Camera and Photography questions

[BrewStew]

This ones for all you happy snappers here.

I do alot of architectural CGI's like this one:

but now i think i'm going to start getting more and more full site CGI requests, and the boss and i are investing hardware for the job, ie cameras, tripods and really accurate GPS devices.

What i'm looking to do is to go to the site, take photos of 5 views, north, south, west and east, and one straight up... then map this to a skybox in my 3d scene so that when i render the scene, you get an accurate backdrop of the surroundings to the site... which makes it great from both a planning and selling point of view because it's a truer representation.

the problem is i need to know EXACTLY where the camera was stood to take the photos, ie the GPS co-ordinates, and the height above sea level so i can position the skybox in just the right place, and i need the camera to be exactly level, and at true angles to north, south, east and west. it's accuracy is really important cos we could get sued if we say this house doesnt obscure something, then it gets built and it does :shock:

this also needs to be the case when i to photo montages. the problem i have is i dont know the direction/elevation the camera was at when it was used... so it's all guesswork at the moment and takes ages to the get structures to match the photo.

any ideas on what products (if any) can do this all in one? obviously using a compass, GPS, spirit level and a camera on a tripod in seperate pieces is possible, but it's still likely something could go far enough out to cause issues.

cheers lads

 

[Aleman]

BS, Most of the DSLRs on the market will connect to a GPS device ( I know the Sony ones do . . . But I think thats only for the Sony GPS device), and this gets recorded into the EXIF data in the image file . . . . Not sure about altitude (Elevation??)

Look at the good Manfrotto tripods , and if you need to be really accurate with Tripods get a Geared head. These come with a built in Bubble level so leveling the camera is easy.

There are several attachments that fit on camera/tripod that enable the center of the lens to be the rotation point for panoramics . .. Speedgraphic do several

If you are looking at accurate architectural images then you need a Tilt/Shift lens which restricts you to Canon DSLR's (Nikon may do one not sure)

I'll put some links in to suitable gadgets when I get home

 

[Aleman]

Ok the ultimate Tripod head for Panoramics is this Novoflex one although there is this one from Manfrotto That is bloody good.

Tripod well There is the 058 or the 161 from Manfrotto which are excellent but damned heavy so only really any good if you can drive to the location. If you are walking then there is the 190 Which is much lighter, but not as rock solid.

Tilt and Shift Lenses are not cheap, but at least you would eliminate those converging verticals on that image )

I'm fairly sure canon have some software that allows you to connect to a Canon DSLR with a notebook and get all the information you require but I'm not a Canonista so don't have a full idea on the range/abilities. You might want to talk to Calumet about whats available (Calumet are a professional tog supplier so are a better option that the spotty 'erk in Joesoaps)

I do think though that you are going to be looking at buying it all in pieces.

 

[BrewStew]

wow that's great stuff mate thanks! :thumb:

i've found a couple of DSLR's with built in GPS... not sure if they take sea level into account though :hmm: but those tripod heads are exactly what i was thinking of :thumb: espcially as it gives you the angle of elevation and angle of rotation which will make it easier to work out which way the camera was pointing when i set the camera up in my 3d scene

have you ever seen a tripod with both a built in spirit level AND compass? cos i reckon that's the solution

 

[Aleman]

I do know that the GPS in my PDA (HP6915W) does do Altitude if it gets enough satellite fixes.

Sprit level and Compass . . . problem is that the nearby steel fittings can affect the needle . . . even non magnetic bolts will affect the magnet . . .

 

[BrewStew]

pda phones tend not to be accurate enough... my MDA Vario 3 is only accurate on elevation to 5 meters... i need it to 0.1m at least

good point on the compass though. i did find a tripod with a compass built in... lost the link though :evil:

 

[Aleman]

pda phones tend not to be accurate enough... my MDA Vario 3 is only accurate on elevation to 5 meters... i need it to 0.1m at least

I don't think aircraft altimeters are that accurate :shock: but if that is the accuracy you need then I suspect that you are going to have to look at an altimeter of some sort . . . Then there is the question of calibrating it . . . which means driving to the sea side, and reseting sea level on it . . . then driving to site, and hope the barometric pressure hasn't changed while you have been driving :twisted:

 

[BrewStew]

some of the hi tech surveying equipment around i believe is even more accurate than that :wha:

 

[MEB]

The GPS thing is easy as all the top brands now have gps capability. Altitude is going to be hard and expensive. Even the best GPS unit's i know off don't do 0.1m increments in altitude. Accurate to a meter is normal. As Aleman suggests you'll probably find these v expensive and time consuming to calibrate. But a good gps like used by search parties and the like may be what you need. Just buy a decent compass. £20 will get you a good one and take a reading of the camera direction with it. Easy, done in a second or two.
You won't need a Pano tripod as you say you'll just be taking 5 shots. I'm presuming these will be like the image you supplied. Ie a straight on image of x side of the house. Pano tripods are really expensive. A good tripod is essential though. I've killed all top brands of tripod in the field-Manfrotto, gitzo and slick. So i'm not recommending a tripod(currently i've got a Manfrotto Carbon). But use a tripod for EVERY shot.
Go with Sony, Canon or Nikon. All the same(more or less) just with slightly different ways of layout for the controls. I prefer Nikon cos that's what i started out with.

I'd suggest shooting in Aperture Priority mode, setting it to f/8 and letting the cam sort out the rest. ALWAYS shoot in RAW. Then you haven't gotta worry about whie balance. You can sort that in PS on first image and use it for the other 4 images so you've got identical white balance between the images.

There's my 2 cents worth.

 

[EskiBrew]

This ones for all you happy snappers here.

Bl@@dy hell :shock: That's well impressive!

 

[Aleman]

Bl@@dy hell :shock: That's well impressive!

I reckon that wall on the LHS is out by around 6 feet top to bottom

Bloomin converging verticals

Nicely rendered image though

 

[Wez]

I'd say in 2 days that lawn wants mowing

 

[BrewStew]

:lol:

Aleman, Personally I think converging verticals are better in architectural photos. when you're stood at the foot of a skyscraper and look up, it doesnt go up perfectly straight does it? i know it's not the done thing, but i prefer to be different by having a more natural look

MEB, no i wont be taking photos of houses straight on, when i've got an empty site, i want to take photos of the surroundings at 90' angles to north... this makes it easy to position the "skybox". when doing photo montages, i'll be taking photos best suited to showing off the "new" super imposed building, so this is where it's really crucial i know the angle from north and the angle the camera is pointing up (or down) along with it's elevation above sea level as i've had some real hard trouble getting the camera in my 3d scene to match the photo with topographically challenging sites.

eskimobob, that's not even the final image .

wez, what is it with everyone saying the grass is too long? :lol: i've had nearly everyone saying that at work, but when i make it shorter it looks crap

 

[MEB]

I don't think you'll need a pano mount or tripod though. A standard good quality tripod will be fine.

Surely you can work the angles out? :shock: I didn't 'attend' school too much :whistle: and even i can remember protractors and the like. :lol:

You've got a fun job mate. There needs to be a super cool icon for here...

 

[BrewStew]

i can work them out, yes. but it's never accurate enough and i still end up tweaking the 3D camera for god knows how many hours to get it to look right, and even then i'm not 100% certain it's right. it would just be nice to take a photo, note the GPS position and angles and set the 3d camera up with just a few clicks and numbers punched in

it's fun but super tight deadlines. that image you see before you would normally have to be done and out the door in 8 hours flat from start to finish :shock: fortunately that's a pilot to grab clients, so i'm spending a long time on it getting the materials and lighting just right. when i eventually have time to finish it i'll post it

 

[MEB]

You wouldn't want your job to be boring would you?

That'd take a month to get done here. :lol: Longer if it was game fishing season. :lol:

 

[BrewStew]

:lol:

the kiwi's do take a more relaxed view when it comes to work dont they? :) dont get me wrong, i'm not complaining, but having a little more time would let me put more artistic flare into it and the final image result would be better... it's still fun though even if it's usually done in a hurry... i dont like screaming at my rendering box to hurry up... she doesn't like it

 

[MEB]

I'm with Aleman though on the left side perspective, it's too much. I've got some pic's from landscaping work i done and one house in particular looked the same and i had a pic of it from virtually the same angle. Not saying i could do better because i simply couldn't but just a critique from my eye. :)

I look forward to seeing the finished image.

Still think you've got a great job

 

[BrewStew]

are you saying more or less of the side elevation shown? if you think it needs more i'm worried it'll detract from the front elevation too much, and that's the elevation that sells it... if you're on about panning the camera to the right to make the side elev less visible then i see your point cheers! :thumb:

will be a while with the finished image.. too busy doing industrial & edicational renders and residential CAD work atm. but i'll be sure to post it for more crits :thumb:

you might catch a glimpse of the render of the music school shaped like a saxophone i'm working on when it's done and put on our website

 

[Vossy1]

That bloody grass needs cutting before you start worrying about elevations :rofl: