Anyone mad enough to grow their own hops?

[DocAnna]

I've certainly bought a Pioneer not that long ago (for a friend, who killed it so I can't offer cuttings), but it's the sort of thing that's hopelessly unfashionable these days - at least unfashionable enough to be available in pots in summer even if available as rhizomes in winter. I imagine that if you asked someone like A-plus ([email protected]) they should be able to sort you out, even if it means waiting until winter for rhizomes to become available.

Thank you, I take it from your reply that the pioneer hop plant was from Aplus-hops? I'm in no hurry, and it was just a thought at this stage. I was looking for pioneer as it was one of the hops tested and demonstrated to grow ok in Scotland and was relatively dwarf at up to 8 ft. I'll maybe try later in the year to get in touch with the sales team.

 

[Snoop]

Aye, it's hops on the right too. They grow up a 12ft metal pole and then from that across string to the top of a big elder. It's my allotment and it's pretty much the only shade on the plot. In all honesty i I get way too many for brewing. I dry them and decorate my shed on the left which has a beer engine set up for allotment parties.
:)

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Is it that bad an idea? i thought the movement of plant material was regulated by phytosanitary certificates and the like.

Having once been part of the machinery that is the backstop when phytosanitary certificates go wrong - I'd prefer not to rely on them. They have a place for some kinds of essential trade but bringing in British varieties of hops from the Continent is not a good use for them. Just in general, hops fall into a high-risk category - there's 1000's of acres of commercial cultivation in the UK so people's livelihoods are at risk from new diseases in a way that isn't true of most ornamentals (qv Verticillium wilt in the 1950s), they're generally quite prone to diseases/pests, and crucially the main way they are distributed is not seeds that can be easily sterilised but rhizomes which have soil attached and which can host all sorts of nasties (qv Verticillium again). Moving any kind of soil between countries, particularly from farms that are growing crops that are also grown commercially in the UK, is the nightmare of my old workplace.

From a plant health POV the only hop material that should be crossing international boundaries (or even internal boundaries, such as the one for hops between Oregon/Washington and the rest of the US) is a handful of plant cell cultures between national collections to introduce new varieties to an area - all distribution beyond that should be from the national collection to growers, keep it all within country. Places like NZ are particularly picky on that sort of thing as they don't have many of the diseases that are in hops elsewhere - the best way to control a disease is to keep it out in the first place, qv COVID-19.

I take it from your reply that the pioneer hop plant was from Aplus-hops?

I can't remember to be honest but probably, they generally have the varieties that other places don't, particularly the Wye ones. Pioneer's a good choice for rainy parts of the country just because as one of the later Wye hybrids it has more disease resistance than most.

 

[An Ankoù]

From a plant health POV the only hop material that should be crossing international boundaries (or even internal boundaries, such as the one for hops between Oregon/Washington and the rest of the US) is a handful of plant cell cultures between national collections to introduce new varieties to an area - all distribution beyond that should be from the national collection to growers, keep it all within country. Places like NZ are particularly picky on that sort of thing as they don't have many of the diseases that are in hops elsewhere - the best way to control a disease is to keep it out in the first place, qv COVID-19.

Thanks NB, for a very full and persuasive answer. As you're knowledgeable in the field, are the diseases you mention only carried in the soil associated with the rhizomes or can they be carried by the plant itself? if the latter, are imported cones and pellets treated some way to prevent contamination of local plants?
@DocAnna Please don't use hopstock.fr.

 

[ecirpian]

I’m in NW (Preston) I grew two hops last year and was disappointed they had no aroma at all. I have tradition and prima Donna, and have bought cascade and chinook this year too. This year the tradition has really taken hold and I’m hoping for some hopomatherapy in a few weeks :) and hoping for one or two brews.

They do grow fast, need a lot or water and I also feed them once a week too

1st pic is Jun 2nd just now.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Just to be clear, when I said "From a plant health POV the only hop material that should be crossing international boundaries" I was talking from the ideal perspective of what we'd like to happen, rather than what actually happens. That's close to how some countries like New Zealand work as they have a big advantage from not having hop diseases in the country.

I guess you can put pests and diseases into three categories - the ones that are known and you know you want to keep out, in human terms for the UK you would think of Ebola and rabies. So in hop terms NZ is in this position for eg downy mildew. Then there's new variants of existing diseases - like flu - where you don't know when a bad one is going to show up, but at least you know roughly how they work and how to control them. And then there's the whole new diseases like Covid where you don't know they're coming and you don't have controls, so all you can do is rely on quarantine to keep them out, and the plant equivalent of lockdown once they're in.

So that's why in theory the default is to rely on quarantine, to keep out the ones that you don't know about, but they're rare so in the real world that the rules get flexed and hence you get plant passporting. But between say the UK and Continent there's been so much exchange that all the common diseases are already shared - and stuff like new varieties of mildew will arrive in time on the wind, but my instinct is still to quarantine etc.

are the diseases you mention only carried in the soil associated with the rhizomes or can they be carried by the plant itself? if the latter, are imported cones and pellets treated some way to prevent contamination of local plants?

So again there's three main categories. There's things that rely on live plant material and die pretty quickly when they can't access it - typically viruses and aphids etc. There's things that can be carried on dead plant material like cones - typically the leaf diseases like mildew - which at least can be treated fairly easily. And then there's the soilborne stuff like Verticillium which is far more difficult as it forms spores and can be protected in the middle of lumps of dry soil. Then it can escape once the soil is wet again.

I never had any professional involvement with plant health in hops so I don't know the details of killtimes etc, but I'd imagine that just processing cones will kill most things - they're typically getting around 65°C for 6-8 hours and then vacuum packed, which should take care of any insects and I'd imagine most of the aerial nasties, presumably what's left isn't considered a significant hazard at least in the UK, but they may be more cautious when eg importing into NZ.

 

[Gobaloon]

Having once been part of the machinery that is the backstop when phytosanitary certificates go wrong - I'd prefer not to rely on them. They have a place for some kinds of essential trade but bringing in British varieties of hops from the Continent is not a good use for them. Just in general, hops fall into a high-risk category - there's 1000's of acres of commercial cultivation in the UK so people's livelihoods are at risk from new diseases in a way that isn't true of most ornamentals (qv Verticillium wilt in the 1950s), they're generally quite prone to diseases/pests, and crucially the main way they are distributed is not seeds that can be easily sterilised but rhizomes which have soil attached and which can host all sorts of nasties (qv Verticillium again). Moving any kind of soil between countries, particularly from farms that are growing crops that are also grown commercially in the UK, is the nightmare of my old workplace.

From a plant health POV the only hop material that should be crossing international boundaries (or even internal boundaries, such as the one for hops between Oregon/Washington and the rest of the US) is a handful of plant cell cultures between national collections to introduce new varieties to an area - all distribution beyond that should be from the national collection to growers, keep it all within country. Places like NZ are particularly picky on that sort of thing as they don't have many of the diseases that are in hops elsewhere - the best way to control a disease is to keep it out in the first place, qv COVID-19.



I can't remember to be honest but probably, they generally have the varieties that other places don't, particularly the Wye ones. Pioneer's a good choice for rainy parts of the country just because as one of the later Wye hybrids it has more disease resistance than most.

Hi

I thought Pioneer and all commercial dwarf varieties were restricted to the public except Prima Donna (which is less yielding than First Gold).

Aplus don’t have Pioneer on there now or for past few years. I don’t think they are protected by PVR-and if they are isn’t that a limited time anyway.
I would love to find Pioneer to grow.
Cheers.
G

 

[Northern_Brewer]

I thought Pioneer and all commercial dwarf varieties were restricted to the public except Prima Donna (which is less yielding than First Gold).

Fair point. Maybe I'm mixing it up with Phoenix - this was a good few years ago.

 

[Gobaloon]

Fair point. Maybe I'm mixing it up with Phoenix - this was a good few years ago.

Darn. Was hoping some were out there somewhere although like you said earlier if not from a dependable source, it’s always a risk to try.
Aplus are awesome.

I am interested why those older hedgerow varieties are not open to the public. I think they are just restricted to professional growers and not due to licensing or PVR (plant variety rights)…I think. Would love to know though if anyone has any insights.

cheers

G

 

[An Ankoù]

Darn. Was hoping some were out there somewhere although like you said earlier if not from a dependable source, it’s always a risk to try.
Aplus are awesome.

I am interested why those older hedgerow varieties are not open to the public. I think they are just restricted to professional growers and not due to licensing or PVR (plant variety rights)…I think. Would love to know though if anyone has any insights.

cheers

G

Why not send a plus an email asking them what the situation is?

 

[Gobaloon]

Why not send a plus an email asking them what the situation is?

Will give it a go. Cheers

 

[Guzzie]

I don't know if this will help but looking on the british hop assoc website Hop Sellers - British Hop Association there are a few companies selling hops - I do not know if they sell to the public - but why not try them.
Check out british hop association facebook page.

This website has pdfs of many varieties Hop variety technical information - Knowledge, compare or substitute

They list Pioneer hops !!

brochure attached

 

[Sandimas]

I don't know if this will help but looking on the british hop assoc website Hop Sellers - British Hop Association there are a few companies selling hops - I do not know if they sell to the public - but why not try them.

Charles Faram sell to the public, I think it maybe 1kg minimum though. They'll likely be at the Malvern Autumn Show again in a few weeks time so I'll have a look.

 

[dcbrookes]

I have bought 5Kg packs from Simply Hops (now renamed Baarth Haas. They sometimes have some bargains - I bought 5Kg of Mosaic pellets for well under £100.

 

[Craftman]

Not sure what variety mine are (got them as a cutting from my FIL) but I think they are pretty much ready to pick.
Not too bad for Tayside.

 

[DocAnna]

@Craftman that's an impressive crop and I'd really be interested in what variety that was.

Based on the research from the James Hutton institute I'm still on the hunt for Pioneer hop plants. I've emailed A Plus hop growers... and while it might be thought a bit forward, I've also emailed the James Hutton institute about where they got the plants from.

 

[alexsnow555]

View attachment 53955

The same hop grows in my area near the house. I also don’t know what kind. But I never thought of using it for brewing. Or maybe this is a good idea?