First Witbier.

[Agentgonzo]

I always use MJ M21 in my wheat beers and it always takes a long time to fully ferment out, 3 weeks or more, much longer than any other yeast. I've used it 4 or 5 times and every time the same.

Mine has been in the fermenter for 10 days now. There is pretty much no activity in the airlock (a couple of bubbles per hour at most). Did yours wake up after a time, or was it just slow but continuous for 3 weeks? (IE, can I expect mine to come back alive at some point).

Also. What temperature was yours at? I don't have a ferm fridge, so this started at 19°, rose to 22 at peak fermentation and has dropped down to 20 now. I don't have a heating belt so can't raise temperature bank up again

 

[Davvy]

From a yeast point of view , I used Crossmyloof Wallonia recently ; what a cracking yeast , full of distinct traditional wheat beer flavours , clove, banana, spicy....
I fermented at 18-20 deg celcius.

 

[YeastFace]

Mine has been in the fermenter for 10 days now. There is pretty much no activity in the airlock (a couple of bubbles per hour at most). Did yours wake up after a time, or was it just slow but continuous for 3 weeks? (IE, can I expect mine to come back alive at some point).

Also. What temperature was yours at? I don't have a ferm fridge, so this started at 19°, rose to 22 at peak fermentation and has dropped down to 20 now. I don't have a heating belt so can't raise temperature bank up again

It is said to slow down or even stop, and then restart. So I would recommend leaving for another week to 7 days and testing the gravity every couple of days.

Your temp profile sounds fine. I started at 18° and increased by a degree every 2-3 days and got up to 24° for a few days (to increase phenol production). Then dropped down to 20° to clean up.

I was worried, but did a search and it's quite well-known on the sister forum as a slow finisher which put me at ease.

Initially I did buy another pack as was concerned I'd pitched too soon after taking out of the fridge and this was the cause of the slow ferment. But after reading up I didn't end up using the extra pack.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Gretel is Crossmyloof’s wheat yeast.

 

[MickDundee]

Gretel is Crossmyloof’s wheat yeast.

It’s a Hefeweizen yeast rather than a wit yeast though isn’t it?

 

[Cheshire Cat]

From a yeast point of view , I used Crossmyloof Wallonia recently ; what a cracking yeast , full of distinct traditional wheat beer flavours , clove, banana, spicy....
I fermented at 18-20 deg celcius.

Saison yeast not Wit use Gretel for Wit.

 

[Agentgonzo]

It is said to slow down or even stop, and then restart. So I would recommend leaving for another week to 7 days and testing the gravity every couple of days.

Well I'll be damned. I checked it this morning (day 15 in the fermenter). Last week, there looked to be no activity in the airlock because it was very slow (around a bubble every 3-5 minutes). This morning, it's a bubble every 20-30s and very obvious the fermentation has picked up again. I've never seen this is a yeast. How very odd (for the record, it's been constant at 20°C all the way through the fermenter.

What a very bizarre yeast! Thank you for telling me to have patience

 

[Sandimas]

Sorry, didn't see your reply, I don't check the forum every day.

Yes it is a bizarre yeast, I find similar with MJ15 Empire Ale yeast, it seems to slow down then get going again. Like yours mine was around 19C, even after 3 weeks I think I may have bottled a little early as it's quite fizzy, but I was running out of patience. I haven't got my notes handy but I left one of the MJ yeasts 28 days until I was really sure it was done.

 

[Harbey]

Just a slightly late point on coriander... I dry fry/toast mine before crushing. Just enough to release the oils (you'll get an orangey aroma). Gives a great spicey, orange, citrus flavour.

 

[YeastFace]

Yep, helps release the oils. Also lightly crack the seeds, don't pound them.

 

[MickDundee]

Just a slightly late point on coriander... I dry fry/toast mine before crushing. Just enough to release the oils (you'll get an orangey aroma). Gives a great spicey, orange, citrus flavour.

I’d never thought of that. Too late for my current brew but I’ll try it next time. Does it make them easier to crush as well? I think I might need to get a pestle and mortar because the spoon and espresso cup doesn’t cut it!

 

[Harbey]

Not sure on how easy it makes it. Pestle and mortar are a nice addition to any kitchen shelf but failing that, try adding seeds to a plastic bag, covered with a tea towel and hit with a rolling pin/ hammer. DIY FtW!

 

[Sozzled Sab]

Thanks for all the info, especially about the yeast. Brewed my Wit yesterday and it's going great guns at the moment but it seems I will have to be patient with this yeast.

 

[starseeker]

Not sure on how easy it makes it. Pestle and mortar are a nice addition to any kitchen shelf but failing that, try adding seeds to a plastic bag, covered with a tea towel and hit with a rolling pin/ hammer. DIY FtW!

I would gently roll over the seeds ,and not pound them

 

[Agentgonzo]

Yep, helps release the oils. Also lightly crack the seeds, don't pound them.

What's the rationale behind this? (I stuck mine in a spice mill and ground them into a powder ). Is it just easier to filter out does it change the flavour?

 

[Harbey]

I think that as long as they are cracked open, fine or course won't make a huge difference. I do think that toasting them is a good move but I know lots of people just go for raw.

 

[DavidB]

I have a couple of questions

• when using raw wheat do you mash it as normal or does it need special treatment?
• when I last did a witbier/hoegarden it tasted great (25g orange and coriander), but it was clear as a bell! Is it possible to get the cloudy appearance of a hoegarden when you are using a corny keg and not a bottle?

 

[MickDundee]

I have a couple of questions

• when using raw wheat do you mash it as normal or does it need special treatment?
• when I last did a witbier/hoegarden it tasted great (25g orange and coriander), but it was clear as a bell! Is it possible to get the cloudy appearance of a hoegarden when you are using a corny keg and not a bottle?

Yeah, just mash with your grains as normal - there should be enough diastatic power in the pale/Pilsner malt to convert the unmalted grains - beware of a stuck mash/sparge though. I do a no sparge brew day to avoid a stuck sparge but rice hulls are a good idea.

3 of my 5 witbiers have been kegged and 2 bottled - I found that the one beer with WLP400 gave me clear beer but the 2 M21 beers stayed cloudy right to the bottom of the keg. Recipes were almost identical - only difference was the WLP beer had jumbo oats from Maltmiller whereas the M21 beers used my usual supermarket porridge oats.

 

[Sozzled Sab]

Advice on m21 was spot on. Mine bubbled away happily for a week then shut down and now into its third week has sprung back to life. Think I will give it another week before taking any fg readings. Thanks everyone.

 

[Agentgonzo]

Advice on m21 was spot on. Mine bubbled away happily for a week then shut down and now into its third week has sprung back to life. Think I will give it another week before taking any fg readings. Thanks everyone.

Mine sprung back into life in the 3rd week. 4th week it's still going. I'm hoping to get it bottled next week