Help with my pales.

[NeipaNutter]

Hi. I've been brewing now for a couple of years but am yet to make a good pale ale. I've made some great stouts and black ipas but all my pales, IPAs, neipas, are basically undrinkable. The all have a strange flavour and nothing I do seems to help. This is both bottled and kegged, dry hopped/not dry hopped. Is there a lab or something that I can send a bottle too and get some kind of report?

 

[Agentgonzo]

Unsure, but different styles do depend on different water chemistry. Dark malts make the mash more acidic, which can counterbalance water with a naturally high pH. Naturally high pH doesnt' work as well for pale ales because the mash isn't acidic enough. Where abouts are you as places like the south of England have high Calcium levels and pH.

Or the add flavour could be a variety of things. Chlorine/chloramine can react with the phenols in the beer to produce chlorophenols (TCP flavours).

Whas is the 'strange' flavour that you mention. If you can try to describe it as best you can, people on here will likely be able to suggest possible causes/solutions.

 

[Mayor of Simpleton]

Can you describe the strange flavour you are getting that makes them undrinkable?

 

[MickDundee]

If you make good farm beers but poor pales, it could be your water. Are you doing any water treatment?

 

[Stu's Brews]

If you make good farm beers but poor pales, it could be your water. Are you doing any water treatment?

When I first started brewing and wasn't treating my water I tended to struggle with hoppier beers. They would come out with some phenolic flavours (chemical/band aid) and/or a harsh bitterness.

Since starting to treat my water with a campden tablet and making pH and mineral adjustments I've had much more success with them.

 

[Stu's Brews]

Another thing to consider is whether you are pitching enough yeast. If you are 'under-pitching' then the yeast will grow rapidly because there is an abundance of 'food'. This then causes a greater proportion of esters, higher alcohols, etc. to be created which can then be tasted in the final beer.

I always make a yeast starter now in order to make sure I have a good pitching rate and healthy yeast. You can get around this though by using more than one packet of whatever yeast you are using.

 

[foxy]

Hi. I've been brewing now for a couple of years but am yet to make a good pale ale. I've made some great stouts and black ipas but all my pales, IPAs, neipas, are basically undrinkable. The all have a strange flavour and nothing I do seems to help. This is both bottled and kegged, dry hopped/not dry hopped. Is there a lab or something that I can send a bottle too and get some kind of report?

Very difficult to offer advice remotely, best thing to do is put up a recipe and process including salt additions and water analysis.

 

[NeipaNutter]

Unsure, but different styles do depend on different water chemistry. Dark malts make the mash more acidic, which can counterbalance water with a naturally high pH. Naturally high pH doesnt' work as well for pale ales because the mash isn't acidic enough. Where abouts are you as places like the south of England have high Calcium levels and pH.

Or the add flavour could be a variety of things. Chlorine/chloramine can react with the phenols in the beer to produce chlorophenols (TCP flavours).

Whas is the 'strange' flavour that you mention. If you can try to describe it as best you can, people on here will likely be able to suggest possible causes/solutions.
[/QUOTE

My water is pretty neutral. I've done brews with both untreated and treated with lactic acid and also use campden tablets for the chloramine. I've used dry yeast and liquid yeasts and don't think they were underpitched as I only do 11L batches.
It's hard to describe the taste. It's like a really sharp bite. My first thought was astringency but I've both squeezed and not squeezed the grains and had the same result

 

[Braufather]

As foxy said, if you can put a recipe down with your process, that should give us a bit more to work with?

astringency? Maybe over bitterness? To many boil hops?

 

[NeipaNutter]

As foxy said, if you can put a recipe down with your process, that should give us a bit more to work with?

astringency? Maybe over bitterness? To many boil hops?

Shouldn't be too many boil hops cause I mostly do low bitterness pales and hazy pales, I've even had this problem with beers that had no hops till flameout.

Good idea about the recipe. I'll post a recipe and process when I get home later. Thanks guys

 

[The Baron]

Better than a Lab report send some bottles out to the Forum Members who are best at beer reviewing if you really get stuck with a recipe sheet for each bottle

 

[Sandimas]

Shouldn't be too many boil hops cause I mostly do low bitterness pales and hazy pales, I've even had this problem with beers that had no hops till flameout.

That might be the problem, most pale ale recipes I've brewed / seen have a decent amount of bitterness, 30-45 IBU. Maybe try a recipe with more bittering hops? Exmoor Gold and TT Landlord clones are both regulars here and nice reliable brews.

 

[Braufather]

Shouldn't be too many boil hops cause I mostly do low bitterness pales and hazy pales, I've even had this problem with beers that had no hops till flameout.

Good idea about the recipe. I'll post a recipe and process when I get home later. Thanks guys

I take it the same fermenters , and other equipment etc have been used for the dark Ales you are happy with and the pales that have issues?

 

[CD]

I mis-read this thread as 'Help with my piles'. A visit to Specsavers methinks.

 

[Eskimo John]

I mis-read this thread as 'Help with my piles'. A visit to Specsavers methinks.

I think so! Although putting ointment on your IPAs will make them tast odd.

 

[Agentgonzo]

I mis-read this thread as 'Help with my piles'. A visit to Specsavers methinks.

I don't think a trip to Specsavers would help with your piles either!