lager yeast

[Wonderwoman]

Has anyone used lager yeast in these temperatures? I wanna ferment it in the garage. Probably well have to drape a wet towel over it will I?

Or should I play it safe and get a Nottingham yeast (the recipe calls for it despite it being a märzen/ lager)

 

[MyQul]

When you say "these temperatures" what temps are you getting in your garage? I suspect you mean too warm for the lager yeast. If so it will be like using a ale yeast at 30C and you will get off flavours. Lagers are of course supposed to be clean tasting so even a small amount of off flavours that you probably wouldn't even notice in an ale would be considered a flaw in lager. Either wait for the winter, get a brew fridge or have a go at a psuedo lager with US-05 brewed as cool as you can manage

 

[Wonderwoman]

I haven't actually measured the temp in the garage yet. I guess I couldn't go wrong with the Nottingham ale yeast then? According to the recipe that's the one they use anyway so flavourwise should be ok.

What about the cooling method of draping a wet towel over the fv?

 

[MyQul]

I tried the wet towel method but didn't find it very effective. I've read you need the air to be fairly dry for it to work so maybe the air in my flat is quite humid especially as the FV/my brewing corner is in the kitchen.

I've had success with a water bath and ice bottles to cool. You do have to monitor he temp of the water regularly but I've found the trick to it is to fill the trug or whatever your using as full as you can. Then you don't have to swap out the ice bottles quite as often

 

[Wonderwoman]

Do you have to tinker a lot with setting the water temp initially? I also got some ale yeast now so might go for this this time around and lager yeast in winter. Thing is I don't know how much temp drops in the garage at night. If I use the ale yeast I think it need like 14 degrees or sth but this morning was really cold outside. Our garage is drafty, not sure how cold it gets in there. At the same time, indoors we may have more than 21 degrees especially when the yeast gets going and produces a bit more heat...

What's your suggestion?

 

[rodabod]

Measure it! Even if you just measure it once, that will help you to decide.

 

[Wonderwoman]

Measure it! Even if you just measure it once, that will help you to decide.

I am :-P Was 14.7 in there last night so checking again tomorrow, then in the day and tonight again. I guess the issue is that I don't know how much it fluctuates as I can't record the readings. Would wrapping it in something like a thin layer of bubble wrap or something help to make the fluctuations more stable? Obviously, it would make it a bit warmer so probably yay for ale yeast nay for lager

 

[rodabod]

14.7 is pretty cool. Not sure how well suited it would be to lager yeast (maybe look at Koelsch yeast..).

Insulation would be a bad idea at the start as yeast produce heat which causes a rise in temperature in the fermenting vessel at the start of fermentation. However, later on it might be a good idea if there are large fluctuations.

 

[Wonderwoman]

14.7 is pretty cool. Not sure how well suited it would be to lager yeast (maybe look at Koelsch yeast..).

Insulation would be a bad idea at the start as yeast produce heat which causes a rise in temperature in the fermenting vessel at the start of fermentation. However, later on it might be a good idea if there are large fluctuations.

Looks like I'll have problems then... the difference between warm and cold is so big at the moment. Yesterday in the day it was 17 or even 18 in there at one point, before I went to bed it was only 13.

 

[MyQul]

Looks like I'll have problems then... the difference between warm and cold is so big at the moment. Yesterday in the day it was 17 or even 18 in there at one point, before I went to bed it was only 13.

If you have the space and are any good at DIY (or know someone that is) I think a fermentation chamber will help you get around these large swings in temp

 

[Wonderwoman]

If you have the space and are any good at DIY (or know someone that is) I think a fermentation chamber will help you get around these large swings in temp

It actually was 10 degrees in there this morning. I'm trialing the wet towel method now on top of an empty FV just to see what that would do, although it would probably get too cold at night.

Do you mean like convert a fridge to beer/brew fridge? To be honest, space would be a bit of an issue. I'm quite handy at DIY and I can solder but don't know much about electronics.

So I have a choice of lager yeast and ale yeast but with the current swings it would appear that neither would be up for the job Really wanted to brew this weekend as this style of beer should mature for two months - and it's not a Christmas beer ;-)

edit: I just had a quick look at different yeasts... What do you guys think of the Mangrove jack's Workhorse yeast for example? This sounds like an allrounder and with the style of beer I was going to brew (Märzen), I wonder if it would actually work to use on this beer and ferment it at room temp in the house (21-22 degrees). Despite being a lager the recipe I was going to brew uses nottingham ale yeast anyway (so not actually a lager yeast)

 

[MyQul]

MJ workhorse will be fine in the house at 22C as it can be used up 32C. If fact it's got a huge temp range and can go down to 15C as well. Mazen is not a beer style I'm familiar with but if you think an ale yeast will suit this style MJWH will do the job. I found it quite a non-flocctuant yeast though and needs extra time to clear.

Mauribrew 514 is another ale yeast with a high temp tolerance (30C) and I've been using it succesfully for the past month or so

 

[Dads_Ale]

Brew at room temp with an ale yeast. I used US05 and it turned out great.
Good luck

 

[rodabod]

If you are using ale yeast for a lager style, I think that US-05 could be the best choice as it has little flavour. Or Koelsch yeast, as suggested.

 

[Wonderwoman]

I happen to have the lallemand Nottingham yeast here. Would that be okay at 22 degrees for a lager style?
I think I will get some higher temp tolerance yeasts next time I order. What style of beer have you used it on?

I also have to look into harvesting yeast if that's possible

 

[Wonderwoman]

With the vacuum packed lallemand yeast what do I do if I just wanna use half a sachet? Should I keep the other half as air tight as possible in the fridge or rehydrate all then put half in the fridge?

Btw the beer I am brewing us a lager but its more like a festbier so darker and maltier and sweeter so not as clean as a pale lager I guess.

 

[Covrich]

Ugg post went missing

I have work mates who refuse to try any ale whatsoever, but I thought Id make a lager using US05 and hoping I could make one AG to smash a shelf beer (one drinks carling!!) out of the park!

I was thinking AG US05 and try and keep the temp at 18-20 and batch charge 150grams.. from what a few of you said you tried it.. good results??

 

[brisboy]

I've had good success with bry-97 as a warm weather yeast. The other thing you might try as a cheap, little space brew warming option is putting your fermenter in another bucket of water with an aquarium heater. I live in a spot where the temp can fluctuate 20 degrees in a day and the aquarium heater has made a big difference.

 

[Dads_Ale]

Ugg post went missing

I have work mates who refuse to try any ale whatsoever, but I thought Id make a lager using US05 and hoping I could make one AG to smash a shelf beer (one drinks carling!!) out of the park!

I was thinking AG US05 and try and keep the temp at 18-20 and batch charge 150grams.. from what a few of you said you tried it.. good results??

You do get a good result with lager malt and US05. I have done 2 now, one at 7% and one at 5%. Both got good reviews from a bottle swap on another forum.

 

[Twostage]

Lager yeast is fine at higher temps. I've certainly used it at 18 with a diacetyl rest at 21. The real problem here is temperature variation which would cause a problem for both lager and ale yeast.

Larger volumes of liquid are more temperature stable, the larger the better. When I cold crash 20 litres in a fridge at 3 degrees it takes about 24 hours for the beer to get down to that temperature and it takes a few hours for it to move more than a degree.

So...

My recommendation is to put your FV in a larger container of water like a horse water bucket to increase the volume and increase temperature stability and use a lager yeast.