Mash Tun Size/Capacity?

[Wez]

Is there a way of working out what volume in litres I will get in my mash tun working from the weight of grain I’m using, the mash liquor (eg 2.5L per KG) and the quantity of additions for batch sparging.

For example how much in L is 1 KG of grain (typically) is it 2 litres?

 

[J_P]

I have a 2l plastic jug that holds 1 kg of grain give or take a few grams.

It may be stating the obvious but 1kg of grain and 1l of water will not occupy 2l of space.

 

[Aleman]

A real world example given a recipe with 7.75Kg of malt and a 2.5L/Kg liquor/Grist ratio gives a total mash volume of 24.55L so thats 3.1L for every Kilo of grain

24L TB - 7.5 Kg To the Brim
38L TB - 11.9 Kg To the Brim
50L TB - 15.7 Kg To the Brim
60L TB - 18.9 Kg To the Brim
70L TB - 22.1 Kg To the Brim
80L TB - 25.2 Kg To the Brim

Of course it could make sparging tricky . . . as as for mashing in . . . .

 

[steve_flack]

At the risk of oversimplifying it. I assume that a mash tun of size xL will comfortably hold enough mash to make xL of 1.050 finished beer. This assumes around 70-75% efficiency and a 2.5L/kg liquor grist ratio.

It seems that Aleman's figures back this up....the key word above is 'comfortably'.

 

[Wez]

Thanks for that gents :thumb:

So would I just be better off going back to fly sparging so that I don't have to leave space for the water additions or should I just run off the first lot then keep topping up until i've added and run off what I need to? :wha:

 

[Wez]

What do you guys think about the spinny sparging question? Am I better going back to that? I guess that way the tun won't need to be as large to accomodate the grain, mash liquor and then the batch additons?

 

[Smod]

I've only ever used a small container eg 12l and batch sparged, vorlaufed and draining fully, refilling and leaving for 10 mins and repeat as necessary. Saw it on a DVD from the USA and it seems quick and gets good enough results. (I think!!)

 

[Vossy1]

The main reason I gave up the spinny was the time it takes with big batches.
At 1 ltr/min my 10" phils spinny started shooting liquor upwards, out of the tun. With 40+ litres of liquor to sparge it simply took too long.
I tried fly sparging without a spinny, using a perforated copper manifold. I had good results at a flow rate of up to 5ltr/min.

TBH, I'm thinking of going back to it, as it's faster than batch sparging.

 

[BrewStew]

having never batch sparged i cant really comment, but am i correct in remembering that fly sparging gets a better efficiency?

if so, what's the benefit/point of batch sparging when it takes longer and is less efficient?

 

[steve_flack]

TBH, I'm thinking of going back to it, as it's faster than batch sparging.

How's that? I batch sparge and it's pretty fast for me.

 

[MEB]

I always allow 2 hrs for sparging. I'm in a hurry to drink my beer not make it. :lol: After i'd brewed my first DP IPA i have never looked back. I sparge as slow as is possible and i hit 75-90% efficiency, depending on the grain. I use a valentine arm and sit back and enjoy a few beers while i'm sparging. I cover the MT with loads of towels to keep the heat in and turn on the elements to my HLT every now and then to keep it at above 85C. This gives a mash bed temp of 77-80C with my set-up. The only problem i have is the drop in temps once the liquor level in my HLT gets lower than the elements. By that time it's mainly done and i'm generally a bit pickled so it doesn't bother me.

I have tried batch sparging once or twice but i find it a lot more fuss than fly sparging. My system is set-up for fly sparging. I can produce a 40L batch with my 25L set-up fly sparging. I can only just manage 25L batch sparging.

I do have a nice shiny system on order but my boat ate all my brewery money all of a sudden this year-boats do that-bloody things :evil: My new brewery should be able to do a no sparge 25L batch. I'm proper looking forward to being able to finance it.

 

[BrewStew]

oooh crap... thanks MEB you just made me realise i missed the "mash out" step with the liquor on my first brew tutorial.... i'll get that in straight away.... cheers :thumb:

 

[Aleman]

Speed of sparging . . . . Actually it should be done slowly for maximum efficiency . . . If you have the space in the tun and are prepared to accept the 'waste' you can always bung in a couple of kilos of grain When I was fly sparging I used to regularly hit 85%, now I'm back down to 75% ish. (Both batch and fly) however I have noticed a few times when I'm fly sparging quickly that I do get a tannin dryness in the beer, which I put down to channeling . . . This probably means that on my system I need to fly sparge more slowly . . . . Batch sparging . . . I'm in no hurry, and with the pump for recirculating its not an issue . . . but its still takes a good 30-40 minutes . . . I run off slowly

Yes, I could get a brew day down to 4 1/2 hours . . . . But why would I want to? I'm not commercial so I don't need to get 8-10 Mashes done every 24 hours to keep up with continuous fermentation schedule . . . . In fact If I take 90 minutes to mash I can cut the grass out the front, and do the back while boiling/chilling.

 

[Vossy1]

having never batch sparged i cant really comment, but am i correct in remembering that fly sparging gets a better efficiency?

if so, what's the benefit/point of batch sparging when it takes longer and is less efficient?

On my last batch sparge I got 83% efficiency...I'm not sure I want it to be any higher.

How's that? I batch sparge and it's pretty fast for me.

When I add the second liquor addition to the mash I have to wait for the mash to settle before recircing for 10 minutes to brighten the runnings. Fly sparging 40ltrs at 5ltr/min would only take 8 mins...

Yes, I could get a brew day down to 4 1/2 hours . . . . But why would I want to?

If you're brewing in your kitchen the answer becomes obvious :lol:

Ps, knowhere am I saying I want to speed things up, just that if I get the same results from a reduced time brew then that leaves me with more time to do something else...like drinking :lol: :drink:

 

[MEB]

Fly sparging 40ltrs at 5ltr/min would only take 8 mins...

That's not sparging. Thats flowing water through a grain bed!!! 5LPM!!! I'm not sure my taps flow that much fully open. :shock:

 

[Vossy1]

That's not sparging. Thats flowing water through a grain bed!!!

Correct MEB...at some point in the past someone decided that saying 'rinsing' the grain was just not right (they probably wanted to make it sound special ) so they came up with terms like sparging, fly, batch etc.

At the end of the day your rinsing the sugar out of the grain, which ever way you do it :lol:
As to whether there are benefits or drawbacks to certain speeds of rinsing, I'm not sure yet, but at 5ltr/min I noticed no difference to sparging through a spinny. I would imagine it depends on the surface area the runnings are being drawn through as to increasing the risk of tannin extraction, and naturally oversparging.

 

[MEB]

I have found that if i increase the flow whilst sparging i get rubbish efficiency. It seems the slower i sparge the better my efficiency. But that may well be my little coolbox and peculiar sparge thing i made. :wha: It works for me though. I actually like sparging really slowly. It gives me time to have a few beers and a bit of a clean up. I also don't mind a long-ish brewday. It keeps me out of the house and in my brewery/workshop for longer. Which is good as the beer fridge is in the workshop, along with my collection of cassette's and an old twin deck stereo. A nice comfy seat too. I'd be quite happy to live in my workshop. :