thing to be aware of is that weight-for-weight I find you get more bitterness from the pellets and that did catch me out a bit.
The other thing is that whole hops do form a bit of a filter bed at the end of the boil which can be handy for trapping some of the trub...

 

[Bang Road Brewery]

IMHO, pellet hops are the work of the Divvl hisself. What I find annoying are places that only stock these and no leaf hops. They DO form some kind of filter bed , better than the strainer I bough tthat fits the Braumeister which only got used twice . This proved itself to be the case when I still used a mash tun and Peco boiler . My LHBS only has pellets.

 

[Rogermort]

Well I don't get a filter bed any more because of using the (Aldi, Lidl or Sainsburys) vegetable bags. Clean up of the kettle is a breeze though!

 

[The Baron]

They may form a filter bed but absorb loads of your valuable beer, I just use the bags with pellets less to clean up and you can remove the hops exactly when you need to this stops over bittering which can happen when you have boil hops in and then do a hopstand/whirlpool and you have not calculated the IBU contribution from the boil hops

 

[hoppyscotty]

That is what the whirlpool is for and works a treat if you have a good false bottom. Unfortunately I've not found a false bottom that is perfectly effective. However before I had a plate chiller I didn't bother about a small amount of hop debris getting through but since having a plate chiller I want a more reliable method of filtration. After much trial and error I prefer a bag to a hop spider but recently 'invested' in one of those fine mesh baskets that slides into my kettle nicely such that the majority of the volume of the wort is within the basket and hop into that and it gets over the disadvantages of both a hop spider and a hop bag and works a treat.

Whatever is most convenient for you. Hop bags are a PITA to clean out...I do tend to stick them through the washing machine but try to get as much of the hop matter out of it which is a pain.

 

[BlackRegent]

The problem with chucking pellet hops into the boil and relying solely on the false bottom is that, more often than not, the false bottom clogs and the wort fails to drain out into the fermenter (at least, that's what seems to happen with my Brewzilla). I'm left putting my arm elbow deep into the chilled (and up to that point sanitised) wort to dislodge the false bottom.

I find the fineness of supermarket veg bags a very good compromise. They are sufficiently coarse to allow proper wort circulation around the hops, but sufficiently fine to retain most of the particulates. A lot of filters use such fine mesh you wonder how there can be proper hop utilisation.

PS - seconded on the use of leaf hops. They form a lovely filter but are far too thirsty, especially for smaller batch brewing.

 

[hoppyscotty]

Whirlpooling prevents false bottom from clogging. The problem is with Brewzilla and similar is the gap around the rim of the false bottom and as the wort is pumped out and the level drops down the side of the hop cone some hops are flushed down the side of the hop cone and down the side of the false bottom. But despite this the amount of hops is massively reduced and you avoid pump clogging.

 

[MashBag]

A lot of filters use such fine mesh you wonder how there can be proper hop utilisation.

Yes indeed.

I have the mangrove jack hop spider (800 micron mesh) keeps most of the pellet mush in. Which imo means I am utilising the hops enough (I think).

Footnote. Tried the veg bags only reason I don't use, is I had already got the MJ and it's easier to clean

 

[Clarence]

PS - seconded on the use of leaf hops. They form a lovely filter but are far too thirsty, especially for smaller batch brewing.

I do small batch brewing with whole cone hops. I use the perforated top of a 30 cm steamer as a strainer. I peg a muslin bag inside the top before running the wort through. At the end I can either do a hop sparge with a new unopened bottle of mineral water or unpeg the bag and give it a qood squeeze, It's usually the latter.

 

[Festival Man]

Using a hop spider saves replacing bags etc. But some on here say they use a bag for the aroma stage, why is this?

 

[hoppyscotty]

Both hop spiders and bags are very inefficient in my experience. The surface area of the mesh is very low compared to the surface area of the hops so utilisation will suffer. This can be reduced by giving the bag a good squeze or if you use a bag that is significantly larger than needed for the hops so more wort can get into the bag and mix with the hops. I have not had great success with spiders as they just clog up however with my current system I have started using a large basket, the type you get in the Clawhammer system. I use this as I have a plate chiller and really want to make sure I minimise or even prevent any hops getting through to the chiller. I've tried in-line filters in conjunction with the false bottom and its isn't completely effective but the hop basket seems to work fine. It's basically a very large hop spider but works due to the massive surface area and you get free flow of wort through the basket through the boil and hopstand/whirlpool. Also I transfer the wort into it so it filters out any grain that gets transferred. Pics below from my last brewday...

After transfer only hop matter is left. There is a couple of inches of space below the basket to allow for the heating element and by the time all the wort has transferred to the fermenter the hops feel very dry so any absorbed wort drops out under gravity. Previously with hop spiders with alot smaller surface area and little flowing wort the hops would clog the mesh reducing utilisation and preventing any wort captured in the hop spider....the wort you really want as its super concentrated with the hop infusion, wont drain out through the few mm of hops coating the side of the hop spider. The much larger surface area of the basket and free'er flowing wort through it prevents the hop build up on the sides. There is also a slight dome shape to the hop pile at the bottom of the basket from the whirlpool, so even the whirlpool has an effect through the basket.

And clean up is a cinch...just scrape out as much of the hops you can, then turn upside down and hose down the top and sides and it comes out clean as a whistle and really for a soak in hot sodium percarbonate.

 

[MashBag]

I agree, the problem week most spiders is they are too fine. Mangrove Jack 800 micron is a good tool.

 

[Festival Man]

Both hop spiders and bags are very inefficient in my experience. The surface area of the mesh is very low compared to the surface area of the hops so utilisation will suffer. This can be reduced by giving the bag a good squeze or if you use a bag that is significantly larger than needed for the hops so more wort can get into the bag and mix with the hops. I have not had great success with spiders as they just clog up however with my current system I have started using a large basket, the type you get in the Clawhammer system. I use this as I have a plate chiller and really want to make sure I minimise or even prevent any hops getting through to the chiller. I've tried in-line filters in conjunction with the false bottom and its isn't completely effective but the hop basket seems to work fine. It's basically a very large hop spider but works due to the massive surface area and you get free flow of wort through the basket through the boil and hopstand/whirlpool. Also I transfer the wort into it so it filters out any grain that gets transferred. Pics below from my last brewday...

View attachment 87761

After transfer only hop matter is left. There is a couple of inches of space below the basket to allow for the heating element and by the time all the wort has transferred to the fermenter the hops feel very dry so any absorbed wort drops out under gravity. Previously with hop spiders with alot smaller surface area and little flowing wort the hops would clog the mesh reducing utilisation and preventing any wort captured in the hop spider....the wort you really want as its super concentrated with the hop infusion, wont drain out through the few mm of hops coating the side of the hop spider. The much larger surface area of the basket and free'er flowing wort through it prevents the hop build up on the sides. There is also a slight dome shape to the hop pile at the bottom of the basket from the whirlpool, so even the whirlpool has an effect through the basket.

And clean up is a cinch...just scrape out as much of the hops you can, then turn upside down and hose down the top and sides and it comes out clean as a whistle and really for a soak in hot sodium percarbonate.

View attachment 87762

Great idea like a giant fine mesh sieve.! I'm on to it. Thanks.

 

[Davegase]

I use whole hops almost exclusively too - the exception being when (very rarely) I've wanted some variety I can only get as a pellet.
One thing to be aware of is that weight-for-weight I find you get more bitterness from the pellets and that did catch me out a bit.
The other thing is that whole hops do form a bit of a filter bed at the end of the boil which can be handy for trapping some of the trub...

When I started brewing nearly 40 years ago it was all whole hops and they did form a great filter bed.
Since coming back to brewing nearly four years ago it's been virtually all hop pellets.
Going forward I want to experiment with a combination. Mainly pellet hops but then adding some low alpha whole hops at the end of the boil so as not to affect the ibu's too much. Hoping they will settle out to form a filter bed to catch the trub and hop pellet debris. I expect the first runnings to have some muck which I can return to the kettle.

 

[dad_of_jon]

I use leaf hops almost exclusively and when adding them to the boil kettle I use a vegetable bag. As a result I get virtually no hop debris in the bottom of the kettle or through to the fermenter. Does anyone use this system for pellet hops and does it work in a similar way or can I expect to see lots more hop 'gunge' coming through my chiller?

Yup they work for me.

Thank you sainsbury.

 

[The Baron]

Cheap enough to throw away but if you squeeze them most of the hop debris clumps together then drop in a bin turn them inside out and rinse under a tap then dry and any residual hop matter will drop off when you scrunch the bag up.
Clean enough if you are using them on the hot side apart from that just pour boiling water over them and sanitise with starsan if using on the cold side

 

[gingerneil]

Both hop spiders and bags are very inefficient in my experience. The surface area of the mesh is very low compared to the surface area of the hops so utilisation will suffer. This can be reduced by giving the bag a good squeze or if you use a bag that is significantly larger than needed for the hops so more wort can get into the bag and mix with the hops. I have not had great success with spiders as they just clog up however with my current system I have started using a large basket, the type you get in the Clawhammer system. I use this as I have a plate chiller and really want to make sure I minimise or even prevent any hops getting through to the chiller. I've tried in-line filters in conjunction with the false bottom and its isn't completely effective but the hop basket seems to work fine. It's basically a very large hop spider but works due to the massive surface area and you get free flow of wort through the basket through the boil and hopstand/whirlpool. Also I transfer the wort into it so it filters out any grain that gets transferred. Pics below from my last brewday...

View attachment 87761

After transfer only hop matter is left. There is a couple of inches of space below the basket to allow for the heating element and by the time all the wort has transferred to the fermenter the hops feel very dry so any absorbed wort drops out under gravity. Previously with hop spiders with alot smaller surface area and little flowing wort the hops would clog the mesh reducing utilisation and preventing any wort captured in the hop spider....the wort you really want as its super concentrated with the hop infusion, wont drain out through the few mm of hops coating the side of the hop spider. The much larger surface area of the basket and free'er flowing wort through it prevents the hop build up on the sides. There is also a slight dome shape to the hop pile at the bottom of the basket from the whirlpool, so even the whirlpool has an effect through the basket.

And clean up is a cinch...just scrape out as much of the hops you can, then turn upside down and hose down the top and sides and it comes out clean as a whistle and really for a soak in hot sodium percarbonate.

View attachment 87762

This looks great... Where do you buy the basket??