advice needed. First RO brew tomorrow

[Braufather]

I purchased 25 lites of RO water today as well as some epsom salts and yeast nutrients to add to the gypsum and Calcium Chloride i already have. Im hoping that me sorted!

I am brewing an American pale that has a bit of munich and crystal in it.(zombie dust esque) its heavily hopped with Centennial and the yeast will be either liberty bell or trusty US05.

ive put a few things into brewers friend and come up with some options but the water calculator always gets PH wrong so i dont want to put to much faith in it.

So for those that use RO regularly , can i ask as to how would you treat 23 lites of mash water for this brew?

 

[gyurmaember]

Without any science behind it, I find this water great for hoppy styles, it's might help.

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

I purchased 25 lites of RO water today as well as some epsom salts and yeast nutrients to add to the gypsum and Calcium Chloride i already have. Im hoping that me sorted!

I am brewing an American pale that has a bit of munich and crystal in it.(zombie dust esque) its heavily hopped with Centennial and the yeast will be either liberty bell or trusty US05.

ive put a few things into brewers friend and come up with some options but the water calculator always gets PH wrong so i dont want to put to much faith in it.

So for those that use RO regularly , can i ask as to how would you treat 23 lites of mash water for this brew?

If you’re using lactic acid maybe add 4ml. I am brewing with 30 litres of RO tomorrow and will add 5ml.

 

[Braufather]

I don't have any acids actually. ii have used acid malt before but dont have any to hand

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

It will still mash ok but your pH is likely to be around 5.7 give or take a point.

You will get marginal gains on efficiency, clarity, etc. with a lower pH so you might want to add a little acid in future but it’s not so critical that I’d advise you to wait.

 

[Braufather]

ive found an old bag of milled acid malt that got about 100g left. its about 6 months old but has been left open so not sure whether id be better just leaving it.

also reading up on it i was thinking of adding 1g of sea salt. anybody do this?

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

ive found an old bag of milled acid malt that got about 100g left. its about 6 months old but has been left open so not sure whether id be better just leaving it.

also reading up on it i was thinking of adding 1g of sea salt. anybody do this?

The acid malt probably won’t make much difference.

I use rock salt rather than sea salt. A bit of sodium helps to round out the flavour and mouthfeel.

 

[Braufather]

i'll chuck maybe 1g in then.

 

[scrap iron]

I don't know what size your batch is but you will lose about 1/2 quart of water per pound of grain to absorption in the grains. For a typical 5 gal recipe of 10 pounds grain that is 1 1/4 gals . At 6 gals leaves you with 4 3/4 gals left. If your batch is smaller you might be ok but you might need more water if a 5 gals batch. At a common ratio of 1 1/4 qts per pound grain is about 3 1/8 gals for the mash leaving a little under 3 gals for the sparge. As far a water treatment for APA I would start at about 150ppm sulfate and 55 ppm chloride, you can add more sulfate if you like. check out this article and Bru n water has a treasure trove of info and a free spreadsheet to calculate water treatment that is pretty accurate.
Pale Ale Brewing | Bru'n Water (brunwater.com)

 

[Braufather]

cheers, ill check that link out, ive been switching back and fro between the light and hoppy profile and balanced profile on brewers freind but will check this one out. i have an all in one system mash with 23 litres of water, grain bill is about 5,5kg, and its a regular 20 litre/5 gallon brew

 

[Braufather]

I don't know what size your batch is but you will lose about 1/2 quart of water per pound of grain to absorption in the grains. For a typical 5 gal recipe of 10 pounds grain that is 1 1/4 gals . At 6 gals leaves you with 4 3/4 gals left. If your batch is smaller you might be ok but you might need more water if a 5 gals batch. At a common ratio of 1 1/4 qts per pound grain is about 3 1/8 gals for the mash leaving a little under 3 gals for the sparge. As far a water treatment for APA I would start at about 150ppm sulfate and 55 ppm chloride, you can add more sulfate if you like. check out this article and Bru n water has a treasure trove of info and a free spreadsheet to calculate water treatment that is pretty accurate.
Pale Ale Brewing | Bru'n Water (brunwater.com)

From that link- This surprised me, i thought RO water would need acid to reduce ph but this seem to suggest the opposite?

.....Be aware that when you add a bunch of gypsum to low alkalinity water like RO, it is likely that you will HAVE to add some alkalinity to the mashing water to keep the mash pH from dropping too low. For hoppy beers, targeting a mash pH of 5.4 does improve the hop expression. If the pH is much lower than that, the expression WILL suffer.

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

From that link- This surprised me, i thought RO water would need acid to reduce ph but this seem to suggest the opposite?

.....Be aware that when you add a bunch of gypsum to low alkalinity water like RO, it is likely that you will HAVE to add some alkalinity to the mashing water to keep the mash pH from dropping too low. For hoppy beers, targeting a mash pH of 5.4 does improve the hop expression. If the pH is much lower than that, the expression WILL suffer.

For a dark beer this is true (dark malt is acidic). For a pale malt not so much.

This is the pH from my brew today using 30 litres RO dosed with 5ml lactic acid. Malt was Pilsner.

 

[scrap iron]

Calcium salts, crystal malts, roasted malts, acid and acid malts all drive the ph lower. Bicarbonate, carbonate and lime [pickling salt] raise ph. You have to account for your malts also. If you use a lot of gypsum and need to raise ph baking soda is a good additive as it adds some sodium. If you add salt use iodine free [kosher] and you will have to account for any sodium in baking soda too. I think a ph of 5.3 to 5.4 works for me in pale beers. Read the water knowledge page at bru n water, it's very informative.
General 5 | Bru'n Water (brunwater.com)

 

[scrap iron]

Yes, it depends on the malts, acids and salts added. I find with my water profiles I only need acids with the very light color beers, Pils Blondes etc. And bicarb with the dark beers, Porters Stouts etc.

 

[Braufather]

Salts:​	Salts Added to Mash Only
↓ Lowers pH and ↑ Raises pH
↓ Gypsum:​	8g
↓ Epsom Salt:​	4g
↓ Canning/Other Salt:​
↓ Calcium Chloride (dihydrate):​	2.5g
↓ Calcium Chloride (anhydrous):​
↓ Magnesium Chloride:​
↑ Chalk:​
↑ Baking Soda:​	1g
↑ Slaked Lime:​
↑ Lye:​

 

[Braufather]

so I have ended up with the above added to 23 litres of RO for the mash.

How does that look?

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

so I have ended up with the above added to 23 litres of RO for the mash.

How does that look?

That should get you somewhere around 5.6, maybe just a tad lower.

 

[Braufather]

cheers.

 

[Braufather]

Ended up with a mash ph of 4.85. Too late to fix it but at least I know for next time to but back on additions.

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

Ended up with a mash ph of 4.85. Too late to fix it but at least I know for next time to but back on additions.

How did that happen?