Beer Kits Vs Raw Ingredients for a newby

[Mawsenio]

I love real ale and have recently gravitated towards the hoppier styles such as Oakham Citra and DarkStar Hoppy Head. The problem is I'm now hooked on vindaloos in a world of kormas....TT Landlord, a great pint, now seems to lack the kick I've got used to.

I've never homebrewed before. I've been reading up and think I understand as much as I can until I actually mash in for the first time but essentially I know nothing. What's confusing me is the different products available from raw ingredients to extract kits and I'm not sure which are good and which will turn into something that will send me down the pub for a real pint.

Ultimately I want to create my own beers using raw malt and calculating my own hop additions but for the time being I'm wondering if beer kits are the best way to start. Coopers kits look like you get grain and hops so you need to mash in to get a wort before boiling etc. extract kits I guess go straight to the boiling stage (some of them aren't clear as to what you get and what you need to do)

Can anyone tell me what these kits are really like to brew with and to drink?

1) Is using a Coopers or Muntons beer kit real home brewers do or are they for fools who aren't really serious? I'm paranoid there will be some homebrewers' snobbery against these sort of things :-) Are they a serious product you guys use or more a gift idea for male relatives?

2) DO they work? I guess the recipies might not be great but are they at least drinkable?

3) Which packs are best? As much as I like the idea of getting 25kg of Maris Otter etc. and making my own recipies some of these packs basically seem to be pre-weighed ingredients (obviously). Do they make me less of a brewer? Is the enjoyment in the production of beer (like cooking to a recipe) or the invention of your own beers.

4) Malt vs Extract? Seems to me that boiling and adding hops then waiting a couple of weeks to ferment and condition misses out most of the fun. That said, is it worth it to ensure a good wort as this looks to be a challenge for homebrewers?

Basically if experienced homebrewers don't use these kits I might as well jump strainght in the deep end, fowl-up more but learn faster. Any insight you may have would be a tremendous help.

Cheers

 

[bobsbeer]

Welcome : While I understand your enthusiasm, slow down a bit.

Coopers starter kits are a good place to start as you get everything you need to get brewing. But for info they are not 'all grain', as the kit comes with a tin of concentrated malt that doesn't need to be boiled, but the result is a good beer. In fact kits are a good way to start and most kits these days will not have that 'homebrew' taste. Woodfordes Wherry is also another good kit and worth a try. So don't for one moment think you are not a brewer if you start with kits. Once you get going then you can become more adventurous and progress onto other methods of brewing. And there are loads of very knowledgeable brewers on the forum as well How To's.

 

[graysalchemy]

I agree with Bob. When I started out I did extract brews then went onto all grain. However I had brewed kits in the 90's so I had some understanding of the process and brewing. Personally I would start with a few kits to get a feel for the fermentation side of things, hone those skills first then move onto extract brewing before jumping into all grain.

All grain obviously offers you the greatest amount of control of what you brew, but whatever you do you will have wonderful beer. One of the best beers I had over the last few years was a bottle from a kit beer given to me by a fellow forum member, it was so good I thought it was All grain. :thumb: :thumb:

 

[evanvine]

You're really a kit man aren't you Alistair!
That's why you're a 'secret' brewer!! :twisted: :whistle:

 

[Vossy1]

Moved to this section as more relevant :thumb:

The problem is I'm now hooked on vindaloos in a world of kormas....TT Landlord, a great pint, now seems to lack the kick I've got used to.

:rofl: you are not alone :lol:
If I were you M, I'd see if there are any home brewers in your area and see if you can go along for a brew day. If you're into highly hopped beers (I am too) you will find it hard to achieve those results from kits without 'fettling'...and if you're going to 'fettle' might as well try grain in one form or another.
Have you seen/had a read of the 'how to' posts ?

 

[Will12283]

I brew kits but I'm looking to start move it extract, with AG bring the future plan.

I will always brew kits, be it to just get some beer going without using the time needed for other ways, or just to make something I would do often.

I found with brewing that you have to do what best fits around the time you have.

 

[borischarlton]

Hi

Read this article, whist as a now relatively experienced brewer I can see flaws, it is how I started and it made beer that tasted like beer and certainly wasn't "homebrew"

http://www.selfsufficientish.co.uk/main ... real-hops/

Just use one pack of dry yeast, not the 20g suggested!

Rob

 

[Sandimas]

I brew mainly Extract these days but still do kits, as has been said above sometimes you just don't have the time, so need something that fits in with your lifestyle. I too like hoppy ales but I've yet to find a really hoppy kit, most seem to err on the maltier side, so you may be a bit disappointed if you start with them.

Guess it depends on how confident you feel: the kits do allow you to learn the basics with less variables, but a simple Extract brew can be as simple as one extra stage, boiling up the hops. You don't say where you're located, but if you're anywhere near Cheltenham, Pops Homebrew do some amazing Extract kits with 2 x tins Liquid Malt Extract plus hops pre-measured in muslin bags. Alternatively, BrewUK do similar Extract kits but using Dried Malt Extract, which can be a bit fiddlier.

If you like Oakham Citra, I can thoroughly recommend this one:
http://www.brewuk.co.uk/store/beerkits/ ... citra.html

 

[rpt]

I would say definitely do a kit for your first brew. It allows you to get the fermentation and bottling/kegging process sorted out without needing much equipment or time. Then you can get the equipment you need to do it from grain, if that's where you want to go. Even if you can't find the kit for the exact style you want, it's somewhere to start.

 

[joe1002]

I agree with the above, get some kits under your belt, learn fermentation, sanitising, temp control etc then move on to extract, BIAB or 3 vessel all grain.

I have never brewed these kits but the Evil Dog and Four Finger kits from Bulldog might appeal to you. <<<Clicky>>> :thumb:

 

[The Ostrich]

I brew Kits (moving to BIAB in the new year).

I use the more expensive 2 can kits and they are very good indeed. I think that the extra tenner is well worth it considering you are investing 2 months labour on it.

If you like you Oakham Citra (my local brewery btw) then I would recommend the Festival Golden Stag Summer Ale. It is a real lip smacker! and a world of difference from the malty, sweet (but nice) Woodfordes Wherry.

Even with kits there is room for 'tweaks'.... different yeasts, dry hopping, others will have suggestions.

I say it's a great way to start.

D

 

[Dave1970]

I'd go for a decent 2 can kit of a fairly pale brew, something like Bulldog's IPA or St Peters IPA and then dry hop it, probably with something like Citra or Cascade.
Dry hopping is pretty straightforward it just involves putting whole hops into your brew after the vigorous stage of the ferment has finished (or in a secondary). They go in a mesh bag / piece of muslin and are weighted down. This will mainly add aroma.
You could also make a hop tea, boil up some hops in water and then use that water to make up the kit with - this will add a mix of bitterness and aroma depending how long you boil them for.

EDIT: or you could 'cheat' and add this to a kit

 

[Mawsenio]

Thanks for all the responses. I live in macclesfield so will look out for a good brew club, there's a guy who has a market stall on fridays (where I first saw thesew kits) and we're right in microbrewery country so I'm sure I can find the local scene.

From what you guys have said these kits are good enough so I'm going buy a couple of the ones recommended and get started. No doubt I'll post a few questions on here as I go

:

 

[clibit]

OK, devil's advocate, alternative side of the debate.....I would go straight to AG!

It's really easy, and the beer is loads better. You want your first beer to make you buzz when you take that first taste. I did occasional kits over a period of 30 years and was never inspired to do the next one. First AG -BANG!! I can't stop. All it involves that kits don't is soaking some grains and then boiling the liquid with some hops in it and cooling it down. You get a beer you own, freshly brewed from fresh ingredients. Not a frozen microwave meal, a dish you prepared from scratch with the best ingredients you could find!

 

[dx4100]

In my opinion....

By doing a beer kit you will learn the basics on how to ferment beer and how to bottle / keg beer. If you take you time and make no mistakes you will end up with 40 bottles of something which kind of resembles beer but is nothing like the real thing.

I did maybe about 6 kits before moving on to All Grain and not one was any good. The smell, taste and mouth feel was just terrible.

Tried both Premium (Two Can) and normal (One can) kits. Woodfords, St Peters to Wilkos etc... All garbage and nothing like the real thing.

Yet if you read the kit brew section you will find every review almost saying they produce decent brews so go figure.

To be frank... There is a reason why I will be spending 5 1/2 brewing on Monday morning and then hours cleaning up and bottling... If kits produced good beer then all grain would be pointless waste of time.

(not expecting to make friends with this post :P )

Go straight to All Grain is my suggestion if you like GOOD beer... I now produce beer above and beyond what I can buy... or at least just as good....

 

[dx4100]

OK, devil's advocate, alternative side of the debate.....I would go straight to AG!

It's really easy, and the beer is loads better. You want your first beer to make you buzz when you take that first taste. I did occasional kits over a period of 30 years and was never inspired to do the next one. First AG -BANG!! I can't stop. All it involves that kits don't is soaking some grains and then boiling the liquid with some hops in it and cooling it down. You get a beer you own, freshly brewed from fresh ingredients. Not a frozen microwave meal, a dish you prepared from scratch with the best ingredients you could find!

Snap!! Totally agree...

I think as a community we can sometimes over state how hard all grain is. It is a really simple process as long as you spend some time researching.

I would suggest the OP looks up the batch sparge method. It is so easy and actually quite difficult to get wrong. Even if you made a mistake the chances of having good beer at the end is high.

If your aim is to produce beer like you buy down the pub / festival then kits will come up short IMO.

 

[clibit]

Spot on, when I did my first AG my mate told me not to offer him any cos he doesn't like homebrew and didn't want to be rude to me. I then gave a few bottles out to other people and someone told him my beer was fantastic so he came begging. I taught him how to brew last Saturday. He has gone straight to AG, with my help of course, he wasn't interested in anything less, and I think he made the right decision. We made a beer I have done before which is brilliant. He's excited and now knows how easy it is and says he'll be fine next time. He keeps saying he doesn't want shop bought now cos the vast majority is poor compared to AG homebrew. He wanted to buy off me but I told him to make his own.

 

[chrig]

There are some very good high end two can / all malt kits, and even the cheap ones if done well make drinkable beer... They all just need plenty of time to condition in the bottle.

Get a nice hippy kit on which comes with additional hops then add some more for your taste :lol:.

That'll be just about ready for drinking when you have researched and bought your all grain kit

 

[graysalchemy]

OK, devil's advocate, alternative side of the debate.....I would go straight to AG!

It's really easy, and the beer is loads better. You want your first beer to make you buzz when you take that first taste. I did occasional kits over a period of 30 years and was never inspired to do the next one. First AG -BANG!! I can't stop. All it involves that kits don't is soaking some grains and then boiling the liquid with some hops in it and cooling it down. You get a beer you own, freshly brewed from fresh ingredients. Not a frozen microwave meal, a dish you prepared from scratch with the best ingredients you could find!

Yes it isn't hard................and so isn't the fermentation etc, but when you put it all together it can be a bit much.

I still say it is better to perfect each stage and understand what each process is doing before you go AG.

 

[Duxuk]

Try the links at the top of the page. The Homebrew Company, for one, pffer extract kits. I've made loads of extract beers and they can be fabulous :drink: In an extract kit you'll get everything you need, apart from a stockpot, FV etc. You'll find lists of everything you need right here on the forum. I think even a first timer could do an extract kit and get a really high quality brew out of it. With one or two under your belt you can start to get the component patrs of the kits and make any modifications you fancy. :