Help with equipment purchase please.

[ruskythegreat]

I have a fermentasaurus but no way to cold crash

 

[Chippy_Tea]

In fairness you've confirmed the point, a minority of them do go wrong

I didnt have figures so posted majority, these systems have been around many years and many members own them I dont remember many if any threads abount them going wrong so it must be a very small percent of them that do go wrong.

 

[Sadfield]

I saw one in a brew shop some years ago and thought: "my goodness look at all those things to go wrong".

it must be a very small percent of them that do go wrong.

You are still confirming the potential for failure in the original statement.

Just on the first page of this thread from last week there's reports of one dead unit and one upgraded because of design issues. Posts #17 and #20

https://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/threads/would-you-swap-your-all-in-one.103589/page-3#post-1246959

 

[MashBag]

#17 & #20 are the same thing. Same machine.

In 51 replies that equates to less than 2%.

Surely greater than 98% is an acceptable reliability rating?

 

[Old Fart At Play]

I expect to be a lone voice here but I cannot understand why people spend hundreds of pounds on a Grainfather or similar. ......

Maybe you can't understand it, but that doesn't mean that they have made a wrong choice. How you brew, and what you brew with, varies a great deal between individuals.

It seems to me the key things are enjoying your brewing, and buying equipment that seems worth it to you which is within your budget.

You seem to be saying that spending less and getting some basic kit with 2kw heaters and a sparging arm etc etc is somehow intrinsically better than spending more money on eg an AIO. It is definitely cheaper, but 'better' depends on what you want and what you can afford.

 

[Sadfield]

#17 & #20 are the same thing. Same machine.

In 51 replies that equates to less than 2%.

Surely greater than 98% is an acceptable reliability rating?

I suggest you go back and re-read.

#17 bielmeier 30L died, #20 issues with the G40 from a different person.

Acceptable or not, 2% is still proof that AIOs have parts that fail, which confirms what was originally stated.

 

[Omega]

I expect to be a lone voice here but I cannot understand why people spend hundreds of pounds on a Grainfather or similar.

I don't understand, though well respect, the need for creating recipes :) – so, I simply buy kits and brew in a pressure fermenter to get good result with the lest effort. I am happy with my drinks and people compliment on my IPAs.
I guess my approach is the easiest way to get excellent results with the least effort and for the low cost. It works for me :)
Learning to brew... I would rather learn MS Dynamics, SAP, Oracle, Workday etc to earn more money :)

 

[hoppyscotty]

I have a system like you describe, cool box mash tun, catering boiler etc.
Where I did think it was worth spending a bit more was on the Grainfather conical fermenter, simply due to the temperature control, most importantly the cooling.
I got the cooling pump kit and a chiller unit to provide cold water to keep my fermentation at a good temperature.
I did balk at the idea of a proper glycol chiller though!

Dont need a proper glycol chiller. A bucket of glycol in a used fridge or freezer off FB market place and a submersible pump and ink bird. Dirt cheap way of providing cooling fluid for your fermenter.

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

Dont need a proper glycol chiller. A bucket of glycol in a used fridge or freezer off FB market place and a submersible pump and ink bird. Dirt cheap way of providing cooling fluid for your fermenter.

That's a good idea!
Personally I ferment in plastic bins that I can fit in the fridge, but that wouldn't work with (for example) a stainless steel conical with a cooling circuit. So what you suggest is a great workaround for FVs with a cooling jacket.
If you are happy not cold-crashing down to near zero temps then you could probably get away with using just water in the bucket...

 

[hoppyscotty]

Well you can just control your fridge with the ink bird so don't need glycol if you are in plastic buckets. I do that with my fermzilla - it goes in a fridge and I have a 40w green house tube heater, only a tenner off eBay.

But if you have a jacketed fermenter or one with coils then the bucket of glycol in the fridge is an option. You would get a way with water in a fridge to be fair. Though glycol isn't that expensive so if you can get yourself a freeze (or already have one) then that would be a better option...though be careful with drilling holes in freezers as they have alot more refrigerant lines in them than a fridge so you need to be sure if you're drilling holes in one.

 

[Sadfield]

If you are happy not cold-crashing down to near zero temps then you could probably get away with using just water in the bucket...

I've been wondering if a Peltier aquarium chiller would do the job.

 

[MashBag]

If you are happy not cold-crashing down to near zero temps then you could probably get away with using just water in the bucket...

Water works like a charm. Dirt cheap. "Fermentation twister coil'. Bingo.

I've been wondering if a Peltier aquarium chiller would do the job.

It didn't.

Although to be fair there was a £300 polystyrene fermentation thing with one in some time ago.

 

[user 43495]

I must have done 30+ brews on my Grainfather. Not had a single problem. Yes, there are definitely cheaper solutions out there but if you want a Grainfather, from my experience reliability is not a reason to buy elsewhere.

I don't buy the argument about 'tech means you don't get to learn much about brewing and recipes because it's done for you' - I could easily switch to a completely analogue system and have absolutely no problems brewing a great beer. You still need to understand basic concepts for determining water volumes, grain quantities, mash temperatures, etc. to create your own recipe. Obviously, you can also take a ready-made recipe for the GrainFather, which may be beneficial for beginners who feel they have a steep learning curve.

At the end of the day, there are different solutions that may be right for different people. Some people may want the simplicity of not having to build up their brew kit from cool boxes, etc. Others might quite enjoy that challenge.

It's never been a challenge i assure you.

 

[Stu's Brews]

It's never been a challenge i assure you.

I never said that you personally found it challenging, however, others might.

Your post that I originally replied to was quite disparaging towards brewers that have chosen to purchase an all-in-one. Just because that wasn't the 'right' solution for you, doesn't mean it isn't for other people.

Everyone has different priorities when choosing a kit. People can choose what they buy to suit their budget, time constraints, DIY skills, desire for tech feature, etc.

As long as people are happy with the kit they've got and the beer they produce from it then it really doesn't matter.

 

[user 43495]

I never said that you personally found it challenging, however, others might.

Your post that I originally replied to was quite disparaging towards brewers that have chosen to purchase an all-in-one. Just because that wasn't the 'right' solution for you, doesn't mean it isn't for other people.

Everyone has different priorities when choosing a kit. People can choose what they buy to suit their budget, time constraints, DIY skills, desire for tech feature, etc.

As long as people are happy with the kit they've got and the beer they produce from it then it really doesn't matter.

I think you are allowing your imagination to run away with you there. In fact it seems it is you who is disparaging me for having the temerity to express my own, different , opinion. What might matter to those who want to pursue this craft over many years is that all in ones, like the old music systems of the past, have one (or perhaps more) intrinsic problems, namely that if some part/s goes wrong you are usually left with the rest of it being un-useable. My setup has stood my in great stead for nearly 40 years and believe me it has brewed many many gallons in that time. For those starting out it might- just might- be worth thinking about a smaller outlay in case they do not take to it. The other issue for me is I will always brew at least twice in a day; in the summer three brews (see my brewday if you like) it saves multiple sterilisation and with seperate mashtun and boiler (note, not a catering one at all but a proper brewing kettle actually) means while one hop boil is going on another mash can be done.

 

[user 43495]

Dont need a proper glycol chiller. A bucket of glycol in a used fridge or freezer off FB market place and a submersible pump and ink bird. Dirt cheap way of providing cooling fluid for your fermenter.

I don't use a catering boiler but a brewing kettle - the sort you get from The Homebrew Shop in Farnham. It has a 16 gallon capacity so I can brew 10 gals at a time. And while the hops are boiling, because my mashtun is separate I can proceed with the next mash. This way I have made 30 gallons in a day.

 

[Stu's Brews]

I think you are allowing your imagination to run away with you there. In fact it seems it is you who is disparaging me for having the temerity to express my own, different , opinion.

You clearly haven't read my posts clearly enough so I'll dumb it down for you:

People are free to pick whatever kit they want.

 

[user 43495]

I don't understand, though well respect, the need for creating recipes :) – so, I simply buy kits and brew in a pressure fermenter to get good result with the lest effort. I am happy with my drinks and people compliment on my IPAs.
I guess my approach is the easiest way to get excellent results with the least effort and for the low cost. It works for me :)
Learning to brew... I would rather learn MS Dynamics, SAP, Oracle, Workday etc to earn more money :)

My 'need' for creating recipes is more of an interest really. Kits of all kinds dictate what the beer will be like and that's not usually how I want mine to be. I haven't brewed from anyone else's recipes for over 20 years; it's perhaps just me but i get a pleasure setting out to create a type of beer and flavour profile which more often than not comes out right first time. No I don't use any software for this because it's like cookery; you get to know your ingredients and processes.

 

[user 43495]

You clearly haven't read my posts clearly enough so I'll dumb it down for you:

People are free to pick whatever kit they want.

My goodness me, you DO seem to have a problem don't you!

 

[Stu's Brews]

My goodness me, you DO seem to have a problem don't you!

Nope. None whatsoever.

I believe people should be free to pick whatever kit they want without judgement.

I'm leaving this thread now as I have no interest in getting into a prolonged argument.

@Chippy_Tea - feel free to come in and tidy any of this up to keep the thread on track.