Yeast starters, oxygen and light

[strange-steve]

My US-O5 starter has really taken off but I'm trying to harvest the yeast from a bottle conditioned Fuller's, there seems to be a lot less activity. Was hoping to brew with it on the weekend so there's still time for a contingency if needed. I have some S-04 in the fridge I can pitch, but that needs a starter too and I should probably get it on latest tomorrow if needed.

Anyway the Fuller's yeast - it seems that the amount of dead yeast on the bottom has increased since it was in the bottle but there is no krausen. Maybe I'm just being impatient.

You mention US05 and S04, are these harvested from previous brews? If not then they don't need a starter, dry yeast should only be rehydrated with water.
Also harvesting yeast from a bottle conditioned beer can take a while, did you start off small and build up the starter size gradually with the Fullers yeast?

 

[BeerCat]

I was listening to John Palmer last night saying how a 1l starter in a 2l bottle is perfect. You can shake the bottle and get a really good amount of oxygen in there. He says you really need the same amount of oxygen in your wort and obviously shaking 20l is not practical so use an air stone.

 

[jceg316]

You mention US05 and S04, are these harvested from previous brews? If not then they don't need a starter, dry yeast should only be rehydrated with water.
Also harvesting yeast from a bottle conditioned beer can take a while, did you start off small and build up the starter size gradually with the Fullers yeast?

They are harvested from previous brews, kept in my fridge until I need them again.

I started off the Fuller's by decanting the beer apart from the last couple of centimetres, then poured in about 100ml of wort (made from DME). After a couple of days I poured that into a 2 litre starter, which is the one sitting in my kitchen.

 

[MyQul]

They are harvested from previous brews, kept in my fridge until I need them again.

I started off the Fuller's by decanting the beer apart from the last couple of centimetres, then poured in about 100ml of wort (made from DME). After a couple of days I poured that into a 2 litre starter, which is the one sitting in my kitchen.

Like SS says you ideally need to build the starter up gradually from harvested bottle. I use 5 step up when I've done it.
http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=53567

 

[jceg316]

Like SS says you ideally need to build the starter up gradually from harvested bottle. I use 5 step up when I've done it.
http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=53567

I imagine this will lead the the best results with the healthiest yeast, yet it is possible to make a perfectly good starter with 2 steps like this, and from my research on the subject I decided to do 2 steps from a bottle. It should still work (it has done for me previously) and looking at the effort to do a 5 step compared to the benefits, for me I'd rather stick with 2 steps.

Having said that I might just have to eat my words. The US-05 starter smells nice and yeasty whereas the Fuller's starter smells of beer which has been left out for a few days.

I would have used the yeast from 2 bottles but there was only one left in the shop. I'm thinking I'll make a starter for the S-04.

 

[MyQul]

I imagine this will lead the the best results with the healthiest yeast, yet it is possible to make a perfectly good starter with 2 steps like this, and from my research on the subject I decided to do 2 steps from a bottle. It should still work (it has done for me previously) and looking at the effort to do a 5 step compared to the benefits, for me I'd rather stick with 2 steps.

Having said that I might just have to eat my words. The US-05 starter smells nice and yeasty whereas the Fuller's starter smells of beer which has been left out for a few days.

I would have used the yeast from 2 bottles but there was only one left in the shop. I'm thinking I'll make a starter for the S-04.

As you've surmised doing only two step ups stresses the yeast causing off flavours. yeast cells not in the best state of health, etc. That's probably why the fullers starter is smelling funky. I definately wouldn't pitch it if it smells odd

 

[jceg316]

Damn. Will have to throw it away and use S04. Was hoping to get some good English yeast.

 

[MyQul]

If you spend the time and effort to step up a bottle culture slowly once it reaches a pitchable amout, using techniques, like over building you can uses it absolutely loads of times

 

[JapanBrew]

Just think of it as a brew. It takes time to ferment and time to condition. I love building up yeast. It so satisfying to see it grow. And like MyQul said, ounce you got a good amount you can use it a bunch of times.

 

[jceg316]

I chucked out the Fuller's starter in the end.

I have about 800ml of US-05 starter left and have put it in the Fridge. Am thinking of using it this weekend, would it last that long or should I make another starter for it? Also what sort of gravity could I use that up to? I have a few recipes in need of US-05 varying in O.G.