King Keg not holding pressure but no apparent leak

[El Ceetee]

Hi,
I'm a newbie to brewing and to this forum.
I have myself a KK top tap and am about to rack a Festival Razorback IPA in the next few days. I decided to check for any leaks in the KK as I've read that they are prone to leaking, but I just like the idea of them. I have added a pressure gauge to the lid of it just to monitor the process. Filled it up with water, approx 23L and squirted a c02 bulb in to the keg. The gauge read 8psi, which is what I expected, but within ten minutes it had dropped to about 6.5psi. So I filled the bath up, dunked the KK and nothing. No bubbles from anywhere. The lid was fine, the gauge was fine, the tap was fine. I'm confused. The pressure in now down to 4.5psi
Would the water absorb the c02? And would it be that quick? I know that might be a very dumb question, but I did say I was new to all this.

 

[Drunkula]

Would the water absorb the c02?

Yes. I don't know about how long it takes, though.

You could empty it, squirt in some co2 and see if it maintains whatever pressure you get. If you can bike pump in some gas that would be useful.

I used to open the tap, blow into it with my mighty lungs and then open the tap a few hours or days later to see if there was a powerful whoosh. The pressure will drop a little because the air from mighty lungs is hot.

 

[Buffers brewery]

Did you check the HB S30 valve in the cap? The rubber band pressure relief valve can leak very slowly as can the rubber band non-return valve on the inside. Spray it with soapy water and leave it for 10 minutes. Look for foam .

 

[El Ceetee]

Did you check the HB S30 valve in the cap? The rubber band pressure relief valve can leak very slowly as can the rubber band non-return valve on the inside. Spray it with soapy water and leave it for 10 minutes. Look for foam .

I assumed that that would have shown when I held the keg under water. It was under for a good while as I was trying to figure it out.
Ill try the spray and see what happens but

 

[El Ceetee]

Yes. I don't know about how long it takes, though.

You could empty it, squirt in some co2 and see if it maintains whatever pressure you get. If you can bike pump in some gas that would be useful.

I'll give this a go also, makes sense really if there's nothing to absorb it

 

[terrym]

@El Ceetee
You are wise to test it before you add your beer. Gas it up and use soapy water around everything. Body, cap and joints. If it is leaking you should find the leaks this way. PBs can leak gas from anywhere. Even the tiniest leak will, over time, lose all the internal pressure. But If you dont find a leak it's more likely CO2 is being absorbed like you said originally, Hope you get it sorted.

 

[trummy]

Presume during your testing the temperature inside the keg is constant? I have found a smear of Vaseline around the threads can cure a seep there.

Had a car tyre that kept slowly going down - chucked it in my pond and never saw a leak, but it was there between the bead and rim

 

[El Ceetee]

Well I sprayed soapy water on everything and not a sign of a bubble. So I went to perform Drunkula’s test, emptied the keg, vassed the seals and ptfe taped the lid. Sprayed a shot of c02 in, all good, read almost 2psi. Unscrewed the bulb and the pressure started p*ssin out of the pin valve. I could hear it squeal and for good measure, sprayed it with soapy water. Yep. Bubbles. Inspected the pin and it looks like there is metal from the cartridges stuck in the pin and I can’t for the life of me get it out. I’ve tried to dig it out but it just seems to smoosh the weak metal in to the pin more. Won’t be racking tomorrow then.

 

[Buffers brewery]

That looks like the non-return valve is leaking to me. Check the rubber band under the lid on the small stem. Might need changing. Try rotating on the stem and check for splits etc.

 

[El Ceetee]

That looks like the non-return valve is leaking to me. Check the rubber band under the lid on the small stem. Might need changing. Try rotating on the stem and check for splits etc.

Yeah I checked the rubber and it seems fine, no splits.
I’ve actually managed to dig out some of the metal cartridge from the pin and can see more in there but just can’t get it out. I’m assuming it’s sticking the pin open slightly letting the air back out? Is that how they work? The pressure from the cartridge forces it open then shuts again once all the gas is released?

 

[Clint]

Burn it!

 

[El Ceetee]

Any ideas on what to do with the 23L of IPA I have cold crashing until I can get this sorted?
Many thanks for the help already.

 

[Buffers brewery]

Leave your IPA where it is. I don't have a pin type valve, I use S30 Brewgas cylinders. I don't think there's a valve in the pin. I think the pin just pierces the cartridge cap and the gas empties into the keg. The only non-return valve is the rubber band on the valve stem under the cap. It seems like it isn't seated properly and is letting gas back up the valve. Can you move the rubber band around the stem?

 

[terrym]

Any ideas on what to do with the 23L of IPA I have cold crashing until I can get this sorted?
Many thanks for the help already.

It will be OK to leave it in the FV for a few days.
Otherwise if you cant immediately sort out your PB, and need to package it soonest the emergency option is to buy 12 2 litre bottles of cheap fizzy water from a supermarket pour the water away and package into them (assuming of course you dont have enough bottles already).
Welcome to the world of PBs.

 

[El Ceetee]

Can you move the rubber band around the stem?

I have, as far as I can tell, twisted it round a bit. Didn't move easily It looks fine though, covering the hole, not folded or pushed up anywhere. I'm gonna try and get a new one, but with how the home brew shops have been it might be a while. Ill need some more c02 cartridges too Or maybe I should swap to the cylinders.

 

[El Ceetee]

Welcome to the world of PBs.

Yeah right. Haha. I managed to get one good use out of it.

 

[terrym]

Yeah right. Haha. I managed to get one good use out of it.

Thats one better than some on here have reported

 

[Buffers brewery]

I have, as far as I can tell, twisted it round a bit. Didn't move easily It looks fine though, covering the hole, not folded or pushed up anywhere. I'm gonna try and get a new one, but with how the home brew shops have been it might be a while. Ill need some more c02 cartridges too Or maybe I should swap to the cylinders.

You might consider fitting a Schrader valve so you can test with air (foot pump or electric pump for tyres).
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B073Y3B8T5/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[El Ceetee]

You might consider fitting a Schrader valve so you can test with air (foot pump or electric pump for tyres).
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B073Y3B8T5/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Yeah that could be a good investment. Save on c02

On another note, I've been looking around and cant find a decisive answer, if anyone could point me to a decent thread that'd be amazing. There's a bit of mixed information on priming sugar amounts after cold crashing. Because I have a PB does it matter all that much?
I was going to add some c02 when I eventually rack it, then warm it up to add priming sugar and another squirt The amount of sugar given to me in the kit is 100g, which in the calculators requires a temp. of 3.5degrees C to obtain 2.5v of c02. Im not too sure now. Is t 2.5 too much as I can add C02 when required to the PB?

 

[stan.distortion]

You can also use a bicycle tyre inflater if you fit a Schrader valve, they take the same CO2 cartridge and cost very little.