Bittering hops question

[bramswell]

When using hops for bittering is it correct to assume that most of the flavour is lost due to the boil (90mins for me)
if this is correct would it be poss to use a high AA hop just for bittering then aroma and flavour hop of what ever the recipe calls for? without altering the overall flavour of the beer

has anyone experimented with this, as i figure it would save a little money on bittering hops.

the reason i ask is i get EKG for £2.95 for 250grms @ 6AA
and alot of the recipes are using challenger which cost £5.75 for 100g @ 5.1AA

 

[ano]

I can only speak for myself here, but I wouldn't do a recipe if I didn't have the ingredients it called for. If i sub'd anything in, it might come close but it wouldn't be the same recipe. I guess high AA varieties were created to cater for the higher AA yield per hectare advantages, but if you want a 'traditional' ale they won't be in it.

As to whether it would taste the same, I can't say from experience but would have thought that kettle hops add more than just IBUs otherwise hop extract would be fine.

 

[Greg]

Hi there,

There's not that much difference between those 2 hops so I can't see that it will alter the flavour too much. It will obviously be slightly different as they are different hops but it will be fairly similar. East Kent Goldings are a very traditional English Ale hop and not considered a high alpha hop.

Just adjust the weight to get the same EBU.

Calculations here is you don't know how to work it out.

 

[ano]

Sorry, I thought you were looking to substitute Goldings or Challenger for some of the American hops with 10+% AA.

 

[tubby_shaw]

It is generally accepted that the initial hops added at the start contribute bitterness but not a lot in the way of flavour or aroma.
Hops added for the last 30 to 15 minutes add flavour and hops added after the boil is over add aroma :thumb:

Commercial breweries regularly substitute bittering hops but will keep the flavour and aroma hops as constant as possible.
I always use high alpha hops for bittering, I am using Magnum at 15% aa atm but have some Lunga at 11% aa coming :party:
I will then add flavour hops and then aroma hops.
I brew my house pale ale with differing bittering hops but always use the same flavour and aroma hops with no noticeable difference in the end product :thumb:

 

[bramswell]

Thanks TS

thats the sort of reply i was hoping for, research says it shouldn't make any noticable difference, but until someone says they had done it and confirms it, you never know if you should try and maybe waste a days work and a brew coz it ends up tasting like ****.

 

[jamesb]

It can make a difference, although I doubt bigger breweries care. Example - the bitterness from a hop like Brewers Gold is a very smooth bitterness with no harshness at all, whereas Target has a very harsh bitterness and is usually used sparingly.

 

[Aleman]

I've been using Pacific Gem at 18% Alpha in a lot of my beers for the initial bittering, and generally you cannot taste it (15-25g in 100L is not that much really :lol:) . . . . I do find however that there are certain styles where I am less successful in getting away with it . . Bohemian Pilsners is a prime example . . . My current version has a nice clean bitterness . . . but there is a, rather pleasant, woody berry taste that is completely out of style.

Certainly exchanging Challenger for Goldings shouldn't be a major issue . . . As James B says though Target :sick: is best reserved for bittering stouts where you don't use a lot and you use it early :lol:

 

[tubby_shaw]

I love Target hops both the flavour and the aroma :party:
But then again I love marmite, scampi fries, roquefort cheese, pickled gherkins, wasabi etc :lol:

 

[bramswell]

Can some of the harshness be removed by First Wort Hopping?
i think i read that some where but can't find it again

 

[jamesb]

Can some of the harshness be removed by First Wort Hopping?
i think i read that some where but can't find it again

FWH is meant to keep more of the flavour and produce a smoother bitterness - something that seems to work going by my experiments.

 

[tubby_shaw]

I love Target hops both the flavour and the aroma :party:
But then again I love marmite, scampi fries, roquefort cheese, pickled gherkins, wasabi etc :lol:

I think I may have stumbled on the ideal sandwich filling :grin:

 

[bramswell]

[quote="tubby_shaw":1z3m2dfy]I love Target hops both the flavour and the aroma :party:
But then again I love marmite, scampi fries, roquefort cheese, pickled gherkins, wasabi etc :lol:

I think I may have stumbled on the ideal sandwich filling :grin:[/quote:1z3m2dfy]
:lol:
I had marmite and salad cream sandwich the other day and it was very nice. :?