Can suppliers?

[Sput]

I've been getting into canning over the last year and I love it!

Anyone have recommendations for a good can supplier please? I use 330ml aluminium 202 cans. They seem to go out of stock fairly frequently and also the care taken when packing makes a big difference to the proportion of cans that arrive trashed.

Recommendations welcome, thanks!

 

[DocAnna]

I'd be interested too... I'd love to find a supplier of the 440ml cans as well, which never seem to be available. I know I could purchase a pallet of 3000 odd cans, but that's not really the scale I'm working at!

 

[The Baron]

Why don't you canners try to get a consortium going like the Grain purchase scheme that is run my some of the forum members like Obadiah

 

[gyurmaember]

What about TMM, i have no clue about canning, but I'm eyeing with the process.

 

[Clarence]

I get canned every Friday night. Never had a supply problem. Thought that was why we brewed our own!

 

[Griff097]

How expensive is it to get into canning and how do you purge the headspace with co2?

 

[DocAnna]

How expensive is it to get into canning and how do you purge the headspace with co2?

As with all things 'it depends'...

Before the Cannular can seamer, the only available canning machines were eye wateringly expensive. The Cannular isn't inexpensive, but it is within reach of homebrew use. I purchased mine when it was offer and a couple of hundred pounds less than it now, the current price would have given me more pause tbh. Cannular Compact Semi-Auto Canning Machine

The splash guard in my view is over priced, and I use the panels of polyurethane foam that it came packaged in as an impromptu splash guard. The biggest annoyance for me is the recalibration of it, which in theory isn't necessary for many but the temperature swings winter to summer here in Scotland mean that for the tiny gap required between the rollers, that thermal expansion makes a difference, once dialled in though it is a dream to use, fill, add a lid, press a button, done.

Regarding the CO2 purging, since there's little to no headspace in a can, you cap on foam or onto liquid itself, it is much less of an issue than with bottling. I chill down my beers to as low as the fridge can take them, give the cans a burst of CO2 from a fill tap to the bottom of the can then fill either straight from the kegerator tap or a party tap with a length of 3/8 tubing to the base of the can, then cap and seam. If I haven't chilled down further than usual, it still works to can usually though there might be some extra foam. It is fast and fuss free, and I'm a bit of a fan of it. My few annoyances are not being able to find the 440ml cans which I'd like to use, that my adhesive labels seem to crinkle up after being applied, and that my canning machine is on the other side of the garage from the kegerator which means I have to carefully carry full cans between the two.

 

[Griff097]

As with all things 'it depends'...

Before the Cannular can seamer, the only available canning machines were eye wateringly expensive. The Cannular isn't inexpensive, but it is within reach of homebrew use. I purchased mine when it was offer and a couple of hundred pounds less than it now, the current price would have given me more pause tbh. Cannular Compact Semi-Auto Canning Machine

The splash guard in my view is over priced, and I use the panels of polyurethane foam that it came packaged in as an impromptu splash guard. The biggest annoyance for me is the recalibration of it, which in theory isn't necessary for many but the temperature swings winter to summer here in Scotland mean that for the tiny gap required between the rollers, that thermal expansion makes a difference, once dialled in though it is a dream to use, fill, add a lid, press a button, done.

Regarding the CO2 purging, since there's little to no headspace in a can, you cap on foam or onto liquid itself, it is much less of an issue than with bottling. I chill down my beers to as low as the fridge can take them, give the cans a burst of CO2 from a fill tap to the bottom of the can then fill either straight from the kegerator tap or a party tap with a length of 3/8 tubing to the base of the can, then cap and seam. If I haven't chilled down further than usual, it still works to can usually though there might be some extra foam. It is fast and fuss free, and I'm a bit of a fan of it. My few annoyances are not being able to find the 440ml cans which I'd like to use, that my adhesive labels seem to crinkle up after being applied, and that my canning machine is on the other side of the garage from the kegerator which means I have to carefully carry full cans between the two.

Thanks for the detailed reply Anna, is it the lack of washing bottles that makes you prefer canning as otherwise it seems a similar process?
Also I am guessing you can't can from the fermenter?
Yes at £700 for the machine, it is a bit of a luxury I guess.

 

[Mayor of Simpleton]

I love canning. I also recently bought the Cannular when it was on offer at BKT. It was a bit of a pain to set up the rollers but once you have that done, it's a breeze. Weirdly it's so much easier than bottling. It's also quick.

I fill my cans using a Tapcooler counter pressure filler connected directly to a keg with 3/8 tubing. I first purge the can with CO2 and then fill the can, cap and seam.

One good thing about the Tapcooler is that you can get an attachment that enables you to purge and fill the can with CO2 without loss. Good for NEIPSs if you want to prevent oxygen ingress

Like DocAnna, I also cap on foam. I don't bother to chill my beers beyond the 11c temperature they are stored at in my kegerator though.

 

[DocAnna]

Like DocAnna, I also cap on foam. I don't bother to chill my beers beyond the 11c temperature they are stored at in my kegerator though.

I chill to -1 to -3 for canning or bottling which means you don't need to counterpressure fill, just purge the can with cold CO2. It makes life a lot simpler (that tap cooler counter pressure filler was ouch expensive last I looked)

 

[Mayor of Simpleton]

Yes, it is expensive, £95 for the filler.

 

[RoomWithABrew]

Around the topic
https://williamswarn.co.nz/products/brewbottler-gen2
I have two of these, genuine counter pressure bottle filling from keg or pressure fermenter. Hardly any waste of beer or mess, works on all kinds of bottles including PET bottles and it's quick. Bottles are easy to get and should last ages!

I use one for normal beers and the other for brett beers.

I looked at canning and the semi automatic with guard and spacer is about a $1000 ( so about 500 pounds).
Cans are a dollar each for 500ml cans ( so 50 pence ).

So my first 200 cans would cost 6 dollars each!! The most expensive hazy I've made was only 65 pence per 500ml.

I'd go for canning if the cannular was bought in a cooperative, but I could still get a lot of cans done by a microbrewery here for much less than the cost.

That said I do like these cans very convenient and easy in 20 litre size.

 

[DocAnna]

@RoomWithABrew The last cans I purchased worked out at 17.5p each, and the semiautomatic cannular doesn't require a spacer for the can holder. I also paid a lot less for the canner than currently quoted. That's not to say it isn't a luxury item.... which it is just a bit. It does mean that I can package as an when required with about a minute's notice, without having to have a 'bottling session'. It's not perfect though, and I miss sometimes having a few bottles of something I've forgotten about at the bottom of a stack of crates.

 

[Obadiah Boondoggle]

https://www.staffordshirebrewery.co.uk/cans-lids-boxes/
We've dealt with Staffs Brewery in the past - not for cans though

They were very helpful

 

[Mayor of Simpleton]

I have found that I am sending a lot more beers out to family and friends since I started canning. It's such convenient packaging. At the moment I am typically canning a dozen or so from a keg. It is a luxury item though.

I agree with DocAnna, that it's quick to do and it's easy to chuck a few beers into cans if you are going somewhere.

 

[The Baron]

Could one of you canners make a tutorial for other members as some may be thinking of spending some Chrimbo money received on machines etc.
If I could convince SWMBO I would like one of these even though it goes against the Yorkshiremans bible of if you don't need it don't get it(even Yorkshirefolk like luxuries)

 

[Sput]

https://www.staffordshirebrewery.co.uk/cans-lids-boxes/
We've dealt with Staffs Brewery in the past - not for cans though

They were very helpful

Thanks very much for this recommendation.

They had cans in stock, were friendly and helpful and sent them well packaged (I think, I confess I haven't got round to opening them yet to check for wastage) in super-quick time.

I usually use the Malt Miller (as also recommended above) but they are/were out of stock... I love TMM though, use em for pretty much everything.

 

[Sput]

Thanks for the replies to this - and apologies for starting the thread and then going awol...

Happy to answer questions etc re canning if helpful. I agree with everything DocAnna and others said above. I use the semi-auto Cannular together with a Duofiller. I've had plenty of challenges to deal with, but it's all part of the fun. And once surmounted, the end product is excellent.

 

[DocAnna]

I've finally ordered some new cans after hunting round to find some at a reasonable price. The Maltmiller has the black ones at 31p each including lids and shipping for 330ml can. This is pretty good and I've just ordered a box though would have preferred the 440ml cans, though these are a struggle to find at any reasonable price at the moment. I've previously used silver cans, but hey, I can work with black.

Now I need to work out how to bring my canner closer to the CO2 supply as at the moment they are on the other side of the garage. I have an old trolley which I'm thinking of repurposing as a canning trolley.

 

[Druncan]

WARNING - Canning spoiler post
(Don't want to offend, just asking a question)

Contrast the enthusiasm on this thread for canning with what is being forced on Scottish brewers who can and bottle with our Deposit Return Scheme. Actually starts registration today! this explains the scheme; Producers | Scottish Environment Protection Agency (SEPA)

However, the idea to me is environmentally sound. I hate the idea of my brewing increasing our volume of avoidable waste.

A core part of my business is that I will never put my brews in bottles or cans.
(So I escape the DRS by using 23L Kegs, 30L kegs, 5L re-usable HDPE JC, and 2pt compostable pouches OK.)

I just wondered, How do you as brewers justify canning? or do you just not consider this?