matt76's Brewdays

[matt76]

AG#115 "Two Pints of Lager and a Packet of Saaz" Czech Pils v3

Trying something like one of my standard pale grists and standard process to see how it compares to a decoction mash.

15L tap water, 5.0ml Lactic Acid 80%, 2g CaCl, half a Campden tablet, giving:
Calcium 155
Chloride 100
Sulfate 41
Alkalinity 88

1000g Maris Otter
500g Vienna Malt
250g Amber Malt
200g Munich Malt
125g Carapils
2.075kg TOTAL

130min full-volume no-sparge mash @ 67degC

Boil 30mins:
50g of Saaz 2.7% AAU for 30mins
25g of Saaz 2.7% AAU for 15mins
1/4 Britewort tablet 5mins

Whirlpool/Hopsteep 15mins @ 90->85degC:
25g of Saaz 2.7% AAU

Chilled overnight to 10°C then pitched a starter of Wyeast 2278 made a few days before.

Plan to leave it there at 10ºC for a month, low and slow is the name of the game.

6.81 SRM - Golden
34.53 IBUs Tinseth 28.92 IBUs SMPH
OG 1.041

Expect it to end up about 1.008 and 4.3% ABV.

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

AG#115 "Two Pints of Lager and a Packet of Saaz" Czech Pils v3

Trying something like one of my standard pale grists and standard process to see how it compares to a decoction mash.

15L tap water, 5.0ml Lactic Acid 80%, 2g CaCl, half a Campden tablet, giving:
Calcium 155
Chloride 100
Sulfate 41
Alkalinity 88

1000g Maris Otter
500g Vienna Malt
250g Amber Malt
200g Munich Malt
125g Carapils
2.075kg TOTAL

130min full-volume no-sparge mash @ 67degC

Boil 30mins:
50g of Saaz 2.7% AAU for 30mins
25g of Saaz 2.7% AAU for 15mins
1/4 Britewort tablet 5mins

Whirlpool/Hopsteep 15mins @ 90->85degC:
25g of Saaz 2.7% AAU

Chilled overnight to 10°C then pitched a starter of Wyeast 2278 made a few days before.

Plan to leave it there at 10ºC for a month, low and slow is the name of the game.

6.81 SRM - Golden
34.53 IBUs Tinseth 28.92 IBUs SMPH
OG 1.041

Expect it to end up about 1.008 and 4.3% ABV.

Bet that’ll turn out lovely. It’s a long time to tie up the fridge though isn’t it. Since I started brewing lagers I’m seriously thinking I might need a third fridge…

 

[Brewnaldo]

AG#115 "Two Pints of Lager and a Packet of Saaz" Czech Pils v3

Trying something like one of my standard pale grists and standard process to see how it compares to a decoction mash.

15L tap water, 5.0ml Lactic Acid 80%, 2g CaCl, half a Campden tablet, giving:
Calcium 155
Chloride 100
Sulfate 41
Alkalinity 88

1000g Maris Otter
500g Vienna Malt
250g Amber Malt
200g Munich Malt
125g Carapils
2.075kg TOTAL

130min full-volume no-sparge mash @ 67degC

Boil 30mins:
50g of Saaz 2.7% AAU for 30mins
25g of Saaz 2.7% AAU for 15mins
1/4 Britewort tablet 5mins

Whirlpool/Hopsteep 15mins @ 90->85degC:
25g of Saaz 2.7% AAU

Chilled overnight to 10°C then pitched a starter of Wyeast 2278 made a few days before.

Plan to leave it there at 10ºC for a month, low and slow is the name of the game.

6.81 SRM - Golden
34.53 IBUs Tinseth 28.92 IBUs SMPH
OG 1.041

Expect it to end up about 1.008 and 4.3% ABV.

What do you expect to gain from the long time at that temp? I only ask because my most recent and best lager, I made a conscious effort to be sure fermentation was still going when I went up for the diacetyl rest, having had issues with that previously.

 

[matt76]

Bet that’ll turn out lovely. It’s a long time to tie up the fridge though isn’t it. Since I started brewing lagers I’m seriously thinking I might need a third fridge…

The last couple I brewed like this (low & slow) certainly turned out very well.

You're right, it is a long time to you're up the brew fridge - the subject of a second one has been raised with senior management but the capex has not yet been approved.

In the meantime I have a spot that is fairly cool most of the year round (though not right now! ) which, with a heat mat and an Inkbird, will do the job for ales

 

[matt76]

What do you expect to gain from the long time at that temp? I only ask because my most recent and best lager, I made a conscious effort to be sure fermentation was still going when I went up for the diacetyl rest, having had issues with that previously.

With a d-rest I found I was getting just a whisper of esters. Not an ester bomb, just a whisper, but it was there and annoying me.

I actually took inspiration from the malt miller's videos with Budvar who just ferment low and slow. It might take longer (I'm not actually convinced it does) but the result is worth it, a super super clean lager

 

[Brewnaldo]

With a d-rest I found I was getting just a whisper of esters. Not an ester bomb, just a whisper, but it was there and annoying me.

I actually took inspiration from the malt miller's videos with Budvar who just ferment low and slow. It might take longer (I'm not actually convinced it does) but the result is worth it, a super super clean lager

So the yeast does actually consume the diacetly still, as long as you give it a long time?

 

[matt76]

So the yeast does actually consume the diacetly still, as long as you give it a long time?

In my experience, yes. More to the point, that seems to be the experience of Budvar who - like them or loathe them - have made and sold a lot more beer then I have!

 

[Brewnaldo]

I am fairly certain @DocAnna Has either done this or at least spoke about doing it.

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

the capex has not yet been approved.

Bump up the revenues and cost savings in the business plan and tweak the WACC ;-)
(and if all else fails, say the competition are doing it…)

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

So the yeast does actually consume the diacetly still, as long as you give it a long time?

This is well worth a read: I’ve tried it twice now and it has worked like a charm.
TL;DR: ferment low until you reach 50% attenuation, then ramp up.
https://byo.com/article/fast-lagers/

 

[matt76]

This is well worth a read: I’ve tried it twice now and it has worked like a charm.
TL;DR: ferment low until you reach 50% attenuation, then ramp up.
https://byo.com/article/fast-lagers/

I'm gonna counter this - I'm well aware of it, I know lots of people use it successfully etc etc etc, hell I even win a forum competition will a Munich Helles brewed this way...

But even so, I swear, lagers made in my brewery using this method have just a whisper of esters. Not bad, barely even intrusive, but they're there.

It might be a serving temperature thing - I tend to keep my kegerator at 6ºC in the summer. If you're serving cooler, say 4ºC, you might not pick it up.

On the other hand, when I keep it low and slow I'd swear the result is cleaner. I'd also dispute that the time taken to ferment out fully is any different, in my brewery at least.

I'm certainly not saying it's wrong or you shouldn't do it, just that this is my experience and why I do it the way I do

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

I'm gonna counter this - I'm well aware of it, I know lots of people use it successfully etc etc etc, hell I even win a forum competition will a Munich Helles brewed this way...

But even so, I swear, lagers made in my brewery using this method have just a whisper of esters. Not bad, barely even intrusive, but they're there.

It might be a serving temperature thing - I tend to keep my kegerator at 6ºC in the summer. If you're serving cooler, say 4ºC, you might not pick it up.

On the other hand, when I keep it low and slow I'd swear the result is cleaner. I'd also dispute that the time taken to ferment out fully is any different, in my brewery at least.

I'm certainly not saying it's wrong or you shouldn't do it, just that this is my experience and why I do it the way I do

Absolutely! “Low and slow” is certainly traditional and probably better if you have the space and patience

 

[DocAnna]

For what it’s worth and my reading, one of the key influences on esters in lagers is pitching temperature. Ideally this should be a degree or two lower than fermentation temperature, then let it rise over the first day. The diacetyl rest is a must in my book irrespective of how long I’ve left it at a low for fermentation. I’ve found that the rest will also help with clearing a persistent haze as well in a lager.

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

pitching temperature. Ideally this should be a degree or two lower than fermentation temperature, then let it rise over the first day

Very interesting. I have in the past wanted a bit more clarity on the temperature in the “body” of the fermentation as opposed to that at the surface, especially when it’s generating significant metabolic heat.
One thing I keep meaning to do is suspend a thermosensor in the centre of the FV and compare the reading there versus that from the one strapped to the outer surface. I expect that convection currents will give pretty good mixing but it would be nice to measure it.

 

[Buffers brewery]

One thing I keep meaning to do is suspend a thermosensor in the centre of the FV and compare the reading there versus that from the one strapped to the outer surface. I expect that convection currents will give pretty good mixing but it would be nice to measure it.

I would find the results from that little experiment very interesting too. I control my fermentation fridge very crudely. I have the temperature sensor poking through a hole in the fridge side wall . I've often wondered about overshoot and undershoot and lag times but don't have the wherewithal to check it out. My beer doesn't seem to suffer......but?

 

[matt76]

For what it’s worth and my reading, one of the key influences on esters in lagers is pitching temperature. Ideally this should be a degree or two lower than fermentation temperature, then let it rise over the first day.

This. Definitely this. IMO at least. I don't pitch my ale yeast at 25-30ºC so why would I pitch my lager yeast at 15-20ºC?

And again, really worth checking out those Malt Miller/Budvar videos as this is exactly what Budvar do (they pitch at 9ºC IIRC).

To be fair I'm using WY2278 - Czech, but not the Budvar stain AFAIK. I'm chilling to 10ºC, at the bottom of the stated 10-14ºC temp range. I'm too chicken to pitch lower then this

But definitely chill then pitch - in this last brew I chilled overnight. Sanitising everything shouldn't be difficult, and the low temperature ought to inhibit any remaining bugs (right?).

 

[matt76]

Very interesting. I have in the past wanted a bit more clarity on the temperature in the “body” of the fermentation as opposed to that at the surface, especially when it’s generating significant metabolic heat.
One thing I keep meaning to do is suspend a thermosensor in the centre of the FV and compare the reading there versus that from the one strapped to the outer surface. I expect that convection currents will give pretty good mixing but it would be nice to measure it.

I haven't gone out of my way to calibrate my Inkbird and Tilt together, though they're not miles out, but they do differ. If anything I'd say the Inkbird is noisier, more prone to fluctuations - unsteady air currents, small leaks, brewers who keep opening the fridge door etc vs. a liquid with a greater thermal inertia. Not really a surprise!

 

[Justin Dean]

I do pilsners under pressure ferment. Works. This is my method

https://share.brewfather.app/bYycw6xz5AX3Ao

 

[matt76]

AG#116 "In the Belly of a Fruitbat" Black IPA

Brewed this last week - in fact it's pretty much done fermenting already.

My take on Siren's excellent "In the Belly of a Shark" Black IPA. Don't know the recipe, just the hop varieties used.

15L tap water, 2.5ml Lactic Acid 80%, 2g CaCl, half a Campden tablet, giving:
Calcium 155
Chloride 100
Sulfate 41
Alkalinity 202

1000g Maris Otter
500g Vienna Malt
250g Amber Malt
250g Carapils
125g Dark Crystal Malt
125g Carafa Special 3
2.25kg TOTAL

120min full-volume no-sparge mash @ 67degC

Boil 30mins:
I'm using a hop blend of equal parts:
Azacca 12.1% AAU
Citra 13.1% AAU
Mosaic 11.5% AAU

15g of Hop Mix for 30mins
15g of Hop Mix for 10mins
1/4 Britewort tablet 5mins

Whirlpool (90 -> 85ºC):
60g of Hop Mix for 20mins

Dry hop:
After fermentation I'll soft crash then dry hop for 24-48hrs with 60g Hop Mix

Pitched a vitality starter made the day before with 500ml tap water, 50g light DME and half a pack (5.75g) Fermentis US-05.

OG = 1.045
SRM = 24.5 (Black)
IBU = 55 Rager / 73 SMPH
Expect it to end up about 1.013 and 4.3% ABV.

 

[matt76]

AG#117 "Mustang" American Amber Ale

I've made this a few times before. I've gone back to a Chico strain (US-05 in this case) as I wasn't bowled over with the LVIPA I used last time.

It's a touch darker than before as I had no Dark Crystal in stock so I've gone with Extra Dark.

I'm also continuing to experiment with a more Chloride-forward rather than Sulphate-forward or neutral water profile.

15L tap water, 3.75ml Lactic Acid 80%, 2g CaCl, half a Campden tablet, giving:
Calcium 156
Chloride 102
Sulfate 41
Alkalinity 157

1000g Maris Otter
500g Vienna Malt
250g Amber Malt
250g Carapils
125g Carared
125g Extra Dark Crystal
2.25kg TOTAL

5 hour full-volume no-sparge mash @ 67degC

Boil 30mins:
I'm using a blend of hops, Amarillo 9.1%, Cascade 6.5% and Centennial 10.0% AAU
15g of hop mix for 30mins
15g of hop mix for 15mins
30g of hop mix for 10mins
30g of hop mix for 5 mins
1/4 Britewort tablet 5mins

Dry hop:
Will add 30g of hop mix at end of fermentation

All plain sailing, no issues to report. Pitched a vitality starter made the day before with 500ml tap water, 50g light DME and half a pack of US-05.

OG = 1.044
SRM = 13 (Deep Amber)
IBU = 50 Rager / 53 SMPH

Should end up around 1.012 and 4.3% ABV-ish.