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Landlord.
That looks an interesting recipe, I may have to look into trying that next time I put an order in for malt and hops, is the Belle Saison yeast readily available?
Cushyno Brewdays etc..
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Yes, the Belle Saison is a dry yeast by Lallemand and supposedly the Dupont strain, should be easy to find online.
The Saison starter did the trick. From a bottle with sediment, stepped up to 200ml, then 1l, then topped off to1.5l.
Donor wort was from last week's Burton Bridge Golden Delicious at the perfect gravity for a starter. Spare wort kept in the fridge and boiled and cooled to make each step-up.
Here's the flask with most of the supernatant decanted and left to settle. I'll decant the rest before pitching.
Donor wort was from last week's Burton Bridge Golden Delicious at the perfect gravity for a starter. Spare wort kept in the fridge and boiled and cooled to make each step-up.
Here's the flask with most of the supernatant decanted and left to settle. I'll decant the rest before pitching.
Crikey! Once again my efficiency has gone up. Aimed for 78% but if my trusty (dubious) refractometer is to be believed I could be up 4 points. So much for a 6%-ish Saison, this will be another 7% SAISON! if the yeast works as well as expected. 
So, I am wondering whether to trust the refractometer. Checked after pitching yeast and only 1 point above intended OG, so it will start at 1.053. Even so, I should be looking at 6.5% finished, so still promising to be a good one.Crikey! Once again my efficiency has gone up. Aimed for 78% but if my trusty (dubious) refractometer is to be believed I could be up 4 points. So much for a 6%-ish Saison, this will be another 7% SAISON! if the yeast works as well as expected.
Talking of good ones, here's a sample of AG35 Belgian Blonde Ale
Colour is good and straight from the FV this is tasting absolutely fabulous! The malt is great, the decoction required to increase mash temperature has helped with the body, and wow! the alcohol rolls around the mouth
CML Belgian Ale yeast has attenuated highly to drop from 1.072 to 1.009 in two weeks giving me a cracking 8.3% Belgian Blonde. Might bottle it tomorrow.
Good to know - I'm hoping to use this yeast myself soon, rather like the CML yeasts
. The Blonde sounds a bit strong but it looks really good in that glass.Anna
Bottling time for AG35 Belgian Blonde.
Worryingly, I could have topped my glass up from the FV all night. This one's going to be trouble. A very drinkable 8.5%, the Château and biscuit malts with the CML Belgian Ale yeast are giving me that typical rich Belgian flavour. Primed to about 2 volumes of co2. Should be about right.
Worryingly, I could have topped my glass up from the FV all night. This one's going to be trouble. A very drinkable 8.5%, the Château and biscuit malts with the CML Belgian Ale yeast are giving me that typical rich Belgian flavour. Primed to about 2 volumes of co2. Should be about right.
Yesterday's brew was AG38 Easter Oatmeal Stout.
Another user-upper of sorts, eeking out the couple of 5kg bags of Red X and Vienna bought last year and finally getting to use some of the darker speciality malts. Hop choice was limited as lacking any Fuggles or EKG, so a toss up between BX and First Gold. FG won the day.
The recipe shown above reflects the timings and quantities resulting from a disrupted brewday. What with my neighbour popping around to witness the mash and marvel at the range of junk in my garage, then some weighty discussions with teenage children, lunch and an easter egg hunt thrown in, it was nearing 9 hours later that I finally got washed up and tidied away. Possibly the longest brewday ever.
Boil began well but was extended.
Planned 60 minute boil became 70 mins+. 20 minute addition became 30 minute addition. I was hoping for the marmalade notes of First Gold to give compliment the chocolate flavours, that will likely be diminished.
Planned 79% Brewhouse Efficiency became 83%, therefore planned 1.049 OG became 3 points higher at 1.052.
Sometimes life gets in the way, but you have to make the most of it. A quick chill from boil to 45°C as fast as I could, stirring all the while, was all I could do to avoid increased bitterness before needing to return to some family "discussion". So technically this brew had a 40 minute stand at 45°C before finally chilling to 20°C. It'll still be beer.
Second runnings:
Almost at the boil. Wort looking great:
Good to hear sounds from the airlock this morning, happily popping away.
Another user-upper of sorts, eeking out the couple of 5kg bags of Red X and Vienna bought last year and finally getting to use some of the darker speciality malts. Hop choice was limited as lacking any Fuggles or EKG, so a toss up between BX and First Gold. FG won the day.
Code:
AG38 Easter Oatmeal Stout
Oatmeal Stout
Recipe Specs
----------------
Batch Size (L): 23.0
Total Grain (kg): 4.760
Total Hops (g): 50.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.052 (°P): 12.9
Final Gravity (FG): 1.011 (°P): 2.8
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 5.31 %
Colour (SRM): 30.7 (EBC): 60.5
Bitterness (IBU): 39.9 (Tinseth)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 83
Boil Time (Minutes): 70
Grain Bill
----------------
2.000 kg German - Vienna (42.02%)
1.800 kg BESTMALTZ RedX (37.82%)
0.400 kg Rolled Oats (8.4%)
0.180 kg United Kingdom - Chocolate (3.78%)
0.100 kg German - Carafa III (2.1%)
0.100 kg United Kingdom - Crystal 45L (2.1%)
0.100 kg United Kingdom - Extra Dark Crystal 120L (2.1%)
0.080 kg United Kingdom - Roasted Barley (1.68%)
Hop Bill
----------------
25.0 g Northern Brewer Pellet (8% Alpha) @ 70 Minutes (Boil) (1.1 g/L)
25.0 g First Gold Pellet (9% Alpha) @ 30 Minutes (Boil) (1.1 g/L)
Single step Infusion at 66°C for 60 Minutes, fell to 64.5°C so topped up with some sparge water to return to 66°C.
Three stirs as usual during mash.
Fermented at 18°C with Mangrove Jacks M36 Liberty Bell (3rd generation)The recipe shown above reflects the timings and quantities resulting from a disrupted brewday. What with my neighbour popping around to witness the mash and marvel at the range of junk in my garage, then some weighty discussions with teenage children, lunch and an easter egg hunt thrown in, it was nearing 9 hours later that I finally got washed up and tidied away. Possibly the longest brewday ever.
Boil began well but was extended.
Planned 60 minute boil became 70 mins+. 20 minute addition became 30 minute addition. I was hoping for the marmalade notes of First Gold to give compliment the chocolate flavours, that will likely be diminished.
Planned 79% Brewhouse Efficiency became 83%, therefore planned 1.049 OG became 3 points higher at 1.052.
Sometimes life gets in the way, but you have to make the most of it. A quick chill from boil to 45°C as fast as I could, stirring all the while, was all I could do to avoid increased bitterness before needing to return to some family "discussion". So technically this brew had a 40 minute stand at 45°C before finally chilling to 20°C. It'll still be beer.
Second runnings:
Almost at the boil. Wort looking great:
Good to hear sounds from the airlock this morning, happily popping away.
AG37 "Out in the fields" Saison looked like it was finished after a week and up to 26°C, however 2 days after bumping it up to 27°C has prompted a bit more activity from the Belle Saison yeast. So what did I do? Raised it to 28°C!
There's more to be had.
There's more to be had.
Hi cushyno and thanks for the recipe link.
I had the good luck to be a hop raffle winner, but Keg-that had no Challenger, and neither do I.
See the attached photo for the ones I received.
I also have Fuggles and EKG's.
Can you suggest a suitable hop mixture amongst them for the different stages?
Or do I really need to buy some Challenger to get near to Golden Delicious?
That would be galling as I have all these other hops!
Attachments
@531Man I find challenger quite distinctive. Yet in this recipe it may add a little tanginess but the Styrian Goldings are doing all the work with their earthiness and hints of lemon. It doesn't look like you have Styrian Goldings, so I suggest sticking with Admiral for bittering, maybe 18g? Use EKG in place of Styrian Goldings, same amount.
I probably wouldn't bother with Vienna and Pilsner malts either, I only used them as I didn't have much pale malt left. The Graham Wheeler recipe only calls for Pale malt.
You have a decent list of hops from Keg That!
If you wanted to dabble with the final hops instead of EKG, maybe 6g of Saaz and 4g of Citra may give enough earthy citrus finish instead. It's not a punchy recipe by any means but there is a subtle fruitiness there.
A final word of warning. My efficiency was over 80%. You may need more malt to get the same gravity depending on the efficiency of your system. Wheeler recommends 3620g of pale malt and 150g of white sugar for a 23l batch.
I probably wouldn't bother with Vienna and Pilsner malts either, I only used them as I didn't have much pale malt left. The Graham Wheeler recipe only calls for Pale malt.
You have a decent list of hops from Keg That!
If you wanted to dabble with the final hops instead of EKG, maybe 6g of Saaz and 4g of Citra may give enough earthy citrus finish instead. It's not a punchy recipe by any means but there is a subtle fruitiness there.
A final word of warning. My efficiency was over 80%. You may need more malt to get the same gravity depending on the efficiency of your system. Wheeler recommends 3620g of pale malt and 150g of white sugar for a 23l batch.
Hi @cushyno,
Thanks for the helpful suggestions.
Grain: As I have lots of Pale ale malt and not much else that's not a problem!
My efficiency always turns out high too, so will only add the sugar if OG is low enough that it is needed.
Hops: Saaz and Citra look an interesting combination.
What do you think about some additional Fuggles in the mix along the way?
Please only bother to respond if that strikes you as a good idea.
I will take silence as disapproval.
I don't want to take up too much of your time.
I could of course try it both ways - but that would involve subsequent comparative beer tasting sessions.
Oh, the prospect of the hardships that home brewing brings about!
@531Man I do like fuggles though my preference is for fuggles in amber and darker beers like porter. I reckon fuggles would change the character of the recipe.
Oddly though, Styrian Goldings is alleged to have descended from fuggles rhyzomes taken to Slovenia after their native hops were wiped out by disease. Once transplanted they took on the terroir of their new land. So there are similarities, both are earthy. I find SG more towards the grassy side of earthy and fuggles can be woody and even a strong taste of mint. A quick Google suggests that fuggles left to age a little (in hot sun for a couple of days) may result in a flavour more typical of SG. I can well imagine that.
Oddly though, Styrian Goldings is alleged to have descended from fuggles rhyzomes taken to Slovenia after their native hops were wiped out by disease. Once transplanted they took on the terroir of their new land. So there are similarities, both are earthy. I find SG more towards the grassy side of earthy and fuggles can be woody and even a strong taste of mint. A quick Google suggests that fuggles left to age a little (in hot sun for a couple of days) may result in a flavour more typical of SG. I can well imagine that.
@cushyno hi and thanks for the detail and advice.
I don't think I will start trying to 'sunlight ageing' fuggles, it worries me that I might only achieve cheese and skunk flavoured beer. Yeuk. I'm after fresh hop flavours.
So I'll stick with your initial hop suggestion of final EKGs, and another brew with the alternative of Saaz and Citra, thanks.
My EKG's are locally picked by me, just down the lane over the road from my house. I am lucky to live in Kent.
If you're interested there are postings I made in the 'Hop plants/rhizomes - growing report' thread.
Hello @cushyno - well, first version of BBGD achieved today.
I did a little bit more in the hop substitution vein, along with the help of a hop comparison Web resource and my KegThat.com raffle hop list.
In the boil I used the Admiral but in equal proportions with First Gold.
Then for the 10 min. addition I used equal amounts of EKG's and First Gold again.
When straining the hopped wort into my fermentation vessel I was impressed with the Golden Delicious apple aroma - so that appears to have gone all right.
Now the true reveal; I only do hob top brewing in pans, so am limited to ~7L final volume brews.
I aimed for that using 1.21Kg of the Maris Otter Pale malt, achieved 7.25L but S.G. was 1042 so diluted with boiled water to 7.8L which makes O.G. 1039.
Yeast pitched was Wilko Nottingham (Danstar) recovered from a sort of "Homage to Summer Lightning" attempt
also using only Maris Otter Pale malt, EKG's +Fuggles, followed by EKG's and Cascade at 10 mins. and flame out, and dry hopping after 4 days. Can't wait to try that when it's carbed in-bottles and settled.
Thanks for all your guidance with this recipe.
I did a little bit more in the hop substitution vein, along with the help of a hop comparison Web resource and my KegThat.com raffle hop list.
In the boil I used the Admiral but in equal proportions with First Gold.
Then for the 10 min. addition I used equal amounts of EKG's and First Gold again.
When straining the hopped wort into my fermentation vessel I was impressed with the Golden Delicious apple aroma - so that appears to have gone all right.
Now the true reveal; I only do hob top brewing in pans, so am limited to ~7L final volume brews.
I aimed for that using 1.21Kg of the Maris Otter Pale malt, achieved 7.25L but S.G. was 1042 so diluted with boiled water to 7.8L which makes O.G. 1039.
Yeast pitched was Wilko Nottingham (Danstar) recovered from a sort of "Homage to Summer Lightning" attempt
also using only Maris Otter Pale malt, EKG's +Fuggles, followed by EKG's and Cascade at 10 mins. and flame out, and dry hopping after 4 days. Can't wait to try that when it's carbed in-bottles and settled.
Thanks for all your guidance with this recipe.
Just enjoying a lunch break from a virtual online course with a read up on beer line length and a pint of AG36 Burton Bridge Golden Delicious.
This has cleared lovely now after a month in the PB.
The fruitiness if the yeast has subsided a lot but is still there. The aroma from the Styrian Goldings hops is a delight and gives a full mouth of flavour as you take a swig. Once on the tongue the tart bitterness of challenger is immediately apparent and it lingers. Barrel dispensed so carbonation is spot on for an English golden ale.
There combined effect of the earthy SG and tartness of challenger and fruity year really does give the impression of biting into an apple. Aptly named.
I'll brew this again.
This has cleared lovely now after a month in the PB.
The fruitiness if the yeast has subsided a lot but is still there. The aroma from the Styrian Goldings hops is a delight and gives a full mouth of flavour as you take a swig. Once on the tongue the tart bitterness of challenger is immediately apparent and it lingers. Barrel dispensed so carbonation is spot on for an English golden ale.
There combined effect of the earthy SG and tartness of challenger and fruity year really does give the impression of biting into an apple. Aptly named.
I'll brew this again.
That looks just right.
You make me jealous, and yearn for a pint.
My version of AG36 won't be ready for a few weeks yet as it's only just been racked to 2°ry/condition/clean up whatever it is called. I will just have to be patient.
I don't know if you have seen the 'using old malt and hops' thread, but I put my 35y/o hops rediscovery, as a try out, in a bitter mash yesterday and poured it onto the active and hungry AG36 brew yeast.
It was obviously fermenting away well before I had finished rinsing the last of the three saucepans worth of cooled hop bed wort onto it.
Could be a disaster or surprisingly interesting outcome.
Time will tell.
After 3 and a half weeks in the FV AG37 "Out in the fields" Saison was kegged last night. Yes, I said kegged.
After bottling and using PB's for nearly 3 years I finally took the plunge into the world of kegging.
After cleaning the keg and dragging out an old suregas cylinder that has been lying in a lean-to aside the garage for over 20 years, I weighed the cylinder (1kg of gas, enough for 3 kegs), connected everything up (except for manifold until I get a donor fridge), racked off the Saison, bottled the remaining 4L, and set the pressure for 18bar, figuring that at warmish temperature - about 10°C - and needing 3 vols of co2, that would be about right.
The BrewKegTap kit just worked. No flaws, no fuss. Spot on.
I gave the keg a quick shake and heard the gas replenishing the keg, so left it be until this morning. Still at 18 bar, so good result.
The beer itself was somewhat sulphury out of the FV, a characteristic of the Belle Saison yeast, though that is already fading as I take a taste tonight. I have a good feeling that this will be a cracking pint after a couple of weeks to condition.
Allowing for cold crashing the final gravity reading was .... 1.001 !!! This second generation Belle Saison yeast is a beast! It looks like 6.8% ABV is the final figure for the kegged beer and bottles will be over 7%, again. Ah well, never mind
After bottling and using PB's for nearly 3 years I finally took the plunge into the world of kegging.
After cleaning the keg and dragging out an old suregas cylinder that has been lying in a lean-to aside the garage for over 20 years, I weighed the cylinder (1kg of gas, enough for 3 kegs), connected everything up (except for manifold until I get a donor fridge), racked off the Saison, bottled the remaining 4L, and set the pressure for 18bar, figuring that at warmish temperature - about 10°C - and needing 3 vols of co2, that would be about right.
The BrewKegTap kit just worked. No flaws, no fuss. Spot on.
I gave the keg a quick shake and heard the gas replenishing the keg, so left it be until this morning. Still at 18 bar, so good result.
The beer itself was somewhat sulphury out of the FV, a characteristic of the Belle Saison yeast, though that is already fading as I take a taste tonight. I have a good feeling that this will be a cracking pint after a couple of weeks to condition.
Allowing for cold crashing the final gravity reading was .... 1.001 !!! This second generation Belle Saison yeast is a beast! It looks like 6.8% ABV is the final figure for the kegged beer and bottles will be over 7%, again. Ah well, never mind
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