Opinions welcome - spice and honey application

[Jeff Brewjubbly]

I am going to brew my Christmas Ale tonight and have read extensively on using spices and honey for aroma. Here is where I have currently settled in terms of my thoughts, but this is a first brew of this kind for me and I would welcome folks with successful seasonal ales under their belt.

I am going to pop a bag of goodies into the boil 10 mins from the end... Ginger, sweet orange peel and a cinnamon stick. When you pop the bag in has been one of those raging debates. 10 mins from the end and leave during the cool and siphon into fermenter seem to be where I want to go with it.

Honey: I am thinking I will add the honey on day 2 or 3 of fermentation to maximize it's lasting aroma... but I don't want a beer that tastes just like honey... I want it in the final product but not to over sweeten things. So folks who have managed to get a balanced honey aroma, weigh in with thoughts.

Cheers,
Jeff

 

[pittsy]

hi personally i would leave out the ginger . Just doesn't seem to work well imo , i would use lots of cinnamon as it seems to fade quickly , around 30g of orange peel will be just noticeable (more if strong orange wanted , poss 50g) and honey also needs plenty if you want to notice it (maybe 1000g needed ) good luck with it

 

[jonnymorris]

I've done two honey beers. Both times I 'sanitised' the honey at 80degC for 20mins before adding to the FV after the initial fermentation had died down. The first brew had 340g of cheap Asda honey and the second 680g of Chilean rainforest honey. In both brews any hint of honey flavour or aroma was frustratingly and entirely absent.

I've given up with honey beer.

 

[RobWalker]

you can just tip it in jonny. honey is sterile by nature so you don't need to worry!

adding after the initial fermentation abates sounds good to me - I found that 330g was only just there, 660g was too much. maybe 450g or so would be cool.

you won't find a honey aroma like in honeydew, i find it adds more of a desirable aftertaste than anything. :thumb:

 

[Jeff Brewjubbly]

Thanks guys,

Hey Rob I am doing a 2 gallon batch on this one so I guess 300g for some impact?

Cheers, Jeff

 

[RobWalker]

sounds right to me :)

 

[conorm]

Sounds good, but I'd add a couple (literally) cloves in there. Honey isn't sterile (will be full of inactive yeast and bacteria spores, the medium itself isn't favourable to micro-biotic growth so never goes off) but still shouldn't cause any problems. I added mine after the boil when the wort had cooled to about 75 degrees... enough to kill any active bugs but not destroy the honey flavour. I used 50g honey per litre for a honey brown ale. Note also that honey ferments out quite dry, so go easy.

 

[jonnymorris]

I used 50g honey per litre for a honey brown ale...

So over 1kg of honey in 23L? Is that what it takes to get a honey flavour/aroma?

 

[beermaker]

Not much experience in this respect, although I once made a dark ale and used liquorice root in it out of curiosity and it turned out quite nice :) Need to go easy on the liquorice though as it can be overpowering.

 

[conorm]

I used 50g honey per litre for a honey brown ale...

So over 1kg of honey in 23L? Is that what it takes to get a honey flavour/aroma?

Actually, I'll double check my recipe for you later and male sure. I was making a honey ale rather than a beer with a hint of honey flavour.

 

[NickW]

Would using honey for priming be the solution? :wha:

 

[Baldbrewer]

I brewed this on Friday night:


Christmas Brewski:

Batch size 18L

4kg Maris otter
450g wheat malt
450g 50L crystal
130g carared
48g roasted barley

30g hallertauer 60 mins
13g cascade 10 mins
13g cascade 5 mins

Wlp London yeast 1028

Additions:
2 cinnamon sticks 15 mins
30g dried ginger root 15 mins
1/4 grated nutmeg
500g honey 15 mins
Boil time 80 mins

Colour: 35.3 ebc
Ibu: 28.46
Abv: 6.16%
Og: 1.067
Fg: 1.020
Effi: 75% will probably be higher due to equipment. Expected abv:6.8%

it's going to be sat in the no chill cube until Saturday when I can free up the fermentation fridge as its currently busy with an IPA sat at 12C.

I'm going to pitch onto 200mls of this yeast cake and stand well back! I've no idea how it's going to taste as its my first AG brew with spices etc.

 

[graysalchemy]

Personally I would add any spices after fermentation has finished. the reason for this is that you will then have a base to judge how much spice you will need. Spices can be very overpowering and difficult to get rid of. If yopu place your spices in a small piece of muslin then you can taste it daily then remove the spices when you have the desired spiceness.

If you add unquantified amounts during the boil or anytime before the fermentation then you have no way of judging how it will taste once fermented as a beer is totally different to unfermented wort.

 

[jonnymorris]

Boiling the honey will kill off the delicate honey favours/aromas so I think you might not notice it.

 

[RobWalker]

looks really good baldbrewer! nice malt profile and I think your spice choices are wise, easy on the nutmeg and a good amount of "safer" spices. :

If you don't notice the spices, or want a fresher spice flavour, you could always boil whatever you want into the priming sugar. :thumb:

 

[Baldbrewer]

Yep, agree with all comments, this is my first Christmas Brew so it is certainly a "base" to start from. If flavours are lacking I did think about steeping some more cinnamon etc in some vodka and adding slowly to the brew to taste.
I 've read about honey flavour lacking in brews made with it and how sometimes it can add a dryness to a beer.
Ah well it's all part of the fun of our hobby , tinkering and such!

Cheers all :thumb: :