making port instruction help needed

[needmorstuf]

I found some instructions for making port
https://www.northernbrewer.com/documentation/MakingPortWine.pdf

I plan on harvesting blackberries - hopefully around 2kg (maybe more) to make 5 gallons of port, adding some red grape powder 300gm (thoughts?) and sugar then following the instructions..

The maths is easy enough and I have a friend who can produce 92% abv spirit in place of everclear.

I am having a little trouble understanding some of the terms though and wondered if anyone could help?

"STOP BETWEEN 3 – 11.5 ºB (ACTUAL) FOR DRY TO
SWEET PORT"

Is that referring to a gravity? or a percentage of alcohol - i.e. add the 92% spirit when the must alcohol percentage is 8%?


" SUGAR - BRIX (ºB) ~22 – 25 ºB
<22 to low (see adds.)
>26 MAY dilute"

"- OPTIONAL – CHAPITALIZE (ADDING SUGAR)
Must < 22 ºB
1.5oz (~3T) sugar/ gal must = ~1ºB
Dissolve in small quantity of must, add"

I presume that means adding sugar to your fruit if it isn't at a specific gravity? if so what SG am I trying to achieve?

 

[needmorstuf]

ok it's begun.. 2.5kg blackberries, boiled them for a few minutes with 3kg sugar and some water to kill bugs
put in an FV onto 2 campden tabs and 5 tsp of pectolase and 450gm of grape powder.

going to leave 24 hours then top up to 5 gallon and take SG to 1.1 (brix 24 is 1.1) by adding sugar (https://www.brewersfriend.com/brix-converter/)

add nutrient and yeast and ferment, punching down cap and stiring up lees several times a day

I am guessing that the 92% spirit needs adding when the % of the solution is 8%, so that's a gravity of 1.039

I will then add spirit using formula

X = V(C-A) / B-C
X = GAL BRANDY NEEDED
V = GALLONS OF WINE
C = FINAL ALCOHOL % WANTED
B = ALCOHOL % OF BRANDY
A = ALCOHOL % OF WINE

so..
X = 5(20-8) / 92-8
X = 5(12) / 84
X = 60 / 84
X = 0.714 gallons of 92% spirit (3.25 litres)

This then needs leaving to macerate for 3-12 days (?? needed as I am using mostly grape powder)

I will then sieve through my fine mesh nylon bag into my plastic carboy and degass
(?? is wine stabiliser needed at this stage as the high alcohol content has stopped fermentation)
(?? are campden tablets needed due to high alcohol content?)

Finally add finings and leave to clear (maybe rack off again)

Then bottle

 

[needmorstuf]

update

I took water to 23l before adding extra sugar (added 3kg to start) and needed to add another 3kg and final water got to 25l.. so being worried about it having a nice robust flavour I am going to add another 150gm of grape powder and have just got 500gm of raisins to also add.

 

[Dutto]

I apologise for the fact that no-one has bothered to reply to the OP. I have an excuse in that I haven't got a clue as to what any of the original advice actually means!

However, I can point out that there is no need for a Stabiliser IF the ABV is above the percentage at which the yeast can still produce alcohol from the sugar. This is why the high ABV liqueurs (Drambuie, Cointreau, Tia Maria etc) are so sweet but don't restart fermenting in the bottle.

By now the above information is probably too late to be of any help, but one bit of information that may still be useful is that a well made Port will keep maturing for many, many years in the bottle.

The father of a friend of mine up in Scotland laid down two 6-bottle cases of Port for his son on the day he was born. The first three bottles were to celebrate his majority, the second three bottles were to celebrate his marriage, the third three bottles were to celebrate the birth of his first child and the final three bottles to celebrate the first child's Christening.

I helped drink the last three bottles and after 28 years kept under the stairs at his home it was perfect.

Here's hoping that by 2045 your Port will be just as good! :thumb:

 

[BeerCat]

What yeast did you use? I have made one with a high alcohol yeast and sugar fed it to boost the ABV. Going to be fortifying it with brandy.

 

[needmorstuf]

re stabiliser, yes I agree when i take the abv to 20 then the yeasties will die.. just not sure if campden are required but I guess that as the abv is going to be high that it should be ok.

2045 - that's funny.. only way any will last long is if I misplace it.

I used ec1118, I did think about going down the sugar feeding route but figured I have access to the high abv neutral spirit so why not try mimic the traditional way, well I don't have access to vast quantities of grapes so hoping the grape powder will be a good substitute.

 

[HLA91]

2.5kg of blackberries for 5 Gallons seems rather too little.
Most blackberry recipes (from memory) are 1kg+ per gallon, especially for a port you would want it quite full bodied. I understand you have added grape powder so I just hope that adds some extra body to help with the higher alcohol %.
The other part of that recipe that is throwing me is why is it telling you to take the alcohol to 8% before fortifying, why not take it to say 16% then fortify from there? I understand that by stopping at 8% you are going to have some nice residual sugar left behind, but to my mind the amount of fortifying you will have to do will water down the port. Why not take it to 16% naturally then back-sweeten and fortify simultaneously? Your making me fancy some port now, i'll have a look for some blackberries

 

[needmorstuf]

Yes I see what you are saying and that never crossed my mind tbh.. and that option is still open to me as it's only 24 hours into fermentation, I could feed it sugar until it stops out and back sweeten. Thus the amount of spirit I need to add would be reduced and have less of a dilution effect! and more body.

I like it!

ec1118 apparently is good up to 18%

I have 6kg of sugar added to 2.5kg of blackberries and the total volume of liquid (inc sugar and blackberries) was 25l.

Just not sure how much to add and when and when to know to stop adding it.

I was just trying to copy the recipe.

the grape powder is the main constituent for the body - with the blackberries and raisins being added for extra body. someone already had good results making a red wine from grape powder so I am using the grape powder to make the "wine" and added the blackberries and raisins just for a bit more oomph. The "blackberry only port" recipe I saw had 4.5kg of them for 1 gallon!

 

[needmorstuf]

more musings.. so if i am to take my brew to 16%...

my SG was 1.1 indicating sugar per litre of 265gm and a potential 13.4% wine .. to get to 16% I need 315gm per litre.. so for my ~21 litres of water (2.5kg of blackberries and 6kg sugar in the total volume of 25l) I need:

(315-265)*21 = 1050gms of extra sugar
So I am going to add 3x500gm of sugar everytime the gravity gets down to 1.04

when the yeast dies out at a hopeful 16% I will then fortify (calculated 1.17 litres @ 92% spirit to take 16% of 21l to 20%) and back sweeten to taste

 

[Dutto]

Spot on for the maths! :thumb:

However, I wouldn't do any fortification until just before bottling because a) You won't know the exact ABV. and b) You won't get all of the brew out of the FV.

I suggest that you calculate the amount of fortification you require just before bottling. :thumb:

 

[needmorstuf]

Spot on for the maths! :thumb:

However, I wouldn't do any fortification until just before bottling because a) You won't know the exact ABV. and b) You won't get all of the brew out of the FV.

I suggest that you calculate the amount of fortification you require just before bottling. :thumb:

solid plan.

I will first sieve through my nylon bag into pet carboy to clear onto campden tablets. Then leave to clear. Then rack again to get my volumes before fortification.

 

[needmorstuf]

had 24l of product so adding 1.33l of 92%

 

[Dutto]

had 24l of product so adding 1.33l of 92%

Maths good if the product was at 16% ... :thumb:

... but how did you establish the ABV to start with?

 

[needmorstuf]

kind of guessing tbh based on the following.

I had 2.5kg blackberries, 500gm raisins and started with 6kg sugar... I let it get down to 1.03 and added another 1kg of sugar, left it a day and added another 750gm. I then left it until it stopped producing co2. Had good fermentation throughout kept at a steady 20c using water bath and aquarium heater.

That is a potential abv of 18.4%

I used ec1118 - that has a resistance up to 18% so I am guessing that it didnt get to 18% as that would require perfect conditions and guessing at 16%


but let's say it was 18 - that would have given me a final abv of 21.9
20 would be 23.7
14 would be 18

so its not a million miles off regardless..

besides I did a taste test and it's spot on:)

 

[needmorstuf]

so it cleared and i gave a few hundred ml to my bro in law who drinks more port than he should.. he says its lovely and fine as it is - no need to make stronger or sweeter, said the fruit notes come through (the blackberries and raisins)

so I am going to say it's been a success and I now have 25l of port! I wish I could find a cheap barrel to age it in.

I did bung in 50gm of heavy toasted american oak for a week, not sure if it helped. I will bottle it and hopefully lose some for a few years.

I can only imagine how good making a batch of port from a good red kit would be (by comparing a good red kit to the wine I made from the grape powder)! by adding extra sugar once it got to 1.03.. then fortifying.

 

[LED_ZEP]

Hi Needmorstuf

I'm tempted to have a go at two gallon of this, I really like an occasional glass of port.

I prefer a ruby port to a tawny, how does this one compare and is there anything you would change?

Thanks
Paul.

 

[needmorstuf]

I wish I was that clued about about port to give you a good deep analysis my friend, I would say it's definitely on the ruby side though..

personally I would add more powder for extra body, I would make it a tad sweeter and a tad stronger.. all those things expect body are easy enough to ADD though - can't take em away once added. I reckon for the body side of things - extra powder, extra fruit

I think what really make this brew is the blackberries and raisins for the fruity aspect to it..

 

[itry]

RESURRECTION!!!

I love port i think this might be worth a try this weekend.

 

[BeerCat]

Good idea, I have some port yeast but can't find grape juice anymore. I think blackberry and elderberry port would be good. About 16% then top up with brandy.